Americas USA Buying Process--Beware (dealer vehicle pricing and business practices)

[LC0013]

More like DoeBusters! I have hit 3 and all were does. They do a good bit of damage even for their small size here in Arkansas.

 

[MTNDOG]

So do you call them deer bars?

Cow catchers, push bars and grill guards, specific to what ever little western town you grew up in

 

[Tom109]

So do you call them deer bars?

Mostly called them ARB bumpers.

 

[DaveB]

Mostly called them ARB bumpers.

What if they aren't made by ARB?

 

[anand]

What if they aren't made by ARB?

FauxRB

 

[MTNDOG]

What if they aren't made by ARB?

ARB knock off bumper

 

[shiv.nandak]

I don't understand why this thread even exists, we do not know if the dealers will even add a "market adjustment". And it's the same crappy situation for every brand anyway. I've been looking into a replacement for my wife's Range Rover Sport and you guys do not want to know the kind of mark ups I'm looking at. We are talking 20k mark up (over MSRP) on a USED replacement car with 10k miles

 

[Lord Ripon USA]

I stood with Ineos when they decided to go for it, and asked me for a good faith deposit.

I expect them to stand with me.

It has already risen in cost by something like 50% since their first numbers were floated.
The US models are delayed about 2 model years, so I am expecting a unit to now hit $100K when available for delivery.

At 100k there are plenty of alternatives.

In that vein, the ice gets pretty thin for me to accept any bullshit from a dealer.

I live 8+ hours from what appears to be the nearest dealer.
The vehicle has been touted as open source, and "Right to repair" supportive.
If I end up with one, it's never going to see a dealer.

So there better not be any bullshit.

My preference is to buy a USA spec vehicle, taking delivery in France, and then have it imported after I drive it around for a while.
Like Volvo does it.

 

[Tom109]

What if they aren't made by ARB?

ARB was the only LR option (except Safarigard in the late 1990’s). I heard of TJM but never actually saw one here.

 

[GoneNative]

My preference is to buy a USA spec vehicle, taking delivery in France, and then have it imported after I drive it around for a while.
Like Volvo does it.

You are obviously not a happy camper, and not trying to provoke you, but highly doubt this part is gonna happen unless you make a huge pain for the CEO and in which case probably won't happen and you will cancel your order because you just seem angry over all.

 

[anand]

My preference is to buy a USA spec vehicle, taking delivery in France, and then have it imported after I drive it around for a while.
Like Volvo does it.

This isn't possible at the current juncture; an Ineos rep explained the details to me (it involves the temporary registration in Europe and then still being able to register it as a new vehicle in the US; this can be resolved with a stack of paperwork that needs to be done by Ineos before these programs can be initiated); suffice to say this will probably be an option down the road, but definitely not for MY24.

 

[Stu_Barnes]

I know the Roo-Bar is not coming to the US model.
Will it be available for the US market as an option?

IA have said no. But that doesn’t stop it being independently imported……

 

[DDG]

I buy a lot of cars. I’m NOT a dealer so I don’t speak from that perspective; however, I have seen an obvious trend in the last two months. US dealers found themselves in a truly once-in-a-lifetime situation due to covid shutdowns and cheap money/low interest rates from 2021 through Spring of 2023. These are savvy people (car dealers). If there’s a dollar to be made, they will find the angle. The circumstances that lead to the seemingly normal markups has, and is changing rapidly. Factory production of any non limited vehicle has increased quickly over the past quarter. We can talk about exceptions to this all day, but the overall shortages of supply are a thing of the past. The addictive drug that dealer markups are, is a real bear to withdrawal from for car dealers. Many of them are in denial and still jonesing to get that extra cash. But it’s not happening. No one is buying. Inventory has piled up at those places where markups are still a thing. Interest rates and lending rules are 180 degrees from where they were during the Salad Days of 2021. The only people buying marked up vehicles are flippers. The GT Porsches, C8 ZO6 Corvettes, Raptor Rs of the world might still find suckers to buy them; but those buyers are going to be taking a huge bath on those purchases. Imagine paying $140k for a Raptor R and then realizing you can’t flip it? That’s a bad bad day.
Bottom line: a 2024 Grenadier you will be able to walk into a dealer and get a below MSRP deal on quite readily. You won’t be paying above MSRP. The crazy days are over. Don’t support any car dealer’s big money drug habit. Just say no.

 

[Jiman01]

I don't understand why this thread even exists, we do not know if the dealers will even add a "market adjustment". And it's the same crappy situation for every brand anyway. I've been looking into a replacement for my wife's Range Rover Sport and you guys do not want to know the kind of mark ups I'm looking at. We are talking 20k mark up (over MSRP) on a USED replacement car with 10k miles

Used is a completely different animal than new. For example my LR dealer sells at MSRP on all models for a new vehicle but all bets are off for used. Heck they’re offering to buy mine back for more than I paid new, because apparently their stock is so low…still. Supply chain issues, IDK?

 

[Jiman01]

Bottom line: a 2024 Grenadier you will be able to walk into a dealer and get a below MSRP deal on quite readily. You won’t be paying above MSRP. The crazy days are over. Don’t support any car dealer’s big money drug habit. Just say no.

If you get a below MSRP deal without being buddies with the GM, I want to know how.

 

[DDG]

If you get a below MSRP deal without being buddies with the GM, I want to know how.

It is an educated guess on the grenadier. I think they’ve priced it at the very peak of what an enthusiast would pay. Unless it vastly outperforms expectations, there will be discounting on them by Q2 2024. Ineos might have missed a window for maximizing income as the result of the delays. It’s not to criticize or diminish the vehicle. By nearly all measures they’ve built a great off roader. For the sake of other investments and the world economy, I hope I’m wrong, but I’d be willing to wager on the below MSRP deals coming next Spring/Summer.

 

[DaveB]

I buy a lot of cars. I’m NOT a dealer so I don’t speak from that perspective; however, I have seen an obvious trend in the last two months. US dealers found themselves in a truly once-in-a-lifetime situation due to covid shutdowns and cheap money/low interest rates from 2021 through Spring of 2023. These are savvy people (car dealers). If there’s a dollar to be made, they will find the angle. The circumstances that lead to the seemingly normal markups has, and is changing rapidly. Factory production of any non limited vehicle has increased quickly over the past quarter. We can talk about exceptions to this all day, but the overall shortages of supply are a thing of the past. The addictive drug that dealer markups are, is a real bear to withdrawal from for car dealers. Many of them are in denial and still jonesing to get that extra cash. But it’s not happening. No one is buying. Inventory has piled up at those places where markups are still a thing. Interest rates and lending rules are 180 degrees from where they were during the Salad Days of 2021. The only people buying marked up vehicles are flippers. The GT Porsches, C8 ZO6 Corvettes, Raptor Rs of the world might still find suckers to buy them; but those buyers are going to be taking a huge bath on those purchases. Imagine paying $140k for a Raptor R and then realizing you can’t flip it? That’s a bad bad day.
Bottom line: a 2024 Grenadier you will be able to walk into a dealer and get a below MSRP deal on quite readily. You won’t be paying above MSRP. The crazy days are over. Don’t support any car dealer’s big money drug habit. Just say no.

We had the same in Australia with realestate & housing prices.
During COVID any fool could be a realestate agent and sell a house within 2-3 days.
They went for huge prices, 50-70% over true vale.
Now prices are dropping back to normal, people have massively overpaid and lots of would be realestate agents are finding it hard to survive.

 

[Xrford]

It is an educated guess on the grenadier. I think they’ve priced it at the very peak of what an enthusiast would pay. Unless it vastly outperforms expectations, there will be discounting on them by Q2 2024. Ineos might have missed a window for maximizing income as the result of the delays. It’s not to criticize or diminish the vehicle. By nearly all measures they’ve built a great off roader. For the sake of other investments and the world economy, I hope I’m wrong, but I’d be willing to wager on the below MSRP deals coming next Spring/Summer.

I think you fail to realize how few Grenadiers are being imported. They are not importing 100k vehicles like most popular vehicles sold in the USA, so supply is going to be constrained which will drive up prices. Like most limited production vehicles the prices are only going be driven up. Also most Americans do not yet know this vehicle even exists, once all the you tube channels in America get a hold of it and people see what this 4x4 can do, without any need for aftermarket add ons, it will soon become a status vehicle like the G wagon and you can see how much the price has gone up on that 4x4 over the last decade and Mercedes is importing about the same number as IA is going to import Grenadiers.

 

[Jiman01]

When I see the insane prices older restored Defenders are going for and the resemblance of the IG to those older vehicles, but with more comfort and performance….I think the demand will be high. Higher than supply IMO.

Time will tell

 

[emax]

The bottom line--you will not know what your vehicle will cost until you make a deal with the dealer. It is their car to sell.

So why not just order two, three or a dozen of them? One order for you, for your wife, your son, your parents etc ...

If the order is not in fact a contract, nobody is obliged to accept delivery and pay for it. But if time of delivery comes the dealer has a dozen cars in the yard were all customers have in the meantime decided not to buy it (except you), and thus the dealer won't probably be able sell them all easily for $20'000 above MSRP.

Tough dealers need tough answers.