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Sick of waiting

DenisM

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What exactly do you mean by reduction gear?
There was an earlier report on this forum that an oil feed in the transfer case was drilled at an incorrect angle, causing oil starvation. I'm presuming the "reduction gear" is the 2:1 driving gear which engages when the TF case lever is shifted to "low"...
 

Trialmaster

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I'm starting to get a little worried.
Full payment made about ten days ago (confirmed by Inesos), including provincial registration tax (IPT). No further contact from retail partner. Car produced in March 2023 and delivered to retail partner last May. No news of Italian registrations.
In addition, I read more and more frequently about numerous problems: AC not working, water in the car, software problems, exposed cables, steering wheels not properly fitted, steering and gearbox failures, etc.
So I join those sick of waiting
Don't listen to all of the negative stuff. It will arrive and that is frustrating. You will have the false messages (but no warning lights), but as for the rest, just wait and I can imagine yours will be fine.

Forums, are strange places, people always want to find the negatives and it does get tiring. Sometimes I think you are better not reading half of the stuff written, but we can't help ourselves.

Good luck and I hope you get the car soon..... :)
 

Pat

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I'm starting to get a little worried.
Full payment made about ten days ago (confirmed by Inesos), including provincial registration tax (IPT). No further contact from retail partner. Car produced in March 2023 and delivered to retail partner last May. No news of Italian registrations.
In addition, I read more and more frequently about numerous problems: AC not working, water in the car, software problems, exposed cables, steering wheels not properly fitted, steering and gearbox failures, etc.
So I join those sick of waiting
You car is in Verona ;-) and your VIN ends with 59.
 

DCPU

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Don't listen to all of the negative stuff.
I'd rather say listen to it all and go into it with your eyes open. A known problem is already half way to being fixed.

I really wouldn't describe it as negative, you should count your blessings that others are willing to find these issues, share them with words and photos, discuss the root causes, look for remedies and provide feedback on any Ineos actions.

The only thing negative about that is thinking it's a negative. 🤔

Forums, are strange places, people always want to find the negatives and it does get tiring. Sometimes I think you are better not reading half of the stuff written, but we can't help ourselves.
Then you are just in blissful ignorance of the problems ~ they are always there and if you find them on your own then you then have a bigger worry than knowing it could be an issue before hand. A problem shared and all that.
 

Tom109

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There was an earlier report on this forum that an oil feed in the transfer case was drilled at an incorrect angle, causing oil starvation. I'm presuming the "reduction gear" is the 2:1 driving gear which engages when the TF case lever is shifted to "low"...
Similar LR issue in the late 90’s. Maintenance
Campaign solved it with a little extra time to get the cross-drilled mainshafts.
 
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Trialmaster

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I'd rather say listen to it all and go into it with your eyes open. A known problem is already half way to being fixed.

I really wouldn't describe it as negative, you should count your blessings that others are willing to find these issues, share them with words and photos, discuss the root causes, look for remedies and provide feedback on any Ineos actions.

The only thing negative about that is thinking it's a negative. 🤔


Then you are just in blissful ignorance of the problems ~ they are always there and if you find them on your own then you then have a bigger worry than knowing it could be an issue before hand. A problem shared and all that.
I also think their is fine line between product destruction and trying to be helpful.

I have never known a new car launch where people are continuously trying to find fault with it. I find it depressing, and the resulting outcome is people who read these forums think the Grenadier is going to disintegrate around their ears. When in fact the opposite is true, the vehicle is robust with the major exception of the software problem which all owners have experienced (false warnings on the centre binnacle without warning lights). I can't ignore that people are experiencing other problems, but until they affect my vehicle, my answer is so what.

I would agree that the launch should have been delayed until the software was compliant, but I imagine the pressures to launch were far too extreme.


The issues I have raised on the feedback thread would have been known to me, irrespective of what others have said and to be fair there is only one of any consequence and that's the software issue.

I spoke at length to Chandlers (agent) yesterday and yes they have had vehicles with issues (software), but none have broken down, which is very encouraging. They are on top of the situation, as owners have reported back to them with their issues which is duly fed back to Ineos. Ineos are also listening as some owners fortunately had an opportunity to feed back their impressions to them via a recent survey.

FINALLY, those who receive their vehicles after the updates (one of which is software) will have a different story to tell.


What we all should be doing is driving and not typing......and having a holiday. :) SO, have a great day DCPU and enjoy the drive.
 

alvan

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My registration procedure should be completed at the end of next week. Few hours ago I completed the payment (car and registration). My Italian retail partner is very efficient and cooperative; since I live as far as three hours by car plus eight hours by ferry, they immediately sent me a video of my car when some days ago it was delivered to them. I add that my car seems to be already updated, since it will be delivered to me as soon the registration will be completed.
 

trobex

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I'd rather say listen to it all and go into it with your eyes open. A known problem is already half way to being fixed.

I really wouldn't describe it as negative, you should count your blessings that others are willing to find these issues, share them with words and photos, discuss the root causes, look for remedies and provide feedback on any Ineos actions.

The only thing negative about that is thinking it's a negative. 🤔


Then you are just in blissful ignorance of the problems ~ they are always there and if you find them on your own then you then have a bigger worry than knowing it could be an issue before hand. A problem shared and all that.
I would hope that all the owners who do have problems (and there seems to be a few racking up now) get the issues fixed properly by INEOS under warranty - so that later, my vehicle has a greater chance of not being faulty or failing on me 400km from anywhere! This vehicle must be able to hit the long stretches and stay moving. It will be interesting to see how big journeys through QLD/WA/NT fair... some testing country which the GREN was designed to eat up and spit out.
 

Solmanic

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I also think their is fine line between product destruction and trying to be helpful.

I have never known a new car launch where people are continuously trying to find fault with it. I find it depressing, and the resulting outcome is people who read these forums think the Grenadier is going to disintegrate around their ears. When in fact the opposite is true, the vehicle is robust with the major exception of the software problem which all owners have experienced (false warnings on the centre binnacle without warning lights). I can't ignore that people are experiencing other problems, but until they affect my vehicle, my answer is so what.

.
Correct.
As our running poll of delivery conditions goes, no-one's vehicle has "disintegrated around their ears". The majority are reporting only minor, mildly inconvenient faults that they are happy to wait for their dealer to rectify at next service (71%).


It would be helpful if people could review this poll before becoming hysterical about vehicle quality without having actually taken delivery of their own one yet. The poll just doesn't show any trend of major issues.
 

AWo

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And, to tell the truth, I never saw a similar attention to a new car. It seems to confirm that we a re in front of a very special and potentially iconic vehicle.
From your point of view that might apply. But you should also take into account, that 4x4 enthusiasts are a minority within the car world. If you actively monitor the car industry there were cars which globally draw a lot more attention, as more potential buyers were available, when they entered the market. Take the Citroen DS and SM or almost all Mercedes S-Class and SL class models, especially the first ones, the Mercedes A model, the new BMW 7 series at its time (as it was a new modell range) or Tesla as a new manufacturer (when we want to speak about really new developments). Tesla occupies a lot of automotive and normal media space, far more than Ineos Automotive does. All these cars draw a very high international attention and reflects that with their build and sales numbers, if problems not killed them too early, like the NSU Ro 80 with a Wankel engine or the Citroen SM. But the press and media hype was huge. And there are cars which draw almost no attention until released, but developed to real iconic cars (Land Rover Series -> Defender, maybe the VW Golf, but not sure here and many more, I know and don't know about).

Tipp: There is a small but fine video channel on YouTube called "Big Car". This guy goes behind the story and lifetime of many cars and car companies, describes the development, problems, success and numbers. It also gives a sense of demanded cars and worlds attention to them.

Check the used car prices of cars from the 70ths or 80ths and you can see which became icons. There are cars like the Renault 5 Turbo, Alfa Romeo Gulietta, the all time icon VW Bully, especially the T2 and T3 and many Volvo modells which became real icons. I assume the 4x4 scene and the number of available modells is to small to get that attention other icons did.

Search for old video footages of media interviews and visits to international car fairs. You will find a lot regarding much awaited and demanded cars, globally. Compare that to the Grenadier (or other 4x4s) and you'll see, these 4x4 stuff are all addressed to our small niche we*re sitting in (happily).

In automotive business magazines and consumer magazines Chinese EVs, even from XiangShangShu Inc. or LululuBla Ltd. draw more attention than the Grenadier. In the ones I read, a German and an American one, you saw nothing abouth the Grenadier for month. In my German business magazine the last entry is from 29.04.2022. It seems to be not woth a new message. But, maybe that is better, because they would point at the delivery and build problems, as these are of interest for the business side. Feel free to check that on you own. Take car magazines and look for the Grenadier and you'll find almost nothing, except in specialised 4x4 magazines.

Saying the the Grenadier draws a lot attention only applies to the 4x4 scene. Interestingly, within the Toyota Fan base, the Grenadier is watched, but raises not a lot of interest. But I undestand that. They spend a lot of money and time for their car and they are happy. It is reliable, does what it needs, has a worldwide support, so why change to something different? For many Land Cruiser guys the journey looking for THE car to travel has ended with the Land Cruiser.

AWo
 
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alvan

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From your point of view that might apply. But you should also take into account, that 4x4 enthusiasts are a minority within the car world. If you actively monitor the car industry there were cars which globally draw a lot more attention, as more potential buyers were available, when they entered the market. Take the Citroen DS and SM or almost all Mercedes S-Class and SL class models, especially the first ones, the Mercedes A model, the new BMW 7 series at its time (as it was a new modell range) or Tesla as a new manufacturer (when we want to speak about really new developments). Tesla occupies a lot of automotive and normal media space, far more than Ineos Automotive does. All these cars draw a very high international attention and reflects that with their build and sales numbers, if problems not killed them too early, like the NSU Ro 80 with a Wankel engine or the Citroen SM. But the press and media hype was huge. And there are cars which draw almost no attention until released, but developed to real iconic cars (Land Rover Series -> Defender, maybe the VW Golf, but not sure here and many more, I know and don't know about).

Tipp: There is a small but fine video channel on YouTube called "Big Car". This guy goes behind the story and lifetime of many cars and car companies, describes the development, problems, success and numbers. It also gives a sense of demanded cars and worlds attention to them.

Check the used car prices of cars from the 70ths or 80ths and you can see which became icons. There are cars like the Renault 5 Turbo, Alfa Romeo Gulietta, the all time icon VW Bully, especially the T2 and T3 and many Volvo modells which became real icons. I assume the 4x4 scene and the number of available modells is to small to get that attention other icons did.

Search for old video footages of media interviews and visits to international car fairs. You will find a lot regarding much awaited and demanded cars, globally. Compare that to the Grenadier (or other 4x4s) and you'll see, these 4x4 stuff are all addressed to our small niche we*re sitting in (happily).

In automotive business magazines and consumer magazines Chinese EVs, even from XiangShangShu Inc. or LululuBla Ltd. draw more attention than the Grenadier. In the ones I read, a German and an American one, you saw nothing abouth the Grenadier for month. In my German business magazine the last entry is from 29.04.2022. It seems to be not woth a new message. But, maybe that is better, because they would point at the delivery and build problems, as these are of interest for the business side. Feel free to check that on you own. Take car magazines and look for the Grenadier and you'll find almost nothing, except in specialised 4x4 magazines.

Saying the the Grenadier draws a lot attention only applies to the 4x4 scene. Interestingly, within the Toyota Fan base, the Grenadier is watched, but raises not a lot of interest. But I undestand that. They spend a lot of money and time for their car and they are happy. It is reliable, does what it needs, has a worldwide support, so why change to something different? For many Land Cruiser guys the journey looking for THE car to travel has ended with the Land Cruiser.

AWo
I explained myself badly... I know the automotive information system very well (I have written and write in specialized magazines) and I am careful not to confuse the professional media coverage of a brand, let's suppose, like Volkswagen with that of Ineos. My reference was to the attention of owners and above all future owners of the Grenadier, an attention that has developed with participation and passion down to the most minute technical details but, above all, towards the philosophy of a project that Ineos has shared in all its development. I may be wrong, but I don't remember a similar participation, maintained for such a long time, in other cases...
 

AWo

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I explained myself badly... I know the automotive information system very well (I have written and write in specialized magazines) and I am careful not to confuse the professional media coverage of a brand, let's suppose, like Volkswagen with that of Ineos. My reference was to the attention of owners and above all future owners of the Grenadier, an attention that has developed with participation and passion down to the most minute technical details but, above all, towards the philosophy of a project that Ineos has shared in all its development. I may be wrong, but I don't remember a similar participation, maintained for such a long time, in other cases...
Got it.

AWo
 

dynosoar

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Hi,
My grenadier arrived at the dealer/agent just over a week ago.
This coincided with their demonstrator model being available for test drives.
So I was able to get out for an hour or so of test driving and also give my car a quick once over.
The only aspect of the test drive that seemed of note was the slightly odd steering as has been mentioned. It is as if it needs more castor angle or toe in but is easy to adjust driving style to suit., Although I am used to tractor machinery that had no feedback at all!
So the vehicle is now paid for and was prepped last week. There only remains the registration process to complete I believe.
The agent was not aware of any particular recall work apart from the software update which I have no doubt will be an ongoing thing.
I established that the car was built at the end of January. Exactly what has gone on with it between then and now is unknown.
It looks like I will not be ‘sick of waiting’ in the near future.

A
 

Trialmaster

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Hi,
I established that the car was built at the end of January. Exactly what has gone on with it between then and now is unknown.
A, excellent news.

Just curious, how did you establish when yours was built? I must admit, there is usually a plaque on the vehicle, but I haven't searched for it.
 

dynosoar

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I just asked the agent as we were looking over the vehicle and he had the info on the accompanying paperwork I think.
We were speculating over the correlation between reservation and delivery dates.
I was also asking to see if there were any major component recalls such as transfer gearbox that has been mentioned elsewhere.
I didn’t want to pay if the car was going to be stood awaiting parts/work.

A
 
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