CTEK SMARTPASS 120S and 250SE DC to DC charger basic features and install information

[TheDocAUS]

Just spent two weeks hunting, which was to be a test for the oem dual battery system and my own requirements. since i posted my build here, ive gone on to add an engel 40L fridge and a cheap 80w renogy solar panel. I wired 12awg solar cables (via a 20a fuse) to my roof rack through the external roof connections at the front right (pull the handle off, pop the electrical cover off and snake wires through the rubber gasket to reach on the inside by pulling off a couple interior push plugs from the ceiling, and sneak down the inside of the door seal to the battery compartment). For good mesure i put a renogy 500a shunt onto the secondary battery; my reasoning was that the electrons from the solar panel to the D250SE would be directed to the secondary battery, then trickle back to the primary battery via the smartpass when the secondary was fully charged. had both batteries on a trickle charger before leaving. The secondary never did better than 56% SOC according to the shunt. Odd but didnt think much of it. Out in the wild i would have primary battery SOC 70-80% by 530 AM most days (in the tents by 2100 most nights) which seems appropriate for the draw of the fridge and light use the night before. This is as per Ineos SOC monitor visible under the offroad headings. My renogy monitor showed a gradual decline in SOC of secondary battery, so that by day 12 it was reading 16%, and never seemed to charge during the day despite the miles. the smartpass and d250se never registered a fault and seemed to indicate appropriate charging function according to their lights. I did notice on one hot sunny day that the primary battery had charged by 10% while we were out walking. Im not sure what to make of it all, but dont like that i cant puzzle out or monitor my batteries better. I think i will be switching to a more conventional system, and powering everthing off the secondary battery (or batteries if the black friday sales are good).

Think about fitting a cheap BLE battery monitor to both batteries, so you can see what is happening to each battery individually. The 120S and 250SE combo have worked for me with a similar setup. I know with near certainty, using the BLE, that the solar panel is charging both batteries.

 

[Jmccmick]

while driving home i was thinking i should et some of those monitors jean mercier had written about, i just havent had a chance to look them up yet, literally been home for 19hr and have a few more things to clean up still

 

[TheDocAUS]

while driving home i was thinking i should et some of those monitors jean mercier had written about, i just havent had a chance to look them up yet, literally been home for 19hr and have a few more things to clean up still

The same monitor, I have used them for years on another vehicle and battery boxes. Your local eBay or Amazon should have them. Look around some people charge way over market. Here they cost around AUD33 to 35 dollars, plus postage. The BLE can be marketed under different names, most of which are more expensive than the BLE branded ones.

Ancel is offering something similar which I testing now.

 

[Rok_Dr]

Just spent two weeks hunting, which was to be a test for the oem dual battery system and my own requirements. since i posted my build here, ive gone on to add an engel 40L fridge and a cheap 80w renogy solar panel. I wired 12awg solar cables (via a 20a fuse) to my roof rack through the external roof connections at the front right (pull the handle off, pop the electrical cover off and snake wires through the rubber gasket to reach on the inside by pulling off a couple interior push plugs from the ceiling, and sneak down the inside of the door seal to the battery compartment). For good mesure i put a renogy 500a shunt onto the secondary battery; my reasoning was that the electrons from the solar panel to the D250SE would be directed to the secondary battery, then trickle back to the primary battery via the smartpass when the secondary was fully charged. had both batteries on a trickle charger before leaving. The secondary never did better than 56% SOC according to the shunt. Odd but didnt think much of it. Out in the wild i would have primary battery SOC 70-80% by 530 AM most days (in the tents by 2100 most nights) which seems appropriate for the draw of the fridge and light use the night before. This is as per Ineos SOC monitor visible under the offroad headings. My renogy monitor showed a gradual decline in SOC of secondary battery, so that by day 12 it was reading 16%, and never seemed to charge during the day despite the miles. the smartpass and d250se never registered a fault and seemed to indicate appropriate charging function according to their lights. I did notice on one hot sunny day that the primary battery had charged by 10% while we were out walking. Im not sure what to make of it all, but dont like that i cant puzzle out or monitor my batteries better. I think i will be switching to a more conventional system, and powering everthing off the secondary battery (or batteries if the black friday sales are good).

I recall someone on the forum mentioning that the smartpass needs to see a voltage of at least 13.1 v before it would start to pass charge to the auxiliary battery. It may well be that your Solar regulator output voltage is less that this. This is the case for my Victron solar regulator which puts out around 12.8v.

If I get some time and a sunny day on the weekend I’ll test this hypothesis out and advise.

Cheers Steve

 

[TheDocAUS]

I recall someone on the forum mentioning that the smartpass needs to see a voltage of at least 13.1 v before it would start to pass charge to the auxiliary battery. It may well be that your Solar regulator output voltage is less that this. This is the case for my Victron solar regulator which puts out around 12.8v.

If I get some time and a sunny day on the weekend I’ll test this hypothesis out and advise.

Cheers Steve

Just FYI.

My 160W solar panel is supplying enough voltage to charge the main and aux batteries.

 

[Rok_Dr]

Just FYI.

My 160W solar panel is supplying enough voltage to charge the main and aux batteries.

I missed that you both use the Cteck250se as a solar regulator so in that case I couldn't see that being an issue as its designed to work with the Smartpass, whereas my Victron regulator feeds to the main battery.

 

[Loc Nar]

@Jmccmick, just curious because I did not see it mentioned yet, but do you have the red smart alternator wire coming from the D250Se hooked up to an ignition feed?

 

[TheDocAUS]

@Jmccmick, just curious because I did not see it mentioned yet, but do you have the red smart alternator wire coming from the D250Se hooked up to an ignition feed?

XHQ installed mine, they did NOT hook up the red smart alternator wire. Everything working fine.

 

[Loc Nar]

XHQ installed mine, they did NOT hook up the r ed smart alternator wire.

Yeah, it's still a big mystery as to whether it should or should not be, and not installing it may explain some strange charging behavior in the Grenadier. @Ragman has been looking into this and I still don't think he has a definitive answer. He received this guidance from CTEK:

Hello Dick,

Usually the smart alternator function is not enabled on recreation vehicles. The red thin cable can be isolated but if you are unsure connect it to a 12v ignition on live signal regardless of whether there is a smart generator or not.

Med vänliga hälsningar/Best Regards,
Mikael Magnusson

The consensus seems to be the Grenadier does have a Smart alternator. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but it's my understanding that connecting the Smart alternator wire allows the D250se to continue to charge the auxiliary battery when the alternator output voltage drops. This is from the CTEK D250SE/120S manual:

Charging of a service battery from a smart alternator (with variable charging voltage) The D250SE can charge a service battery at up to 20A from the starter battery when a smart alternator is running. This function is switched off when the engine is not running, so as not to discharge the starter battery. The Installation section describes how the D250SE needs to be connected in order to activate the smart alternator functions.

• Charging of a service battery from a smart alternator (with variable charging voltage)The SMARTPASS 120S can charge a service battery at up to 120A from the starter batterywhen a smart alternator is running. This function is switched off when the engine is not running,so as not to discharge the starter battery. The Installation section describes how the SMARTPASS120S needs to be connected in order to activate the smart alternator functions.

I found this also of interest in the manual:

Conventional alternator cut-in >13.1V, for 5 sec. (engine running, alternator charging)

Conventional alternator cut-out <12.8V, for 10 sec. (engine running, alternator not charging)

Smart alternator cut-in >11.8V, for 5 sec. (engine running, alternator charging)

Smart alternator cut-out <11.4V, for 10 sec. (engine running, alternator not charging

So, if I'm reading this correctly, since the Grenadier has a Smart alternator, if the Smart alternator wire is not hooked up, the CTEK will stop charging the auxiliary battery when the alternator drops below 12.8v for 10 seconds and won't restart until 13.1v is hit again for at least 5 seconds. Those parameters change when the Smart alternator wire is hooked up.

We know Ineos did not hook up the Smart alternator wire on the 120s and they also nuked the consumer output. No one knows the definitive answer why, but we can speculate. In any event, I am installing the D250se soon and do plan on experimenting with running it with and without the Smart alternator wire installed to compare performance. Interesting stuff.

 

[255/85]

I

We know Ineos did not hook up the Smart alternator wire on the 120s and they also nuked the consumer output. No one knows the definitive answer why, but we can speculate. In any event, I am installing the D250se soon and do plan on experimenting with running it with and without the Smart alternator wire installed to compare performance. Interesting stuff.

Was it collectively decided that Ineos' system only monitors the primary battery therefore tying all the draws/outputs to the start/primary battery made some kind of sense? I could see it being a guessing game as to the SOC of the AUX batt if the consumer output had remained functional.

 

[Jmccmick]

I recall someone on the forum mentioning that the smartpass needs to see a voltage of at least 13.1 v before it would start to pass charge to the auxiliary battery. It may well be that your Solar regulator output voltage is less that this. This is the case for my Victron solar regulator which puts out around 12.8v.

If I get some time and a sunny day on the weekend I’ll test this hypothesis out and advise.

Cheers Steve

Plugged directly into the D250se as MPPT. My panel produces 22.5V +/- a couple in full sun. The renogy monitor is showing 13.9v on the secondary, though only 5% SOC. Im beginning to question the function of the monitor.

 

[Jmccmick]

@Jmccmick, just curious because I did not see it mentioned yet, but do you have the red smart alternator wire coming from the D250Se hooked up to an ignition feed?

i havent hooked it up to the ignition. im going to dabble with the ignition wires on both devices, just waiting on the ancel bm200 monitors to arrive so i have something a bit more objective to base decisions on

 

[Loc Nar]

i havent hooked it up to the ignition. im going to dabble with the ignition wires on both devices, just waiting on the ancel bm200 monitors to arrive so i have something a bit more objective to base decisions on

Right there with you. Looks like you'll beat me to it. I look forward to seeing what you find out.

 

[Loc Nar]

I


Was it collectively decided that Ineos' system only monitors the primary battery therefore tying all the draws/outputs to the start/primary battery made some kind of sense? I could see it being a guessing game as to the SOC of the AUX batt if the consumer output had remained functional.

I'm not sure. I recall seeing speculation somewhere that maybe someone overloaded the 120s consumer outlet causing some issues and maybe some smoke?

 

[TheDocAUS]

I'm not sure. I recall seeing speculation somewhere that maybe someone overloaded the 120s consumer outlet causing some issues and maybe some smoke?

People can do some really silly things when it comes to electrics, overloading circuits, no fuses, dangerous wiring, etc.

It is easier to seal up the output. My dealer has already seen suspect work on some cars.

Mine was done by a good auto electrician and done right.

 

[bakepl]

People can do some really silly things when it comes to electrics, overloading circuits, no fuses, dangerous wiring, etc.

It is easier to seal up the output. My dealer has already seen suspect work on some cars.

Mine was done by a good auto electrician and done right.

True enough but this could apply to any appliance really. Too much of a coincidence I'd say that about the same time Ctek de-rates the consumer out of the 120 that Ineos stops the consumer out completely. Are any dealers saying why Ineos did this or for that matter why Ctek de-rated their own product?

 

[255/85]

True enough but this could apply to any appliance really. Too much of a coincidence I'd say that about the same time Ctek de-rates the consumer out of the 120 that Ineos stops the consumer out completely. Are any dealers saying why Ineos did this or for that matter why Ctek de-rated their own product?

Did the Ctek spec change coincide with their free heatshield retrofit? If so I'd suspect overheating of internal components was the reason.

 

[bakepl]

Did the Ctek spec change coincide with their free heatshield retrofit? If so I'd suspect overheating of internal components was the reason.

Yes, they provide a metal standoff when mounting on plastic surfaces with new instructions that de-rate the consumer out to 50amps.

Product Safety Notice - SMARTPASS

www.ctek.com

 

[Jmccmick]

With the ancel BM200 applied to each battery im seeing the expected spikes during ignition/driving etc. The aux remains a solid 100% SOC at all times. The primary dipped to 60% SOC at 12.4v with fridge running overnight, and without fridge seems to dwindled slowly to 70% SOC at about 12.6V over 24-36h. ill have another 24hr worth of data when i get home tonight, but at the moment am thinking that i will reconfigure the existing hardware and cables to a more conventional system with critical elements attached to the primary battery (ECU, security etc) and luxury items (fridge, accessory lights, inverter, aux charging ports etc) attached to the aux battery and properly isolated from the primary (none of this connecting busbars with shunts). I need to pull the kids seats out to get back underneath so this might not be until the weekend, but looking at the wonderful posts about the busbars im expecting to be able to relocate critical elements to one busbar attached to primary on one end and smartpass on the other. The other end (output) of the smartpass will connect the second busbar, with the aux battery attached on the far end. The smartpass can serve to properly isolate the two sources of electrons, charge the aux with 140a (with the cooperation of the D250SE) and allow the trickling back to the primary when Aux>primary. This should allow the automatic coupling function of the smartpass during high loads (really the only reason im still working with this and havent replaced it all yet). Ill also re-install the renogy shunt on the aux, expecting it to function properly now that the aux will be charging/discharging independent of the primary. The part im still uncertain of is whether the cables identified in the other threads remain accurate for the NA truck, so ill dismantle and doing some caveman testing (light on when cable connected, light off when disconnected) before i start ordering more bits and pieces to finish the system. ill try to be a bit more assiduous in my documenting if things seem other than has been previously reported. Open to any constructive criticism as well

 

[TheDocAUS]

Get at least one weeks worth of data, before making any decisions. These monitors give estimates based on voltage and are not exact. Make your decision on the trends over the week.

There is also electrical information in the Rok Dr Guide, version 5 just issued.

@Rok_Dr