New Defender vs Ineos Grenadier

[lightning]

Well, there's a famous Youtube video of a Defender rolling five times at high speed after being sideswiped on a US freeway.

The completely standard specification Defender crossed the freeway divide while rolling over and came to rest (fortunately on its wheels) on the other carriageway.

The occupants walked away with minor cuts and bruises.

That's good enough for me.

 

[lightning]

View: https://youtu.be/Ghjv3oqYHH4

 

[Logsplitter]

View: https://youtu.be/Ghjv3oqYHH4

I see no one rushed to help get the occupants out. Too busy filming

 

[Krabby]

I see no one rushed to help get the occupants out. Too busy filming

That's a sad reality that has become normalized.

 

[Wayneos]

I see no one rushed to help get the occupants out. Too busy filming

That entire clip was 39 sec long, the last 10 were cars most likely checking they weren’t going to be the next victim by being hit up the arse by someone not paying attention.
If everyone got out and started filming then I’d call them out.

 

[lightning]

lt might not be the best thing to jump out of your car on the freeway and cross over to the other side, as you may become another casualty?
lt only takes one driver going too fast or not looking.

However l must say l would probably have still done it.

 

[CryHavoc]

I see no one rushed to help get the occupants out. Too busy filming

The "filming" was via a dashcam. The driver (and others) likely took a bit of time to ensure they could safely get to the shoulder, avoid debris, collect themselves, and may have even been calling 911. While, sadly, this is a society that prefers clicks and followers above action I don't think that's a fair assumption here.

 

[ChasingOurTrunks]

Mods help Fake plastic spare wheel also
"In came a full roll cage and an FIA-approved fuel-cell. Sticking with the rally theme, Morrison insisted that the Defender also be fitted with a hydraulic handbrake to add extra agility in the heat of battle and cope with holding it on a 65-degree incline for hours at a time.

After scouting the Scottish mountain, the stunt team also asked Land Rover to add a steel panel for the roof to give the driver added protection against the threat of a tree stumps penetrating the Land Rover’s interior during rollover. Finally, thicker aluminium bash plates lie beneath to give the Defender X even more protection."

Interesting though not surprising — Those modifications make sense to me from a stuntman safety perspective. I wonder how much they had an impact on the final result — there was probably also some movie magic too. But overall, if I’m ever on holiday and a british spy steals the secret documents that I have been entrusted with for some reason, I can chase him down the mountain at a brisk enough pace (maybe skipping the jumps - my evil overlord doesn’t provide frequent flyer miles except for with official carriers) and my kid will walk away once we get him and get the documents back. Because…we’d win right? The henchmen always win in this situation, don’t they?

Oh no.

 

[ChasingOurTrunks]

I find it interesting that we are comparing two totally different vehicles...but can you compare identical twins?

Depends. Is one of them your romantic partner? Because if is…you can compare but that seems high stakes.

Jokes aside there really is no “twin” for the Gren. There are rigs that will do a similar kind of thing — the ND coming the closest on paper (payload, wading, etc.) but as mentioned with a totally different design philosophy.

The others that I would consider — say Jeep or a decent 4x4 mid size truck — will do the same kind of thing, but the question is for how long and how many times?

All these vehicles will do some of the toughest trails in the world. Some might need the odd maxtrax or winch assist in tougher sections but they will get it done. The Gren seems to be designed to do it 1,000 times and come back for more. The New Defender is like a cat — it seems moody and whether it will do it or not depends on how it feels that day, and it may say “I want in” and immediately say “I want out”, maybe 6 times on the same trail. But, if you get a good one, it’ll be a great companion on say 800 runs of that trail - as I said, it seems well engineered technically but with the wrong design ethos for this kind of thing. The “Lifestyle” class of rigs (Jeep, Mid size trucks) will do it reliably but might only do it 200 or 300 times.

But for the buyer who realistically is only doing that trail 150 times, there are options — not twins — but options that can be reasonably compared.

Edit: Speaking from an NA perspective here - there may be other comparable that fit elsewhere, but I still think even throwing the 70 series or Hilux into the mix, the Gren still doesn’t have a twin. Just cousins who have a genetic link.

 

[ADVAW8S]

I know I am not keeping with the Defender comparison but I had a opportunity to drive a 2022 4runner for work. It was a rent a car and only did highway miles. In the short time in the Truck, my conclusion....it sucked. People talking about they are the same are insane in membrane. Now I haven't done road miles so my comparison is the inside. The inside was cheap plastic. The seats were uncomfortable front and back. Yes I was in my suit sitting in the back to see. I did notice that it came with a 400w inverter. It reinforces that the premium you pay for the IG results in a better vehicle. My two cents.

 

[lightning]

Surely a more direct competitor to the Grenadier is the LWB Jeep Wrangler.

l've never driven a Jeep but l did nearly buy a Sahara LWB during lockdown.

How does the Wrangler compare to the Grenadier. There must be someone on here who has traded their Jeep for a Grenadier or at least driven both.

 

[Cheshire cat]

Surely a more direct competitor to the Grenadier is the LWB Jeep Wrangler.

l've never driven a Jeep but l did nearly buy a Sahara LWB during lockdown.

How does the Wrangler compare to the Grenadier. There must be someone on here who has traded their Jeep for a Grenadier or at least driven both.

Reading some feedback, it seems the Grenadier leaves the Jeep well behind in the quality stakes. Off road I expect the Jeep is still the ultimate rock crawler. My cousin who lives in Texas tells me the quality in his wife's new Jeep Wrangler leaves a lot to be desired.

 

[Max]

Edit: Speaking from an NA perspective here - there may be other comparable that fit elsewhere, but I still think even throwing the 70 series or Hilux into the mix, the Gren still doesn’t have a twin. Just cousins who have a genetic link.

Ineos Grenadier is breeding cousins... the Trial Master and the Field Master...not comparable in my mind...I honestly think that the closest comparison would be having whatever vehicles doing exactly the same trip/track at the same time with the same gear/weight, tyres and pressures, same size engines and type, diesel or petrol...once the dust is settled and the 4x4 mags get there hands on the Gren Trial Master it will be interesting to see what they put it up against...we have seen it all before, well most of us and I will be driving and still driving my original Trial Master when they start to compare the new models in the series...hopefully driving the B57 in the next month or so.

 

[globalgregors]

Ineos Grenadier is breeding cousins... the Trial Master and the Field Master...not comparable in my mind...I honestly think that the closest comparison would be having whatever vehicles doing exactly the same trip/track at the same time with the same gear/weight, tyres and pressures, same size engines and type, diesel or petrol...once the dust is settled and the 4x4 mags get there hands on the Gren Trial Master it will be interesting to see what they put it up against...we have seen it all before, well most of us and I will be driving and still driving my original Trial Master when they start to compare the new models in the series...hopefully driving the B57 in the next month or so.

Yeah, exactly. Most of these comparisons I think pose the vehicle as a product to be consumed (and by implication quickly discarded) by a user base seeking novel experiences (new widgets, finishes, cosmetic updates etc).
Hence we see copy dedicated to comparing the infotainment screens in the Gren and the Ranger Raptor etc rather than asking the sort of non-consumerist questions on my mind (eg, "Could I keep a Raptor for 20 years?"), which lead to more interesting conclusions around Total Cost of Ownership and clarity around what ownership means in real terms.

 

[Max]

Yeah, exactly. Most of these comparisons I think pose the vehicle as a product to be consumed (and by implication quickly discarded) by a user base seeking novel experiences (new widgets, finishes, cosmetic updates etc).

Agree, has someone compared the JLR psyche of the new Defender and the Ineos psyche of the old Defender?...well well well, we've arrived here somehow...happy times ahead Grenadiers.

 

[Max]

Now try and compare the JLR psyche of the new Defender and the Ineos psyche of the Grenadier... a hard task to find any similarity.

 

[Sam]

Hi Mr Optional.
Thanks for your thoughts which are well laid out although I have to say, still a little confusing. Should you not just buy what you desire / Afford / Need?' Surely there is nothing more to it than that.

+1

 

[lightning]

Well, l am willing to bet your new Grenadiers will still be sat on the drive loved and doing good service in 20 years time.

As for the new Defender (and don't forget own one) l think most will have been scrapped, or will be languishing on someone's drive having been bought for £1,000 with various insurmountable issues.

 

[lightning]

Can't seem to edit posts on this forum?

Above should read "and don't forget l own one"

 

[Cheshire cat]

Look for the three little dots on your post. Click on them and there should be an option to edit.