how is it that you do seem negative about the vehicle and Ineos? I mean you were in the pub when Sir. James (you even call him JR as you may know him well enough to do so, heck I messed up and called him Sir. James above as it was late in the night and I
I call him JR when writing, as this is easier. I do not know him personally (beside a small chat) or drank a beer with him. No....
I must leave it up to you and your thoughts when you (and others) see my posts as negative. I can't answer that. From my perspective I write what I see, know and when I assume something, I write my assumption and call it that way. Why that sounds negative? Maybe there are negative things, maybe don't. I don't know. At least my predictions where not terribly wrong. I leave that up to your thoughts. Do I have to be positive? No. Why? To please you? I wrote some positive things about the Grenadier and Ineos. When I think something is positive, than I do write it. Search and you find that statements. Not all is negative, but for me, personally, looking at the whole progress of that project, it is more of a disappointment than vice versa. The change of the vehicle itself, from its first intended type to what it is today (don't get me wrong, that is my personal disappointment. I do not pay the show so I have nothing to claim. But I can rate it for me). I'm disappointed how Ineos acts (also against you, the paying customer and others). I can look at the car, isolated, and it is easily to find many good things. And bad ones. But when I open up the scope and look at the whole show, it seems to me, that the ones which drive the project are the customers and some dealers which put a lot of effort, money and engagement into that. But I do not see Ineos as a whole company (only individuals).
I give you an example:
The first year when Ineos was at the Abenteuer&Allrad, the biggest 4x4 fair of the world in Bad Kissingen, Germany, they hired some hostess which couldn't answer the questions of the interested people. Why not place some engineers there which transfer their enthusiasm to the people? Which could give insights, talk about fine details, encourage and thrill people, get in touch, be visible and touchable. No, they decided to go with some sleepy bored hostess....They were not prepared but looked good. Most of them. The few Ineos employees on site and all others slept in a hotel instead of getting in touch with the scene when the gates are closed (exhibitors can sleep in their exhibition booth. We had storm, rain, etc. and staying there with the others brings you closer together, you get in touch, learn to know each other and have a good time. That is good for business and to be authentic. You sell an offroad camper? Camp offroad! In the second year, the same. Then, third year, Ineos wasn't there at all and didn't spend demonstration cars for their partners on the exhibition. They used their private owned cars and let people smeared with sunscreen crouch through their private vehicles. Only one Ineos representative was seen there, but he was there as a private person. I know that because I'm an exhibitor there myself for many years, now.
-- Start of my opinion section: --
When I look at the Grenadier, what I see is a dream of one single person, which has become metal and reality. Fine, that must not be bad. But to be a car manufacturer you need to take so many other things into account and I don't see that. There are examples, examples which made the car more and more expensive...without the absolutely need to do that. I agree on this point with ASPW, the car had should start as a basic one, giving people the ability to modify and upgrade it. Some upgrades may have been offered by Ineos themself. Doing it that way around you can start small and cheap (= more sales). Who wants to have a higher class, has to spend more money, either to Ineos or the aftermarket. That is also what I told Ineos.
Why has Ineos taken the task to fit a winch or a double-battery system? At least the latter didn't work out well and the first is nothing more than a burden. That was a tactical bad decision. Now Ineos has to buy the parts, stock them, put them in, create a production process for that, create dependencies, maintain that, repair that (also under warranty), write manuals...all that. That makes things more complicated and more expensive. Why not leave that for the aftermarket. There are tons of companies offering parts for that, mounting that and if it fails, Ineos is not blamed. No, Ineos decided to do that on their own and now they are beaten for that. Why this toot-horn? Does it anything useful everybody has looked for other than increasing complexity? Take the front and rear door rails. After 17 years in 4x4 I'll never ever saw such rails on any car at any fair, meeting, club meeting or while travelling. If anyone thought that is useful, at least some people would have mounted rails on their doors. But "one" person simply wanted to have that. My explanation is that, that JR wanted to have a tough "expedition-ready" look and that fits to his imagination of a romantic camp at the foot of the Kilimandscharo (while he sleeps in his very own hotels, when he is travelling). And it just adds cost, adds a dependency again, adds a weak point in the body, needs maintenance and if not done well (discolouration issue and dirt collector) only leads to trouble without adding a real value. It is a gimmick, not more. Why that and why in the beginning?
The essence of the whole is fraught with distracting details.
Take the headlights. You either have ECE or SAE lights with the Grenadier. Why not using an ECE/SAE light, like others do. Less spare parts, easier supply of headlights, easier replacement, easier supply chains, easier ordering process, easier handling and production for the supplier....and therefore...cheaper. Experts advised them, but they ignored them. To come back to the beginning of that section, the car was not created under the entitlement of a business model: first, keep costs low, enter the market, create a big customer base, step up, refine things, maybe split into two lines (like Toyota did with the Land Cruiser) a simple and a luxury one. Add models etc. And all backed up by a steady flow of money, due to a low entry model. It seems to be the car one person wanted to have and now it is expected that all people love it (in addition at a time where cars are in the defensive, restrictions get more and more tough and for Europe, it gets tight for 4x4's so the market decreases).
I see Ineos captured between the costs of running a full size car company with a car at a price where the luxury segment starts without offering that luxury while having the sales numbers of a small car manufacturer with a very special niche car (have you ever entered a BMW X5 or a G or a Land Cruiser? Close the door and it is quiet and it stays this way. Not in the Grenadier. We 4x4's love it or accept it...but the rest?).
Normally such special niche cars are part of a bigger company (like Bugatti) or these are very small manufacturers with around 50 to 100 employees (like AC Cars), not 1.500.
-- End of my opinion section --
To answer your question about the capabilities. I absolutely think the very base of the car is the best you could do at the time the car was born. The BMW engine and the ZF drivetrain, great. It seems that the Carraro axles are doing fine, there were nearly no experiences, but it seem that they proof well. Diff locks, also very good. Space, very good. It is great that they took care about rust protection, while others do...nothing.
I wish they would have offered a second engine, a smaller one (again cost driven and because of fleet emissions), but leaving that aside, it is really great! Did you know, that JR didn't want to have a BMW engine in the beginning?
I would have placed the rear doors the other way around, the lock. Open always the bigger one first and if needed the smaller. They looked at Toyota but didn't thought about it themself.
I see some minor issues, like the cooler mounted to deep, but Ineos had no choice and can't change it. Either they get in trouble with BMW or the regulations. The weight, too high. I know, many of you equal weight with ruggedness, but I don't see it that way. Just look at motor sports, weight is your enemy and a downwards facing spiral. You make one thing heavy, so the next think must also be heavy to cope with it. With fine engineering and modern materials you can build such rugged cars at minimum weight...thereby having better emission values, handling (except towing) and load capabilites. I also don't like the overhead switches, too playful, again an example of what "JR" considered as "cool" but not thinking about practically or safety.
I wrote it somewhere else....I could not find anything in the Grenadier what it makes better than other, cheaper vehicles. If I ever have to buy a new car of that kind it would be a Land Cruiser (looking at the market today). If the Grenadier would have been cheaper, it would have been my choice, after the third or fourth year of production. But believe me, actually I have no capabilities to absorb another car...we have 4x4 wheels for every purpose, So I can simply stay tuned....
AWo
I joke I joke I kid I kid. People claim I type too much, but I bow to you sir!! There are a lot of people on here that vouch for you and it seems your liked, but I am the most straight honest shooter you will ever meet and I say what I think, me personally. I don’t hold back from MY thoughts/opinions. This has got me in trouble in the past especially in the military when I was sent to do things I did not agree with so voiced my opinion and almost got an article 15 more than once (for non USA or non military people that’s not good), also in the civilian sector when supervisors and I didn’t agree and my opinions should of been held in, but I’m just not built that way, my opinions almost got me fired also more than once. See the trend? Btw, I still always did what I was told to do, I just voice my opinions if I didn’t agree before doing it. Maybe stupid, but that’s just how I have always been. So on here I am not trying to pick a fight or argue with anyone (even the guys I think have fake accounts and just come on here to post negative stuff, not you btw you already made it very clear your part in this build), I am just saying what I believe or my opinions. So saying all that, you do kind of say some positive things about the Grenadier, but to me it’s like a backhanded compliment as then you go on again bashing the vehicle and the different areas they should improve. I also agree they should of offered more than the one gas and one diesel engines, I want me a v8!! I’m an American, we love more power. 
. Anattention-seeker. A narcissist. Look at his profile pic. His scarf. Some stuff he gets right. Some not. That'll happen when you share ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING. He doesn't like the price. But he wants it to weigh less. Sure.
