What happens if Ineos Grenadier shuts down for good

[MrRdstr]

Billionaire or not at one point you pull the plug on anything that bleeds money IMO.

I was more or less concerned about my warranty but it sounds like I can just go pound sand if it comes down to it!

Again, I absolutely love my IG

 

[artschool]

Billionaire or not at one point you pull the plug on anything that bleeds money IMO.

I was more or less concerned about my warranty but it sounds like I can just go pound sand if it comes down to it!

Again, I absolutely love my IG

Chicken Little syndrome

 

[Tom D]

It would be disappointing for sure, But I’d keep mine, I love it and all the basic parts would be readily available, engine and gearbox are common items, Axle parts would still be available from Carraro, some are probably shared with Iveco trucks. Suspension components such as drag links etc, can be asily manufactured, in fact aftermarket ones are already available. The only difficulty might be body panels…

So don’t crash it!

 

[bikesandguitars]

Bankruptcy would mean that there is an outside financial institution, investor or interested partner. According to what I’ve read, there is no investor. There are no debts. The entire venture is funded from the personal wealth of Ineos founder, Sir Jim Ratcliffe. For those unfamiliar with how a bankruptcy originates, the courts tend to frown on bankruptcy filings when there isn’t a lender involved.

As for Recaro, vendor changes are a normal part of automobile manufacturing. Recaro’s troubles, if they are the culprit, should, in no way, cause one to imagine that Ineos is similarly troubled. However, if you start to hear that Ineos is behind on their bills with BMW, Brembo, Carraro, ZF, Eibach, etc., then by all means, please voice your concerns.

Until then, this enterprise, under its present structure, will end only when Sir Ratcliffe decides. And since Sir Ratcliffe is making further investments…
We can probably end this thread here.

 

[nsk]

INEOS Grenadier shuts down the entire project/production for good? 5 year 60K mile warranty gone, adios...CIAO!

I thought a lot about this before buying because I think failure and closure is a real possibility for any new business, let alone one that's incurred a tremendous amount of startup expense in manufacturing and faces ongoing regulatory scrutiny and legislation. The current production pause doesn't concern me as much as the indefinite pause on the Fusilier project, since I think an expansion into EV (or quasi-EV) is the way the whole auto industry is heading. I think the Grenadier side of the Ineos business is committed to profitability, but there's got to be a limit to financial losses that the Ineos parent is prepared to incur on the Grenadier project.

I finally concluded that I'm ok with Ineos pulling manufacturer support and warranty coverage for this car because I trust its off-the-shelf hard parts: BMW drivetrain, simple suspension, Brembo brake hardware, etc. The community that's sprung up around this car in terms of 3D printed accessories and DIY documentation is really impressive. I think there will always be buyers for Grenadiers, even if there's no Ineos support left. Like, people still own and drive track cars whose manufacturers are well out of business. I see the same kind of enthusiasm and support happening here.

 

[Tom D]

If I were running the company I’d forget about Europe and anywhere else with mandatory EV laws looming and concentrate on selling good ice cars to the rest of the world. There’s huge markets out there.

The fusilier would be great as an economical 2 litre four pot diesel. I’d have one.

 

[landmannnn]

Sir Jim has a number of passion projects, I doubt if he is expecting a short term return on his investments.,.
2 billion in IA
1.5bn in Manchester United plus annual cost
1 bn in Mercedes F1 plus annual costs
100 million in Nice football team, similar for Sporting Lausanne
60 million per year in the cycling team
100 million in the Americas cup boat

 

[artschool]

We are lucky to have these cars so we should just enjoy them and not worry

 

[crashnburn]

Let's not worry too much and let us enjoy our IGs.
I know it is a big investment but adding stress to what is not there just uses up a lot of energy.

 

[Jeremy996]

The stuff that bothers me is the IP in the vehicle software and any bespoke electrical components - modern vehicles can be bricked by silly failures like a failed touchscreen, (early Tesla S), or water in the ECU, (Mazda MX5).

I'm hoping that there is enough of an user/enthusiast base to make Ineos profitable in the long term and MacGyver fixes to the problems of obsolescence and scarcity.

 

[DaveB]

Sir Jim has a number of passion projects, I doubt if he is expecting a short term return on his investments.,.
2 billion in IA
1.5bn in Manchester United plus annual cost
1 bn in Mercedes F1 plus annual costs
100 million in Nice football team, similar for Sporting Lausanne
60 million per year in the cycling team
100 million in the Americas cup boat

Maybe he should also invest in a good dentist and barber

 

[Zimm]

Radcliffe didn’t pull 2 billion out of his sock drawer, stuff it in a suitcase, and hand it Mercedes and various suppliers. This isn’t like your household finances.

Of course there are banks involved.

Putting suppliers on hold for 6 months and not employing your staff is as wacky a folding. Who knows wtf is going on. Well… some people do.

If you love your car great. You have it, so I guess you better. If you’re on the fence because shit doesn’t make sense, awesome. It’s not the smart move.

I just want my fucking manual. Keep the gay jacket. In fact, if shitting the bed releases the manual, maybe the sooner the better.

And large companies don’t change course, until they do. That may sound obvious, but apparently not to people that think shit like opening the china office signals solvency. The money was already spent, and word of abandoning the course wouldn’t sell many lot orphans.


Lastly.. how does Oz force a company to honor warranties when the company no longer exists? Is it bonded somehow? What happens when OEM suppliers stop production? Who are they dragging in front of a judge? I don’t get it. How’s that work?

 

[Scotsitalian]

Sorry guys I just don’t buy the b*llsh*t story of Recaro seat shortage.
Recaro is a major seat manufacturer in Germany and if IA asks for seats for their global annual production, the Germans will delivern spec, on time, on budget it’s what German car component manufacturers do, day in, day out
Going on the haphazard and incompetent way IA have dealt with running the company to date, I think there is something much more sinister going on!

 

[artschool]

Sorry guys I just don’t buy the b*llsh*t story of Recaro seat shortage.
Recaro is a major seat manufacturer in Germany and if IA asks for seats for their global annual production, the Germans will delivern spec, on time, on budget it’s what German car component manufacturers do, day in, day out
Going on the haphazard and incompetent way IA have dealt with running the company to date, I think there is something much more sinister going on!

Sports seat manufacturer Recaro files for bankruptcy | Autocar

Employees were reportedly unaware of the move, which comes four years after firm was sold to private investors

www.autocar.co.uk

 

[DoubleDoom]

INEOS Grenadier shuts down the entire project/production for good? 5 year 60K mile warranty gone, adios...CIAO!

I absolutely love my IG (3K miles in) but given the chatter about Recaro & the production halt, one has to wonder.

Did you feel that BMW would close when they suspended production due to a shortage of parts recently?

Dave, I understand but looking back personally I would have hesitated to buy the IG if i realized production was halted.

Most car manufacturers have had pauses at various points. Indeed, post Covid, it is increasingly common.

If I were running the company I’d forget about Europe and anywhere else with mandatory EV laws looming and concentrate on selling good ice cars to the rest of the world. There’s huge markets out there.

They can keep Europe low volume to stay under the thresholds and avoid penalities. They have already said they are going to do that by pushing the price up and doing more prestige models.

Sorry guys I just don’t buy the b*llsh*t story of Recaro seat shortage.

Strange you don't because it's well documented and has affected multiple manufacturers.

 

[MrRdstr]

Did you feel that BMW would close when they suspended production due to a shortage of parts recently?

Most car manufacturers have had pauses at various points. Indeed, post Covid, it is increasingly common.


They can keep Europe low volume to stay under the thresholds and avoid penalities. They have already said they are going to do that by pushing the price up and doing more prestige models.

Strange you don't because it's well documented and has affected multiple manufacturers.

I’m sorry but you can’t compare BMW to Ineos…..LONG track record compared to Ineos. Time will tell I guess.

 

[CrazyOldMan]

Wallabies. All. The. Wallabies. Someone, please mount flame throwers on your IG and run over a Tesla, just as a palate cleanser. This discussion never goes anywhere. Here’s the answer - if that happens, our IG’s will be unsupported and exotic specialty vehicles - eventually someone will break the code base, and spare parts will be impossible to find. Probably bespoke, milled by a family of trolls in Finland who demand the sacrifice of your firstborn. There - we hashed it all out. Aaaaaaaanyhooooooooow - wallabies.

 

[WanderingSniper]

I truly don’t think there is anything wrong with a simple Mind exercise of “what if”. A lot of people just put their heads in the sand and hope for the best. Good for them but hope isn’t a plan. I thought about what would happen if they folded too. In the end I trust we will find the parts we need and they will sell us the code and scanners since they won’t care anymore. Everything else these days will come from after market support. At least I won’t have to drive two hours to a dealer.

 

[bigleonski]

I truly don’t think there is anything wrong with a simple Mind exercise of “what if”. A lot of people just put their heads in the sand and hope for the best. Good for them but hope isn’t a plan. I thought about what would happen if they folded too. In the end I trust we will find the parts we need and they will sell us the code and scanners since they won’t care anymore. Everything else these days will come from after market support. At least I won’t have to drive two hours to a dealer.

But it’s a bit like asking what happens if there’s no internet or electricity tomorrow because of a global terrorist event, or if a meteor strikes.
You can either hope it doesn’t happen or somehow deal with it if it does, or you can go full doomsday prepper and build an underground bunker to live in for the next 10 years.
Each to his/her own I suppose. Either way, adding a few more words to the internet and scaring young children (or in this case old men) isn’t going to give you a solution.

 

[Shopkeep]

But it’s a bit like asking what happens if there’s no internet or electricity tomorrow because of a global terrorist event, or if a meteor strikes.
You can either hope it doesn’t happen or somehow deal with it if it does, or you can go full doomsday prepper and build an underground bunker to live in for the next 10 years.
Each to his/her own I suppose. Either way, adding a few more words to the internet and scaring young children (or in this case old men) isn’t going to give you a solution.

My Grenadier is part of my doomsday prepping, now all I need is the underground bunker. Not sure the warranty will cover damage due to 5G radiation and zombie impacts anyway.