What did you do with your Grenadier today?

[Dual Grenny Guy]

I don’t know if this is the right place to post this and if it is not, then admin please place wherever it needs to be. I just picked this thread as it’s one of the most followed and posted to that I know of.

Also, please do not get mad at the messenger. Some of you know me as a HUGE champion for this vehicle. I own two and waiting for the Quartermaster to come out to the USA to make it 3. I also just had a huge custom neon sign made to match my 1st Grenny that’s customized/modded out. So for me to type this post up is hard to do as much as I defend and love this vehicle. However, I am also 100% authentic and tell the truth and IF I am wrong on an issue we are debating, which would be very rare (I joke I joke I kid I kid), I will say I am wrong.

Ok enough with the prep talk! I am also not a patient man. So I have been contacting my dealership thru different contacts as well as another and even Ineos HQ. Finally I got an email from Ineos themselves stating if I had technical questions, to contact their tech team via 833-494-4748 (write down/save this number). Thus, just did so and s/w a very pleasant Mrs. Rossella. Here are the highlights, and make sure you’re sitting down as it may hurt you like it did me:

#1–there is NO software updates coming from Ineos to permanently disable the speed warning. Those are rumors from owners/dealers/etc she advised as Ineos cannot (or will not? ) remove that permanently as it is a safety issue. So we will have to continue to be bothered by the pesky sound, but honestly once you save the feature to your favs it’s literally two clicks less than 15seconds of work. Yes I 1000% agree we should be able to permanently disable, but that’s not coming from Ineos. I’ll keep my fingers crossed that one of the tune companies or the ones that you can plug into your OBD port and turn on/off functions like I can on my Tundra and BMW, will come out with one for the Grenadier. Have to keep your hopes up, right?!
#2-same thing goes for the service warning light. No plans to change it from only dealer can reset. Yes explained to her MANY owners like myself are hours away and have been told by the dealerships if we do the normal servicing on our own or with another shop and keep all receipts our warranty is still intact. She even confirmed that Ineos is aware of all of this, but that the reset warning will remain with the dealer for now (possible future change she couldn’t say).

So for #1 & #2 this will explain why we haven’t got any new software updates to eliminate those “issues”, as there is not one coming for those items. I knew I could of asked more, but just got hit in the face with bad news for the 1st time with my favorite vehicle of all time and if they fixed those issues I may have never bought another different brand car from here on out……well ok let’s not go too crazy!!! …by the way not done yet as we did talk for a while.

#3-they ARE working on a service manuals for owners/shops, finally some good news, then the bad….still no time frame on completion. Yes I agree this should have been made and available to all owners upon purchase. Let’s just hope it’s more sooner than later.

#4-service/repair centers nationwide is something she could not give me any info on, which surprised me a little bit. So are they not working on these or are deals being made that the technical staff aren’t aware of?

Anyone on here can do the exact same thing I did and call the number above. Then ask for their technical team. Maybe if they get enough calls and complaints about these issues and whatever else that needs to be brought up, then maybe things change?

Can’t believe this is my very first “negative” post on the Grenadier. I still love them and they are still my fav rides, but it’s like when you found out that your parents were actually Santa Clause. You still wanted the gifts but had a different view on how it all played out. Even with this little set back, I am still a “Grenadier Lifer”!

 

[anand]

#1–there is NO software updates coming from Ineos to permanently disable to speed warning. Those are rumors from owners/dealers/etc she advised as Ineos cannot (or will not? ) remove that permanently as it is a safety issue. So we will have to continue to be bothered by the pesky sound, but honestly once you save the feature to your favs it’s literally two clicks less than 15seconds of work. Yes I 1000% agree we should be able to permanently disable, but that’s not coming from Ineos. I’ll keep my fingers crossed that one of the tune companies or the ones that you can plug into your OBD port and turn on/off functions like I can on my Tundra and BMW, will come out with one for the Grenadier. Have to keep your hopes up, right?!
#2-same thing goes for the service warning light. No plans to change it from only dealer can reset. Yes explained to her MANY owners like myself are hours away and have been told by the dealerships if we do the normal servicing on our own or with another shop and keep all receipts our warranty is still intact. She even confirmed that Ineos is aware of all of this, but that the reset warning will remain with the dealer for now (possible future change she couldn’t say).

#3-they ARE working on a service manuals for owners/shops, finally some good news, then the bad….still no time frame on completion. Yes I agree this should have been made and available to all owners upon purchase. Let’s just hope it’s more sooner than later.

#4-service/repair centers nationwide is something she could not give me any info on, which surprised me a little bit. So are they not working on these or are deals being made that the technical staff aren’t aware of?

FWIW, you didn't actually speak to a technical team member, you spoke with a person responsible for fielding phone calls from the public. There is no direct line to the technical team for the lay person (as with all manufacturers), as those are not people intended to interface with customers.

These are the same things I've been saying since early Summer, but people always want to believe their dealers instead. As far as changing ADAS implementation, go over to the LC250 forums, plenty of people absolutely hate how their ADAS (SafetySense) works, and people complain about it, but no one is expecting or asking Toyota to change it, that's just how it is. Likewise, ADAS in the Grenadier works as intended by the manufacturer; is it annoying? Partially. But that's the way all vehicles will be required to operate in the coming years.

Service reset, again, it's working as intended, albeit less than ideal for those doing their own service. One easy fix is to have the dealer clear it and set the interval to much longer (I'm 97% sure there is a custom interval available) and not have to worry about it.

We all bought these vehicles knowing dealers would be hundreds of miles away, and with that purchase acknowledged the annoyances associated. On the plus side, the dealer network is expected to double between Nov 2023 and Nov 2025.

No independent service centers are in the works that I have heard any rumblings about, just the dealer network.

With that being said, they aren't going to announce dealer locations or markets until they are ready to go and open; especially not after the debacle with Kuhn in NorCal last year

 

[Dual Grenny Guy]

FWIW, you didn't actually speak to a technical team member, you spoke with a person responsible for fielding phone calls from the public. There is no direct line to the technical team for the lay person (as with all manufacturers), as those are not people intended to interface with customers.

These are the same things I've been saying since early Summer, but people always want to believe their dealers instead. As far as changing ADAS implementation, go over to the LC250 forums, plenty of people absolutely hate how their ADAS (SafetySense) works, and people complain about it, but no one is expecting or asking Toyota to change it, that's just how it is. Likewise, ADAS in the Grenadier works as intended by the manufacturer; is it annoying? Partially. But that's the way all vehicles will be required to operate in the coming years.

Service reset, again, it's working as intended, albeit less than ideal for those doing their own service. One easy fix is to have the dealer clear it and set the interval to much longer (I'm 97% sure there is a custom interval available) and not have to worry about it.

We all bought these vehicles knowing dealers would be hundreds of miles away, and with that purchase acknowledged the annoyances associated. On the plus side, the dealer network is expected to double between Nov 2023 and Nov 2025.

No independent service centers are in the works that I have heard any rumblings about, just the dealer network.

With that being said, they aren't going to announce dealer locations or markets until they are ready to go and open; especially not after the debacle with Kuhn in NorCal last year

I really would love a dealership in Louisiana (Baton Rouge and New Orleans are huge car markets), so will keep the ole fingers crossed.

Btw, I guess she lied to me as she clearly answered when the call went to her “Hello this is Mrs. Rossella with the technical team how can I help you”. maybe one of you really smart guys on here can call her up and ask her some real tech questions to see if she really is (I’m not smart enough for that, see I’m honest ).

I also agree we all purchased these vehicles with the known sound/ADAS issues, but to be fair and again coming from a huge pro Grenadier guy, many dealers are telling buyers about future software updates coming down the road to fix some of that, which now we know is not happening. So that could have affected some people buying, not me I was all in and still am btw. This was just a little bump in the road. Luckily the Grenny’s are built just that thing (bumps,trails, rocks).

 

[CRH]

I really would love a dealership in Louisiana (Baton Rouge and New Orleans are huge car markets), so will keep the ole fingers crossed.

Btw, I guess she lied to me as she clearly answered when the call went to her “Hello this is Mrs. Rossella with the technical team how can I help you”. maybe one of you really smart guys on here can call her up and ask her some teal tech questions to see if she really is (I’m not smart enough for that, see I’m honest ).

I also agree we all purchased these vehicles with the known sound/ADAS issues, but to be fair and again coming from a huge pro Grenadier guy, many dealers are telling buyers about future software updates coming down the road to fix some of that, which now we know is not happening. So that could have affected some people buying, not me I was all in and still am btw. This was just a little bump in the road. Luckily the Grenny’s are built just that thing (bumps,trails, rocks).

Sounds like sales people trying to get a sale by suggesting something that won't happen but 'possibly could' and in doing so is causing more grief for the brand than is deserved.

 

[landmannnn]

Hello this is Mrs. Rossella with the technical team

Note the very specific wording using the word "with".
It can have several interpretations.

 

[Dual Grenny Guy]

Note the very specific wording using the word "with".
It can have several interpretations.

Ok now I have to ask, are we splitting hairs over if she is an actual tech person or not? She is a person answering the Ineos HQ tech service line and answering technical questions on Ineos’ behalf. So I would assume what she is telling me is coming from Ineos tech directly.

Again, I posted the phone number for ANY of you to also call and see if you can get any different facts. Post what you find out!

 

[CrazyOldMan]

Ok now I have to ask, are we splitting hairs over if she is an actual tech person or not? She is a person answering the Ineos HQ tech service line and answering technical questions on Ineos’ behalf. So I would assume what she is telling me is coming from Ineos tech directly.

Again, I posted the phone number for ANY of you to also call and see if you can get any different facts. Post what you find out!

I run customer service and support for a global MedTech company. There are usually at least 2-3 tiers of tech support rep, and that’s BEFORE you get to R&D ops. So no, she wasn’t misleading in her statement, and yes, The Professor (@anand) is correct - you weren’t talking to someone who could really give you a definitive answer on future development (like service manual timelines, software development in the pipeline, etc). She has more knowledge than a sales rep, but could only make representations that were “in the script parameters.”

Lastly, on the service network, at least in the US - what would that even be? There are no national service chains other than places like JiffyLube, Discount Tire, etc. Nothing beyond very basic maintenance. So there are ONLY options like opening the software for resets, publishing a service manual for independent mechanics (who would need to be BMW specialists), negotiating a deal with BMW dealers, and expanding the Ineos dealer network. There isn’t really anything else out there - captive dealers, BMW dealers, and independents.

 

[landmannnn]

I run customer service and support for a global MedTech company. There are usually at least 2-3 tiers of tech support rep, and that’s BEFORE you get to R&D ops. So no, she wasn’t misleading in her statement, and yes, The Professor (@anand) is correct - you weren’t talking to someone who could really give you a definitive answer on future development (like service manual timelines, software development in the pipeline, etc). She has more knowledge than a sales rep, but could only make representations that were “in the script parameters.”

Lastly, on the service network, at least in the US - what would that even be? There are no national service chains other than places like JiffyLube, Discount Tire, etc. Nothing beyond very basic maintenance. So there are ONLY options like opening the software for resets, publishing a service manual for independent mechanics (who would need to be BMW specialists), negotiating a deal with BMW dealers, and expanding the Ineos dealer network. There isn’t really anything else out there - captive dealers, BMW dealers, and independents.

Spot on. I don't know about the US, but here the call centres are almost invariably subcontracted out to one or more third parties.

The operatives are nearly always trained on a number of products, so the person answering the call may be talking about Ineos one minute and Canon cameras the next. Responses are scripted. Pharma may be different.

 

[Tazzieman]

Maybe you should do something to your Grenadier today to take your mind off it?

 

[CrazyOldMan]

Maybe you should do something to your Grenadier today to take your mind off it?

Wallabies

 

[Tazzieman]

Wallabies

Are everywhere. Thus a bullbar is an excellent investment. And portable power washer. There would be nothing worse than arriving at the golf club with blood spattered all over the grille.

 

[CrazyOldMan]

Are everywhere. Thus a bullbar is an excellent investment. And portable power washer. There would be nothing worse than arriving at the golf club with blood spattered all over the grille.

 

[Tazzieman]

View attachment 7877356

I don't have the posh sound system!

 

[CrazyOldMan]

I don't have the posh sound system!

You just made me laugh coffee out of my nose, you damn Aussie

 

[FlyersFan76]

Wallabies

 

[pmatusov]

Are everywhere. Thus a bullbar is an excellent investment. And portable power washer. There would be nothing worse than arriving at the golf club with blood spattered all over the grille.

The first statement is locale-specific, the rest - universal.

 

[Dual Grenny Guy]

I think I’m going bonkers over here as I wasn’t arguing with you super smart posters, which there sure are a lot of on here! I don’t have the intellect to sustain that type of conversation with you smarties. What I was saying was does it matter if she is an actual tech or the 10th person down the line given a script. She is representing the company and answering questions based on what she was trained and given info on. So if she is saying there are not working on a permanent fix for the speed warning, then ok 10 employees back a real tech guy may be working on it. If that’s the scenario, how long do you think it’s gonna even hit us owners? Realistically years! She knew of the issue as she even was trying to explain the short cut route to save to favorites and would only be two steps away to turn off, which I thanked her for but advised I had already done that. She also knew about people complaining on just hitting the auto stop button once per start up to stop that. To me she was actually very knowledgeable for a customer service rep. So when she says they (Ineos) are aware of the issues and owners wanting to turn this off permanently, her answer was they can’t do it do to safety issues (I wasn’t smart enough then to ask if this pertains to laws vs different countries etc I was just caught off guard by her candor that they aren’t taking that off permanently). If she is reading from a script, and Ineos know owners are not happy about this particular issue, why not have the script say “we are aware of the problem and looking into a fix”, not “it’s a safety issue and we aren’t making it permanently turn off”. So I have owned my 2 Grenny’s for 6 months, and some of you have owned them for over a year plus, has anyone received an update to turn off the speed warning permanently? If so post about it. I would think after almost 2 years of hearing owners complain about this, if they really wanted to do something they would of by now. Don’t get me wrong I want this fix just as bad as most of you, but now I have just put this to the side as IF it happens it won’t be for some time. Now I do have a “Carisa OBD II” for my Tundra and it turns off the seat belt warnings, can set to roll down all windows together, etc etc all kinds of stuff. Maybe someone that makes these type devices will come up with a plug in to change things on the Grenadier. We shall see. Heck if by a miracle a software update comes out in a couple months by Ineos, I will be the first one to come on here and post/say, well I definitely got the wrong info!! That I would be happy to do. To me sounds like a lot of you are holding out that it’s coming soon. There has to be a member on this forum that actually works in the tech dept and if you are reading this and you haven’t signed an NDA, give us something!!
(I would be curious what people are saying about a product I work on and would be reading this forum, so hopefully one of them speaks up if they can)

 

[Back in Black]

So what I did with with my IG today was get a software update to rid me of Mr. P0461. Also had windshield washer pump replaced. Oh what fun!

 

[Dual Grenny Guy]

I run customer service and support for a global MedTech company. There are usually at least 2-3 tiers of tech support rep, and that’s BEFORE you get to R&D ops. So no, she wasn’t misleading in her statement, and yes, The Professor (@anand) is correct - you weren’t talking to someone who could really give you a definitive answer on future development (like service manual timelines, software development in the pipeline, etc). She has more knowledge than a sales rep, but could only make representations that were “in the script parameters.”

Lastly, on the service network, at least in the US - what would that even be? There are no national service chains other than places like JiffyLube, Discount Tire, etc. Nothing beyond very basic maintenance. So there are ONLY options like opening the software for resets, publishing a service manual for independent mechanics (who would need to be BMW specialists), negotiating a deal with BMW dealers, and expanding the Ineos dealer network. There isn’t really anything else out there - captive dealers, BMW dealers, and independents.

Ok now I know how you got your username……”I run customer service and support for a global MedTech company.”

 

[Max]

Are everywhere. Thus a bullbar is an excellent investment. And portable power washer. There would be nothing worse than arriving at the golf club with blood spattered all over the grille.

My series II Landy has a stainless steel grill/grille and talk about "Built on Purpose" two screws off and over the coals...Wallaby stew...I just might have a chat to our technical advisers and see what is in the pipeline with the Grille upgrades on the Grenadier...happy motoring