Useless Customer Service

[CRH]

Doesn’t seem to affect the oil service warning, all the other warnings are turned all the way down.

that would wind me up then too

 

[Zimm]

Man if it only dinged on startup I’d be totally ok with that. I’d happily live with it. But dinging while you drive. Constant flashing on the screen. Like seriously. What the hell were they thinking.

Wow.... I mean.... You're kinda screwed after reading you situation.

It's NEVER going to be a repair yourself friendly car. So quit dreaming that's a future possibility.

I'd consider dumping it after repairs, and before more issues crop up that require more $$ shipping or time off. It's only going to depreciate. Thats me though. I'm not remorseful about a bad decision and I cut losers off fast.

 

[IslandFalconer]

Wow.... I mean.... You're kinda screwed after reading you situation.

It's NEVER going to be a repair yourself friendly car. So quit dreaming that's a future possibility.

I'd consider dumping it after repairs, and before more issues crop up that require more $$ shipping or time off. It's only going to depreciate. Thats me though. I'm not remorseful about a bad decision and I cut losers off fast.

Not sure what you’re getting at. Give me the manuals for the truck. I don’t need the engine or transmission manuals, I have access to those. And all the tools for them. Grant me access to the can network and software and I’m set. Aside from the bloody oil change dinging stupidity the rest of this truck is pretty straight forward. Some software engineer screwed up big time.

 

[Zimm]

Not sure what you’re getting at. Give me the manuals for the truck. I don’t need the engine or transmission manuals, I have access to those. And all the tools for them. Grant me access to the can network and software and I’m set. Aside from the bloody oil change dinging stupidity the rest of this truck is pretty straight forward. Some software engineer screwed up big time.

What I'm getting at, is it's not likely you're getting that anytime soon, so this difficulty you're having is less likely to be an isolated issue, than a theme. If you choose to ride it out, I think you're going to need a different mindset. I know me, and that level of patience and acceptance, isn't part of my repertoire. What you do have access to, are the two things that no one has a problem with.

 

[IslandFalconer]

What I'm getting at, is it's not likely you're getting that anytime soon, so this difficulty you're having is less likely to be an isolated issue, than a theme. If you choose to ride it out, I think you're going to need a different mindset. I know me, and that level of patience and acceptance, isn't part of my repertoire. What you do have access to, are the two things that no one has a problem with.

Dude I work with Preadator birds, I deal with angry, animals that basically want to kill you daily. The fact that I can speak my frustration does not mean I get emotional about it. I can separate emotion from thoughts. My frustration with this vehicle does not affect me emotionally. Do I think they did stupid things absolutely. Does it make me angry, sure. Does it make me have some sort of vice real reaction to reject the vehicle? No. I’m in contact with Ineos Corporate, we are figuring it out. It’s just dumb that I’m having to do it. I’m certainly not the only one having these issues. So the fact they have not resolved them is surprising. Your inability to cope with such things, and the fact you can openly admit and accept that is cool. Many can’t. I’ll get it sorted. I won’t loose sleep over it. It’s just dumb is all

 

[holdmybeer]

@IslandFalconer you're right to stay productively angry and outspoken about this IMO. These are good and unique vehicles with potentially long service lives and we were sold a bill of goods that IA can still easily deliver on if they make it a priority. Their silence is unprofessional IMO.

Anyways squeaky wheels get grease so if folks are quietly accepting of the deficient self-service situation or if they quietly give up their Grenadier ownership (completely understandable!) then IA can quietly wiggle out of their promises.

 

[Jackattack13]

The warnings and notifications this vehicle makes are a bit overkill. My windshield washer fluid low indicator flashes my entire drive. Like WHY? You told me on startup with a bong noise and a nice light on the dash. NO need to have a message distract me the entire drive.

Oh and I learned a new one last night. If you are driving and someone in the back seat moves to a different seat. The seat belt warning starts dinging for that person to buckle their seat belt. Well, they moved to another seat and buckled up. That alarm will continue dinging until you power cycle the car. So god forbid your little one moves from one window to the other to see something out the window. LOL. I swear these SW engineers did the most minimal user testing ever.

 

[IslandFalconer]

@IslandFalconer you're right to stay productively angry and outspoken about this IMO. These are good and unique vehicles with potentially long service lives and we were sold a bill of goods that IA can still easily deliver on if they make it a priority. Their silence is unprofessional IMO.

Anyways squeaky wheels get grease so if folks are quietly accepting of the deficient self-service situation or if they quietly give up their Grenadier ownership (completely understandable!) then IA can quietly wiggle out of their promises.

Oh for sure, if the bulk of the owners silently accept the lack of customer service, or the lack of living up to their promis. Ineos has no reason to do anything. Some of the general attitudes I’ve seen here certainly show that people are willing to accept serious flaws without really forcing the issue. I can say with near a certainty that if everyone having issues here was contacting The VP in North America, or whatever their countries actual Ineos staff we would be getting further. Sadly it seems only a few of us are actually making noise while everybody else is happy to accept the terrible software, and terrible customer service.

 

[Tazzieman]

Dude I work with Preadator birds, I deal with angry, animals that basically want to kill you daily.

You'd get a job in any corporate human resources dept anywhere in the world.
You're very lucky to work with animals outside. Count your blessings.

 

[IslandFalconer]

You'd get a job in any corporate human resources dept anywhere in the world.
You're very lucky to work with animals outside. Count your blessings.

I avoid dealing with human problems. Animals are easy. Humans not so much. Humans are emotional and can’t think clearly once they become emotional about a problem. Preadator birds are simple.

 

[DaveB]

I avoid dealing with human problems. Animals are easy. Humans not so much. Humans are emotional and can’t think clearly once they become emotional about a problem. Preadator birds are simple.

We have two pairs of Osprey that live and hunt just near our home.
You can see and hear them every day.

 

[Tazzieman]

I avoid dealing with human problems. Animals are easy. Humans not so much. Humans are emotional and can’t think clearly once they become emotional about a problem. Preadator birds are simple.

I agree. That's why I don't have corridor conversations and live in a place where neighbours can barely see each other.
Animals have never frightened me (except attack dogs owned by anxious and aggressive humans).
Humans scare me. In cities and airports I'm always on alert, whether it be traffic or unpredictable H. sapiens .
Raptors live around my place , but are not really tameable , unlike these ones (Aillwee, Ireland , last month)

 

[IslandFalconer]

I agree. That's why I don't have corridor conversations and live in a place where neighbours can barely see each other.
Animals have never frightened me (except attack dogs owned by anxious and aggressive humans).
Humans scare me. In cities and airports I'm always on alert, whether it be traffic or unpredictable H. sapiens .
Raptors live around my place , but are not really tameable , unlike these ones (Aillwee, Ireland , last month)
View attachment 7859912

Nice little male Harris Hawk there. I have a bomb dog at home. Keep in mind there’s a difference between an aggressive/dangerous dog, and a dog trained to be aggressive. They are very different things. I trust my dog with my life. We just did a session yesterday with 21 Military Malinois and Bruce. We had the but suits and battons out. Even my retired dude protected me from that bad man. And it was instant.

 

[Tazzieman]

Dogs by and large are fairly predictable. Unless they have been "entrusted" to a human.
Unless you know that human, it's a bit of a gamble, and I remain wary.

 

[IslandFalconer]

Dogs by and large are fairly predictable. Unless they have been "entrusted" to a human.
Unless you know that human, it's a bit of a gamble, and I remain wary.

Any animal can be somewhat unpredictable. May I ask where you’re from?

 

[Tazzieman]

Any animal can be somewhat unpredictable. May I ask where you’re from?

The island of the Tassy devil (not the Warner bros version) and

 

[Snipewench]

Software issues aside, I wonder whether the service interval thing is locked because of "it's proprietary, and needs to be kept secret", or whether it's a warranty gate, or just incompetence in the software coding.

If INEOS is treating such as proprietary secret squirrel stuff, we will never get the ability to do a complete service independently of Ineos or an approved service centre.

If it's just coding incompetence, then we can only do but wait for a software update.

If it's a warranty issue, maybe INEOS can add a feature whereby we can officially accept a disclaimer at each service interval change, via screens on the infotaimnet system. They could be as simple as "Do you warrant that you have completed a service on this vehicle, using approved parts and fluids?", or more complex as taking photos of the parts/fluids used, and uploading them to the car as a form of proof that a service has been carried out in accordance with defined steps/standards. Thus, if a warranty claim is later made, they can look at these assurances to determine whether the car has been serviced in-the-field appropriately or not. This function may even be locked behind some password key that only the vehicle owner knows (and has entered into the car when taking delivery of it). Coding such isn't hard, and shouldn't take up memory either. Heck, it'd be great if the info system could actually guide one through the steps of an oil change, for instance, and at the end of it, the service interval is cleared.

Imagine that - a service manual available through the info system (would only work if there's power in the car, obviously...). That may get around the "proprietary" aspects of the manuals if such is locked to a vehicle. There are lots of ways to digitally lock/watermark such to the vehicle VIN, so they know who to blame/sue if it gets out into the wild.

 

[NQ94]

Software issues aside, I wonder whether the service interval thing is locked because of "it's proprietary, and needs to be kept secret", or whether it's a warranty gate, or just incompetence in the software coding.

If INEOS is treating such as proprietary secret squirrel stuff, we will never get the ability to do a complete service independently of Ineos or an approved service centre.

If it's just coding incompetence, then we can only do but wait for a software update.

If it's a warranty issue, maybe INEOS can add a feature whereby we can officially accept a disclaimer at each service interval change, via screens on the infotaimnet system. They could be as simple as "Do you warrant that you have completed a service on this vehicle, using approved parts and fluids?", or more complex as taking photos of the parts/fluids used, and uploading them to the car as a form of proof that a service has been carried out in accordance with defined steps/standards. Thus, if a warranty claim is later made, they can look at these assurances to determine whether the car has been serviced in-the-field appropriately or not. This function may even be locked behind some password key that only the vehicle owner knows (and has entered into the car when taking delivery of it). Coding such isn't hard, and shouldn't take up memory either. Heck, it'd be great if the info system could actually guide one through the steps of an oil change, for instance, and at the end of it, the service interval is cleared.

Imagine that - a service manual available through the info system (would only work if there's power in the car, obviously...). That may get around the "proprietary" aspects of the manuals if such is locked to a vehicle. There are lots of ways to digitally lock/watermark such to the vehicle VIN, so they know who to blame/sue if it gets out into the wild.

Sounds like a good idea for a basic oil change, but a service is more. How does the system acknowledge that an inspection, physical wear, safety checks and brake tests are carried out correctly by a DIYer and defects are recorded correctly for warranty or future repairs? It will need extra data storage module to record information and more coding. Every manufacturer has secret squirrel proprietary operating data that only very few can access.

 

[IslandFalconer]

Software issues aside, I wonder whether the service interval thing is locked because of "it's proprietary, and needs to be kept secret", or whether it's a warranty gate, or just incompetence in the software coding.

If INEOS is treating such as proprietary secret squirrel stuff, we will never get the ability to do a complete service independently of Ineos or an approved service centre.

If it's just coding incompetence, then we can only do but wait for a software update.

If it's a warranty issue, maybe INEOS can add a feature whereby we can officially accept a disclaimer at each service interval change, via screens on the infotaimnet system. They could be as simple as "Do you warrant that you have completed a service on this vehicle, using approved parts and fluids?", or more complex as taking photos of the parts/fluids used, and uploading them to the car as a form of proof that a service has been carried out in accordance with defined steps/standards. Thus, if a warranty claim is later made, they can look at these assurances to determine whether the car has been serviced in-the-field appropriately or not. This function may even be locked behind some password key that only the vehicle owner knows (and has entered into the car when taking delivery of it). Coding such isn't hard, and shouldn't take up memory either. Heck, it'd be great if the info system could actually guide one through the steps of an oil change, for instance, and at the end of it, the service interval is cleared.

Imagine that - a service manual available through the info system (would only work if there's power in the car, obviously...). That may get around the "proprietary" aspects of the manuals if such is locked to a vehicle. There are lots of ways to digitally lock/watermark such to the vehicle VIN, so they know who to blame/sue if it gets out into the wild.

Definitely not a warranty thing. I have an email from the VP of the americas, as long as you have receipts to prove you used approved parts, they can not deny warranty

 

[Jiman01]

Software issues aside, I wonder whether the service interval thing is locked because of "it's proprietary, and needs to be kept secret", or whether it's a warranty gate, or just incompetence in the software coding.

If INEOS is treating such as proprietary secret squirrel stuff, we will never get the ability to do a complete service independently of Ineos or an approved service centre.

If it's just coding incompetence, then we can only do but wait for a software update.

If it's a warranty issue, maybe INEOS can add a feature whereby we can officially accept a disclaimer at each service interval change, via screens on the infotaimnet system. They could be as simple as "Do you warrant that you have completed a service on this vehicle, using approved parts and fluids?", or more complex as taking photos of the parts/fluids used, and uploading them to the car as a form of proof that a service has been carried out in accordance with defined steps/standards. Thus, if a warranty claim is later made, they can look at these assurances to determine whether the car has been serviced in-the-field appropriately or not. This function may even be locked behind some password key that only the vehicle owner knows (and has entered into the car when taking delivery of it). Coding such isn't hard, and shouldn't take up memory either. Heck, it'd be great if the info system could actually guide one through the steps of an oil change, for instance, and at the end of it, the service interval is cleared.

Imagine that - a service manual available through the info system (would only work if there's power in the car, obviously...). That may get around the "proprietary" aspects of the manuals if such is locked to a vehicle. There are lots of ways to digitally lock/watermark such to the vehicle VIN, so they know who to blame/sue if it gets out into the wild.

Do you really want to be that interconnected to the dealer/Ineos? I do not. As IslandFalconer pointed out, at least in our area, providing “proof” outside of a claim has never been a requirement.

I think I speak for many of us here by saying that Ineos’s promise to include a service manual/wiring diagrams so that the end user could work on the vehicles, played a large part in being an early supporters of the IG. It also implies that Ineos knows and understands that it is then the owners responsibility to maintain records should a warranty dispute occur as outlined in our consumer protection laws (US).