Diesel Diesel Oil Specification Thread (B57 Engines)

[Krabby]

Potentially dumb question-the on-and off-road volume is half a liter. I can see how the level would need to be higher when off roading (maybe to prevent starvation at certain angles, etc.), but once you add that 1/2 l, won’t your on-road level be too high? If I have a decent tarmac run to get to wherever I’m heading, can that extra oil do my engine harm? If not, why the difference at all?

 

[Eric]

Potentially dumb question-the on-and off-road volume is half a liter. I can see how the level would need to be higher when off roading (maybe to prevent starvation at certain angles, etc.), but once you add that 1/2 l, won’t your on-road level be too high? If I have a decent tarmac run to get to wherever I’m heading, can that extra oil do my engine harm? If not, why the difference at all?

Yes I have been considering this dichotomy. If it requires an extra 1/2 l for off road are you met to take it out again when reverting to on road use. Obviously not so the on road reading must still be OK within tolerances. So if it is OK why not maintain the same level for both since that is what you are doing by default. It needs some more Ineos clarity

 

[Krabby]

Yes I have been considering this dichotomy. If it requires an extra 1/2 l for off road are you met to take it out again when reverting to on road use. Obviously not so the on road reading must still be OK within tolerances. So if it is OK why not maintain the same level for both since that is what you are doing by default. It needs some more Ineos clarity

Exactly! Hopefully we’ll get some technical details in due time.

 

[bakepl]

i am aware of the 500ml needed for off road , at this point the gren just got the same fill as it came from factory . the extra 100ml i put in is what is held in the oil filter . in my opinion is not going to harm anything . hence the 7.1 fill and not the 7 .

Great write up thanks, did you take a look at the oil dipstick before/after for reference? Any comments from your dealer about diy maintenance? My dealer has said 15000klm or 12 months between services but the distance is too long for heavy duty driving imho so I'll be looking at around half this I'm thinking.

 

[Tinki]

Great write up thanks, did you take a look at the oil dipstick before/after for reference? Any comments from your dealer about diy maintenance? My dealer has said 15000klm or 12 months between services but the distance is too long for heavy duty driving imho so I'll be looking at around half this I'm thinking.

To be honest with you i did not bother with the dipstick . They said not to use it so i ignored it . But you are right i might be a good reference .
I know the service interval they said 15k or 12 months which ever comes first . But i usually do my own services in between their intervals . I do roughly 10-13 k miles a year . My diesels get an oil change ever 3k miles Irrespective of the dealer recommendation. Once the warning for service comes on the car also goes to the dealer . Again this is what i do , might be excessive but i see it as cheap insurance .

 

[bakepl]

To be honest with you i did not bother with the dipstick . They said not to use it so i ignored it . But you are right i might be a good reference .
I know the service interval they said 15k or 12 months which ever comes first . But i usually do my own services in between their intervals . I do roughly 10-13 k miles a year . My diesels get an oil change ever 3k miles Irrespective of the dealer recommendation. Once the warning for service comes on the car also goes to the dealer . Again this is what i do , might be excessive but i see it as cheap insurance .

100%. I think it's great that there's a dipstick as that's what I'm accustomed to but will get used to the electronic version - despite the advice to add 500ml (or not). What I find interesting is that they went to the trouble of making the dipstick available and then say don't use it.. just bizarre?

 

[Tinki]

100%. I think it's great that there's a dipstick as that's what I'm accustomed to but will get used to the electronic version - despite the advice to add 500ml (or not). What I find interesting is that they went to the trouble of making the dipstick available and then say don't use it.. just bizarre?

I think they might had changed the oil sump on the stock engine and was an extra cost to delete the dip stick . Just speculating here ……

 

[emax]

As for the difference between 7 and 7.1 liters, does the 7 liters include the extra amount for an oil filter change?

And as for off-road and on-road oil levels: if I'm driving off-road through a flat desert, i.e. with sand but without steep slopes, would I need the off-road oil level or the on-road oil level?

This is more of a rhetorical question, as I think the difference is only political in nature, and therefore nonsense.

When they publish the fuel economy of the car, they are all intimidated by the billions of dollars in fines that have been imposed in the past related to the diesel "scandal". So they try to be as accurate as possible with respect to the rules. But how can you publish lower consumption without being criminal?

One trick to lowering official fuel consumption is to leave less oil in the engine, because more oil causes more pan losses. So they've invented an "on-road oil level" and an "off-road oil level" that will, on average (with usually a trend to on road conditions) reduce fuel consumption and thus CO2 emissions and therefore reduce the compensation payments.

Yes, this is all conjecture. But I can think back and forth and always come to the same conclusion: there is no technical explanation, it must be some political nonsense. Because it can't be that I first have to drain half a liter of oil when I come from off road terrain, right? That would just be ridiculous, what a bullshit.

 

[DCPU]

Maybe the simple answer is if you save 500ml of oil on 25,000 vehicles per annum, you save a decent amount of money.

Although it's not a good message if you are shipping tough off road vehicles that actually shouldn't be offroaded in the state they leave the factory.

 

[Wilaspira]

First oil change for the Gren is in the books . 1000 miles deayed from when i wanted to do it but anyway . As fas as oil changes go it’s pretty easy like any bmw . Tools you will need :
View attachment 7819679
Torque wrench for the housing 25Nm if you believe in these things .
Extension of your choosing ( housing is pretty deep )
32mm socket for oil housing (any 32mm will do)
17mm socket for the sump plug
Wrench to turn them with
Pick to get the o ring out of the filter housing
You may need also a universal joint the housing is at an odd angle and your extension might hit the fuse box on the side of the wing ( i got away with it with wobble extension ) .

Housing location :
View attachment 7819680
if your are doing your own oil expect to burn your hand on the engine. Don't ask me how i know .
View attachment 7819681
Oil filter and housing out of the car
View attachment 7819682
Factory filter . Same marking exactly as the one in the kit i posted above .
View attachment 7819683
Exchange o-ring on housing ( use a pick easiest way i found )

Then place housing back and torque to 25Nm .

The sump plug is 17mm . Sorry forgot to check the thread pitch i know someone will ask . My bad .

When taking the sump plug make sure the crash washer comes with it . The factory uses an aluminium one instead of copper and it usually stays on the pan . Make sure to remove it before putting the sump plug back in .
View attachment 7819684
Oil fill for the diesel is 7.1L at least that is how much i put in it and it seemed to like it .

When measuring the oil level the car likes all doors to be closed , on level ground , and in park or neutral .
View attachment 7819685
It revs a bit up to 1.1k and takes about 40 seconds .
View attachment 7819686
Thats it .
Sorry not a lot of pictures of the underside because i got caught in the rain . Classic .
Hope this helps .

Many thanks for sharing this. Am I right to assume you drained oil out of the bottom of the sump rather than sucking the oil out from the top of the engine. For some reason I had a recollection that sucking out was what was specified and that to do this required a suitable collector/sucker? In any event, my preference, if it doesn’t have any downside, would be to do what I have always done and drain from below. In that context, is the sump plug pretty obvious and accessible eg did any underside panels have to come off? Did you replace the crush washer with a new copper one and if so what diameter internal (I am guessing 17mm but since I’m not mechanical I thought I had better check) and width of band for the metal ring did you use? Cheers

 

[Tinki]

Many thanks for sharing this. Am I right to assume you drained oil out of the bottom of the sump rather than sucking the oil out from the top of the engine. For some reason I had a recollection that sucking out was what was specified and that to do this required a suitable collector/sucker? In any event, my preference, if it doesn’t have any downside, would be to do what I have always done and drain from below. In that context, is the sump plug pretty obvious and accessible eg did any underside panels have to come off? Did you replace the crush washer with a new copper one and if so what diameter internal (I am guessing 17mm but since I’m not mechanical I thought I had better check) and width of band for the metal ring did you use? Cheers

Hello Friend ,
Sump plug is dead obvious . Only other plug between front of the engine and plastic gear box sump .

I opened the drain plug the same way i have been doing for years to all my cars .

No panels need to come off .

Crush washer comes with the filter along with the oil housing oring and gets replaced at every oil change . Unlikley internal diameter to be 17mm . The socket is 17mm the thead is more likely to be m12 flavour . So with out me digging to find the old washer i would bet internal diameter is around that .

Hope it helps .

 

[Wilaspira]

Hello Friend ,
Sump plug is dead obvious . Only other plug between front of the engine and plastic gear box sump .

I opened the drain plug the same way i have been doing for years to all my cars .

No panels need to come off .

Crush washer comes with the filter along with the oil housing oring and gets replaced at every oil change . Unlikley internal diameter to be 17mm . The socket is 17mm the thead is more likely to be m12 flavour . So with out me digging to find the old washer i would bet internal diameter is around that .

Hope it helps .

Thank you

 

[DaveB]

Many thanks for sharing this. Am I right to assume you drained oil out of the bottom of the sump rather than sucking the oil out from the top of the engine. For some reason I had a recollection that sucking out was what was specified and that to do this required a suitable collector/sucker? In any event, my preference, if it doesn’t have any downside, would be to do what I have always done and drain from below. In that context, is the sump plug pretty obvious and accessible eg did any underside panels have to come off? Did you replace the crush washer with a new copper one and if so what diameter internal (I am guessing 17mm but since I’m not mechanical I thought I had better check) and width of band for the metal ring did you use? Cheers

Same engine gets mounted in a wide range of vehicles, in different positions and different orientations.
This may lead to the sump plug not being at the lowest point of the engine in some applications.
At the end of the day if they state that to maintain warranty you need to follow their maintenance instructions then that is exactly what you should do.
The old "I have done it that way for the last 50 years your honour" doesn't win any legal battles.
The crank position sensor on my Mazda BT50 failed (a known fault) and the first question they asked was if the oil changes had been done correctly and by a qualified person.

 

[MrMike]

To be honest with you i did not bother with the dipstick . They said not to use it so i ignored it . But you are right i might be a good reference .
I know the service interval they said 15k or 12 months which ever comes first . But i usually do my own services in between their intervals . I do roughly 10-13 k miles a year . My diesels get an oil change ever 3k miles Irrespective of the dealer recommendation. Once the warning for service comes on the car also goes to the dealer . Again this is what i do , might be excessive but i see it as cheap insurance .

My TD 200 series Toyota has had 5000klm service intervals it's whole life (285k klms) , oil is still transparent when I change it, EGR block also helps

 

[Wilaspira]

Oil change done (N1 Diesel) at just over 1,400 miles. Thanks to Tinki for the guidance. I used precisely the same Valvoline oil (the BMW B57 friendly one cost c£40/5 litres) and the same BMW oil filter cartridge kit (purchasable on ebay for c£25) which was identical (eg by part numbers etc) to that which was removed. Vehicle took 7.1 litres and post warming it up again, parking it level with the engine on but in neutral, I did post refill oil level check and got "ok" readings for both on and off road parameters!

One thought was whether 25nm torque is too much for oil filter housing cap (I'm guessing perhaps stiff, slightly more than v strong finger tight eg c10-15nm might be sufficient?) and should the sump plug torque be 25nm? Anyone seen any Ineos workshop maintenance guidance regarding this?

 

[Tinki]

Oil change done (N1 Diesel) at just over 1,400 miles. Thanks to Tinki for the guidance. I used precisely the same Valvoline oil (the BMW B57 friendly one cost c£40/5 litres) and the same BMW oil filter cartridge kit (purchasable on ebay for c£25) which was identical (eg by part numbers etc) to that which was removed. Vehicle took 7.1 litres and post warming it up again, parking it level with the engine on but in neutral, I did post refill oil level check and got "ok" readings for both on and off road parameters!

One thought was whether 25nm torque is too much for oil filter housing cap (I'm guessing perhaps stiff, slightly more than v strong finger tight eg c10-15nm might be sufficient?) and should the sump plug torque be 25nm? Anyone seen any Ineos workshop maintenance guidance regarding this?

Glad you found it helpful. If i am not mistaken the 25Nm of the oil filter housing was printed on it . As for the sump plug i do it by feel just to bottom out .

 

[DCPU]

Vehicle took 7.1 litres and post warming it up again, parking it level with the engine on but in neutral, I did post refill oil level check and got "ok" readings for both on and off road parameters!

So your 7.1L got 2 x OK, but 7.1L @Tinki got 1 x OK & 500ml required. I wonder if that's down to sensor tolerance/software calculation. Is 500ml the minimum quantity advised?

 

[Wilaspira]

So your 7.1L got 2 x OK, but 7.1L @Tinki got 1 x OK & 500ml required. I wonder if that's down to sensor tolerance/software calculation. Is 500ml the minimum quantity advised?

Yep re two different outcomes albeit ostensibly same inputs. Don’t know re 500ml being a minimum

 

[Tomdoc]

Have contacted these guys in UK:

Home :: Morris Lubricants

Leading UK manufacturer of world-class lubricants and associated products. A Tradition in Excellence since 1869

www.morrislubricants.co.uk

UK based specialist company with a huge range of products.

We will see what they say.....

 

[Eric]

Have contacted these guys in UK:

Home :: Morris Lubricants

Leading UK manufacturer of world-class lubricants and associated products. A Tradition in Excellence since 1869

www.morrislubricants.co.uk

UK based specialist company with a huge range of products.

We will see what they say.....

I use them for small agricultural machinery, but hadn't considered them for automotive use. Be interested to see what they say.