Carexpert.com.au review (Australia)

2023 Ineos Grenadier review

Not only does it live up to the original Land Rover Defender brief, the Grenadier goes above and beyond but it's not perfect.

www.carexpert.com.au

image added. @Stu_Barnes

 

[Beormund]

you can see the problem here, looks more like the wiper mount meeds moving over



View attachment 7802632

But surely this is basic stuff??

 

[stickshifter]

This is a great read, and a much more comprehensive review than TG. Thanks for posting! A few reactions:

(1) Toyota has had 4-wheel drive controls on the ceiling for a long time in the 4-Runner, as have other brands. In the 4-Runner, these include the controls for the rear diff lock, hill descent control, A-Trac, and crawl control. While the Grenadier has more controls on the ceiling than other vehicles, this is not as innovative as the author seems to believe.

(2) We are getting a clearer idea of the price increase - roughly 14%. I'm pretty jealous of our friends in Europe and Aus who are part of the first round of deliveries.

(3) I am jealous of people receiving a 2023 model for another reason: 2024 models are getting autonomous emergency braking (AEB). To me, this is horrible news. It actually has me considering buying something different right now. It is pretty clear that there will soon be a mandate for all new vehicles to be equipped with AEB, so I don't blame Ineos, I blame the government, and all the distracted drivers who have brought us to this point. Police should be enforcing laws against texting and driving, and other forms of distraction, so that legislation isn't passed that caters to the lowest common denominator. I anticipated a lack of AEB in the Grenadier, and this was a major draw for me. I know other folk will feel very differently about AEB - to each their own.

(4) I know a lot of people feel like the footrest intrusion into the right foot well isn't a big deal, but - given that the vehicle was engineered from scratch - I'm surprised by this design element. My wife never liked the limited space in the passenger foot well of the Wrangler, and is so much happier in the 4-Runner. I'm happy that the North American market gets a Grenadier with LHD, but I know my wife won't love the room in the passenger foot well on long trips.

(5) Overall, the driving impressions are really positive. It is great to hear positive reports about the suspension on-road, and about acceleration (especially in the gas version, which is the only version we are getting in N. America).

(6) I don't think the author has a lot of experience driving vehicles with recirculating ball steering (RBS). Comments about the steering need to be put into proper context. Its fine if you want to compare the steering in the Grenadier to SUVs with different steering design, because some readers who have never owned a vehicle with RBS need to understand what they are getting into, but you also need to compare it to other vehicles with RBS, like the Wrangler. Does the Grenadier wander on the highway as much as a Wrangler? Is there as much play in the steering wheel as in a Wrangler?

Overall, a really good review.

 

[Michael H.]

“Trailmaster”
Contrast nose wrap
Old pricing details for options
Car Expert

 

[CEMechanic]

Seems they copied the old Defender wiper coverage 100%. This one has a similar blind spot on the driver‘s side. Just the A-pillars are so flimsy, that the total blind spot is not as big as on the Grenadier.
They will not get better coverage with the windscreen that is so wide but also relatively low profile compared to a car where the screen has more rake and with this allows for bigger wipers.
Either they stay traditional, see picture attached, or add a third wiper arm a la Magirus D-type forward control cab or a fancy slide-rotate mechanism like on the Mercedes W124. The latter two are unlikely at this stage.

On the other two points about low range engagement and steering feel the writer picked up on, I can confirm these from a 15 minute slow speed test drive on a Moto-Cross course with LUEG in October.
Also on the PT2 Diesel we tested it was near impossible to shift flrom low to high without crunching gears. I asked the accompanying Ineos driver if I should not just shut down the engine before we force the transfer box into gear - he said no, not necessary and forced the lever into gear under loud crunching. As so often in vehicle development, if you detect a problem, you will find it on other vehicles as well. There is nothing like a fluke.

Lastly, the steering feel on my low speed 10-15 mph test drive could be compared to a tractor, loader, off-road vehicle. The steering would not self-centre after a corner and it was required to pull the wheels back into the straight line. I‘d say this one felt odd, even when compared to a Discovery 3 or old Defender, which I know quite well.
If proper acceleration out of the corner and higher speeds would have improved this, I can’t say for lack of opportunity to drive on-road. Naturally this behaviour should improve with higher speeds.

Oh yeah, first post and I will do a proper intro. Been a candid reader over the last months.

 

[AnD3rew]

View attachment 7802616

2023 Ineos Grenadier review

Not only does it live up to the original Land Rover Defender brief, the Grenadier goes above and beyond but it's not perfect.

www.carexpert.com.au

image added. @Stu_Barnes

Pretty good comprehensive review. I guess in here the stuff he covers is really stuff that ee know from our own drives and inspections and sharing here, but we are it is true very inveested so it’s good to hear a fresh set of eyes view of it all, and what someone who reviews cars for a living thinks. I would say 8.6 is a pretty stellar rating. The takeaways for me are how impressed these early reviews are with it’s on road performance which really is the new information. I guess the only other really new thing is the wiper issue. That does seem a bit of an oversight. But otherwise I’m pretty happy with that. On my drive which included a few tight turns and manoeuvres I didn’t notice the steering to be an issue at all.

 

[Davman]

Carexpert is an independent car site.
8.6 is an outstanding result, from an extremely experienced reviewer ( albeit not a hardcore off-road guy)

They give the 110 defender the same mark, but main competitors for Australian dollars like the LC300, Ford Ranger etc etc all scored noticeably less.
This honest scoring is what you get when journalists are not hamstrung by the advertising $’s of the huge multinational car companies.

 

[DaveB]

“Trailmaster”
Contrast nose wrap
Old pricing details for options
Car Expert

Yes I found it highly annoying that there were so many errors and a fair bit of plagiarism
Taking into account he is a professional journalist/writer

This whole paragraph could use some punctuation

Pretty sure he meant manufacturing rights or licenses

Assuming he meant contract not hire

That sentence doesn't make sense from the comma onwards
it should have been a Full stop, and next sentence start with "That is perhaps"
That is perhaps what the Grenadier is here to do, provide a fully..........


In in

Is it an issue or isn't it?


I read elsewhere that the door handles were frozen in ice

Again a contradiction in one sentence.
I also found you get tossed around a lot in the back

I have driven the vehicle twice on completely different tracks and had zero issues with the steering
I drive a lot of different vehicles though

 

[Tazzieman]

No reason to cancel your order after reading that. The issues seem very minor to me.

 

[AnD3rew]

Yes I found it highly annoying that there were so many errors and a fair bit of plagiarism
Taking into account he is a professional journalist/writer

This whole paragraph could use some punctuation
View attachment 7802661
Pretty sure he meant manufacturing rights or licenses
View attachment 7802662
Assuming he meant contract not hire
View attachment 7802663
That sentence doesn't make sense from the comma onwards
it should have been a Full stop, and next sentence start with "That is perhaps"
That is perhaps what the Grenadier is here to do, provide a fully..........
View attachment 7802664

In in
View attachment 7802666
Is it an issue or isn't it?
View attachment 7802667

I read elsewhere that the door handles were frozen in ice
View attachment 7802668
Again a contradiction in one sentence.
I also found you get tossed around a lot in the back
View attachment 7802669
I have driven the vehicle twice on completely different tracks and had zero issues with the steering
I drive a lot of different vehicles though
View attachment 7802670

Hey, he’s a car guy, not a literature critic

 

[Tazzieman]

Hey, he’s a car guy, not a literature critic

I presume he can actually change a wiper then; the last sentence in his review being tongue in cheek

 

[bigleonski]

Yes I found it highly annoying that there were so many errors and a fair bit of plagiarism
Taking into account he is a professional journalist/writer

This whole paragraph could use some punctuation
View attachment 7802661
Pretty sure he meant manufacturing rights or licenses
View attachment 7802662
Assuming he meant contract not hire
View attachment 7802663
That sentence doesn't make sense from the comma onwards
it should have been a Full stop, and next sentence start with "That is perhaps"
That is perhaps what the Grenadier is here to do, provide a fully..........
View attachment 7802664

In in
View attachment 7802666
Is it an issue or isn't it?
View attachment 7802667

I read elsewhere that the door handles were frozen in ice
View attachment 7802668
Again a contradiction in one sentence.
I also found you get tossed around a lot in the back
View attachment 7802669
I have driven the vehicle twice on completely different tracks and had zero issues with the steering
I drive a lot of different vehicles though
View attachment 7802670

Gees Dave, after a post like that I think you need another break……

 

[DaveB]

Hey, he’s a car guy, not a literature critic

Yes I understand but so little attention to detail in the writing and even in the technical details further down
It was cleared up 12 months ago that we were getting the 50mm 2" tow hitch but he still lists the 1"7/8
He has a Bachelors Degree and is a a part time uni professor.

 

[AnD3rew]

Yes I understand but so little attention to detail in the writing and even in the technical details further down
It was cleared up 12 months ago that we were getting the 50mm 2" tow hitch but he still lists the 1"7/8
He has a Bachelors Degree and is a a part time uni professor.

I have 2 bachelors and a Masters and I write like shit.

 

[Tazzieman]

He has a Bachelors Degree and is a a part time uni professor.

That is no special achievement , though it might sound so.

 

[DaveB]

I have 2 bachelors and a Masters and I write like shit.

I left school and home when I was 15 and don't purport to be a literary scholar

 

[AnD3rew]

I left school and home when I was 15 and don't purport to be a literary scholar

You are better than me, I suspect

 

[Tazzieman]

Don't derail the thread!
It's just about at the end of the line anyway. All passengers for the next review please assemble on the platform

 

[Bushguide]

I have 2 bachelors and a Masters and I write like shit.

I write like shit and barely managed to graduate from the School of Hard Knocks.

 

[DaveB]

You are better than me, I suspect

I am lucky to be a quick learner

 

[DaveB]

I write like shit and barely managed to graduate from the School of Hard Knocks.

My handwriting is pretty crap