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Front drive shaft broken

TCMColorado said:
And by high angle CV at the pinion end I was specifically referring to a high angle Rzeppa style joint, assuming it can be built with a stronger more high angle version than the OEM Rzeppa. A single cardan joint is not possible on the pinion end as it can not be properly aligned without unacceptable changes to the caster angle.
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Yes, Rzeppa. But I'm not convinced the factory size or angle capacity is a problem at the diff. We will certainly sort that out though.

The Tcase joint seemingly fails due to a failed boot and the subsequent release of all its life blood. Once the grease is gone the joint starts to fail rapidly. That said, I have yet to see where the joint fully failed except for one guy whose C-clip on the joint failed.
 
When I looked at it look like the same as one Spicer make in China,note this is from the Teraflex kit, to get more angle the outer flange would need to be widen and shorten or angled outward currently it is vertical outer wall currently. . Note these are just stamped steel with rubber inner pressed in. If you craw under your other cars you see the same joint being used on them for drive line aka BMW, Audi, VW, and lot more.
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The OEM/Terraflex Rzeppa joints seem to be a pretty standard model used across many vehicle platforms. U-joints used in cardan setups are available in multiple variations depending on the strength and angle of operation required. Usual models for off road applications are 1310, 1330, 1350 and 1410 in order of increasing strength and size. My experience with Rzeppa joints is limited and I do not know if mutiple variations with different strengths are commonly available for drive shaft applications. But as Dokatd has mentioned it might not be necessary to change the Rzeppa at the pinion end as the failures are happening at the transfercase hence the use of a double cardan joint to replace the Rzeppa at that end. An open question is what size u-joint should be used in the double cardan at the TC. Tom Woods will be able to provide the necessary input to determine the correct size. A 1310 joint is probably sufficient but stepping up to a 1350 would provide an extra margin of capacity assuming it can allow for the required angle of operation.
 
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TCMColorado said:
The OEM/Terraflex Rzeppa joints seem to be a pretty standard model used across many vehicle platforms. U-joints used in cardan setups are available in multiple variations depending on the strength and angle of operation required. Usual models for off road applications are 1310, 1330, 1350 and 1410 in order of increasing strength and size. My experience with Rzeppa joints is limited and I do not know if mutiple variations with different strengths are commonly available for drive shaft applications. But as Dokatd has mentioned it might not be necessary to change the Rzeppa at the pinion end as the failures are happening at the transfercase hence the use of a double cardan joint to replace the Rzeppa at that end. An open question is what size u-joint should be used in the double cardan at the TC. Tom Woods will be able to provide the necessary input to determine the correct size. A 1310 joint is probably sufficient but stepping up to a 1350 would provide an extra margin of capacity assuming it can allow for the required angle of operation.
Click to expand...

My concern with going to a DC at the transfer case is that the DC is likely longer than the Rzeppa. This will have the side effect of increasing the angle of shaft at the pinion end. Is it possible to drop the transfer case mount by an inch?
 
If true higher operating angle Rzeppa joints even exist and can be spec’d with bigger internal bearings and longer races allowing more angle/flex combined with a larger diameter/revised boot opening I’d much rather stick with Rzeppa’s at both ends for a smoother ride.

Not saying some combination of Rzeppa or double cardan can’t be made to work but the more straightforward a replacement is the better. Certainly willing to see what can be developed assuming it’s fully tested/verified and runs as smooth as OEM… fingers crossed.
 
I'm interested in what Tom comes up with, please add me to the list.
 
TCMColorado said:
The OEM/Terraflex Rzeppa joints seem to be a pretty standard model used across many vehicle platforms. U-joints used in cardan setups are available in multiple variations depending on the strength and angle of operation required. Usual models for off road applications are 1310, 1330, 1350 and 1410 in order of increasing strength and size. My experience with Rzeppa joints is limited and I do not know if mutiple variations with different strengths are commonly available for drive shaft applications. But as Dokatd has mentioned it might not be necessary to change the Rzeppa at the pinion end as the failures are happening at the transfercase hence the use of a double cardan joint to replace the Rzeppa at that end. An open question is what size u-joint should be used in the double cardan at the TC. Tom Woods will be able to provide the necessary input to determine the correct size. A 1310 joint is probably sufficient but stepping up to a 1350 would provide an extra margin of capacity assuming it can allow for the required angle of operation.
Click to expand...
1310 is more than big enough. It's also much lower mass and I believe has a slightly higher operating angle in stock form. But yes 1350's are being considered. The stock Discovery Series II Double Cardan front shaft was a 1310 IIRCC.
 
Add me, I found out today in the Rocky AZ landscape I need just a couple more inches and am looking into that now.
 
Tazzieman said:
Note to everyone : check your roadside assist small print, and insurance small print.
It's a costly exercise if you are stranded remote (easy to be "remote" even after short journeys in places like Tasmania)
And of course , it's an island here - and if you miss the big ferry because of delays, it's going to be awkward to say the least.
As I've said before , imagine the worst case scenario...and double it.
Then you can prepare the trip.
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Hi Tazzieman, hope your troubles are all sorted? Question? What was the failure and did it get fixed under warranty? Was it the drive shaft or transfer box? How may km's had you done and did you have an Eibach lift kit added? I have one of the first QM's in Australia (May 2024 delivery) and my drive shaft has just failed just on 24k's and I had a 35mm Eibach lift kit done on it. Mine just went 'pop' doing a basic 4WD course on forest fire trails. I'm trying to see how many others have failed and if they were repaired under Warranty.

Tazzieman said:
Note to everyone : check your roadside assist small print, and insurance small print.
It's a costly exercise if you are stranded remote (easy to be "remote" even after short journeys in places like Tasmania)
And of course , it's an island here - and if you miss the big ferry because of delays, it's going to be awkward to say the least.
As I've said before , imagine the worst case scenario...and double it.
Then you can prepare the trip.
Click to expand...
 
GavinD said:
I think I had a similar/same issue yesterday (Sunday) in the hunter valley NSW, doing around 30-40km/hr on a dirt road, massive bang and turning thudding noise. My Ineos did have the transfer case recall and it was replaced at 15k service. Tow truck to Gosford dealer, waiting to see what they say.
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Hi Gav, Swampy here from Sydney. Hope all your troubles got sorted. Question(s). Did they find the cause of the bang and thudding? Did it get repaired under warranty? Last question? Did you have a lift kit done? My QM has also failed on 6/12/24 doing a 4WD Basic training course at Lithgow. Same thing. A bang and thudding. Its in with Dealer to be 'decided if a warranty claim".
 
NQ94 said:
What is common all the failures have been at the transfer case cv joint. Possibly not a direct drive shaft or cv fault but a driveline angle issue that is compounded by normal movements of the engine and transmission mounting and front axle. The other issue is the slip joint is not free enough or binding in one location causing excessive load on the retaining circlip in the CV every time the prop shaft extends.
Click to expand...
Heh there NQ94 thanks for your feedback on the drive shaft failures on the IG's. Your feedback sounds like you have a bit more depth technical knowledge on this problem.? Can you share? My QM drive shaft and rear sway bar went 'kaput' on 6/12/24 in Lithgow State forest and I'm researching how common this fault is. "CrazyOldMan" in Jersey USA has a Youtube on double cardan solution learnt from similar issue with Jeeps. Thanks and Merry Christmas. Safe travels. Swamps
 
Zimm said:
Well, to be frank, the czech pilsner is the best, not a lager. I think Yeungling smells weird. It comes freshly skunked. I drink modello, pacifico, and czechvar.
Click to expand...
LOL!!! Way toooo much culture for us Aussies. . . we just want ours freezing cold...
 
Shopkeep said:
There are three quite serious but distinct issues being discussed here, it would be great if they could be split off into separate topics so we can track what may be an emerging global warranty or design issue for Ineos:
1) Front drive shaft failure on unmodified vehicles where it is clearly a warranty and / or design issue.
2) Front drive shaft boot and / or connection failure on lifted or modified vehicles not warranty related.
3) Some kind of Fargo style US Mid-West vs North-East beer discussion, no design issue to see here.
Click to expand...
Nailed the discussion points perfectly :D
 
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