Leaking Safari Roof and Door Seals Flooding The Car And other Leaks and Problems

nodric · May 29, 2024

UPDATE: No more leaks and no more deluges. The front door seal alignment appears to be the issue. Once the dealer got them lined up (inner and outer door seals) it cured the deluge issue. I am traveling currently and using a ton of screen wash (the blue stuff) and it's getting into the door shut/jam, but nothing between the seals, which indicates they are, ahem, sealing!

Will continue to report. The design issue with the rubber gutter trim flows water into the A pillar, but the seals are doing their job.

BTW: 80+ MPH (Texas baby!) and fuel consumption hitting 12mpg

(14.41 UK MPG). Usual is 15-17 MPG (18-20 UK MPG). 70 and below average 13-14 (15-16 UK).

Zimm · May 30, 2024

A thought occurred to me, concerning the rows of grens that sit waiting in the lot. I wonder how many have been leaking this whole time.

Headoutside · May 30, 2024

nodric said:
UPDATE: No more leaks and no more deluges. The front door seal alignment appears to be the issue. Once the dealer got them lined up (inner and outer door seals) it cured the deluge issue. I am traveling currently and using a ton of screen wash (the blue stuff) and it's getting into the door shut/jam, but nothing between the seals, which indicates they are, ahem, sealing!

Will continue to report. The design issue with the rubber gutter trim flows water into the A pillar, but the seals are doing their job.

BTW: 80+ MPH (Texas baby!) and fuel consumption hitting 12mpg (14.41 UK MPG). Usual is 15-17 MPG (18-20 UK MPG). 70 and below average 13-14 (15-16 UK).

After a rainy day at work today, I drove off to have a decent amount of water pour from the housing in front of the rear view mirror. The head liner between, and in front of, the safari windows was soaked. What was the fix for your window leak, and did it work? The metal trim inside the window seals was pretty dry when I lifted the windows up.

anand · May 30, 2024

Headoutside said:
After a rainy day at work today, I drove off to have a decent amount of water pour from the housing in front of the rear view mirror. The head liner between, and in front of, the safari windows was soaked. What was the fix for your window leak, and did it work? The metal trim inside the window seals was pretty dry when I lifted the windows up.

Leaking Sunroof Seals

A problem has occurred on a small number of the affected vehicles where water may leak past the Sunroof Seal and into the vehicle Click on the download button for more details.

www.theineosforum.com

Headoutside · May 30, 2024

anand said:
Leaking Sunroof Seals

A problem has occurred on a small number of the affected vehicles where water may leak past the Sunroof Seal and into the vehicle Click on the download button for more details.

www.theineosforum.com

Thank you, Anand! I'll call the dealership tomorrow to schedule the repair. I really appreciate you supplying the link

Krabby · May 31, 2024

I love that all the TSBs say things like "a small number" or just "a few" vehicles have been affected.

MTNDOG · May 31, 2024

Krabby said:
I love that all the TSBs say things like "a small number" or just "a few" vehicles have been affected.

Meaning we have no idea really how many, so here is how to fix it. I would like to think mine sitting outside at the Port of Tacoma and then at the dealership for a few months would have been a good test of the safari window seals. The one option box, I probably would uncheck, if I could go back and reorder.

landmannnn · May 31, 2024

Krabby said:
I love that all the TSBs say things like "a small number" or just "a few" vehicles have been affected.

Typical motor trade - they never tell the truth. You would have thought a new manufacturer wouldn't have inherited such a bunch of blatant liars.

Headoutside · Jun 1, 2024

This forum continues to contribute GREATLY to my joy of ownership- thanks again all for diffusing potential frustration or disappointment. Then again, I'm smitten with the Grenadier...

nodric · Jun 1, 2024

Headoutside said:
After a rainy day at work today, I drove off to have a decent amount of water pour from the housing in front of the rear view mirror. The head liner between, and in front of, the safari windows was soaked. What was the fix for your window leak, and did it work? The metal trim inside the window seals was pretty dry when I lifted the windows up.

The sunroof fix is to remove the glass and trims and then "glue" the seals in place and reassemble. They did that to mine.

nodric · Jun 1, 2024

Headoutside said:
This forum continues to contribute GREATLY to my joy of ownership- thanks again all for diffusing potential frustration or disappointment. Then again, I'm smitten with the Grenadier...

I have to agree. After 2000 miles driven in the last week as I continue around Texas all I can say is the car is phenomenal on and off road! I will write trip report in a different thread, but despite its problems, and

customer service from Ineos I would not want to let the car go!

Anecdotally. A good friend from South Africa told me his best friend is best mates with Sir Jim! He even sent a photo to him of my Grenadier on the banks of the Rio Grande. Who knows, maybe one day I can have a chat with the man himself!

nodric · Jun 8, 2024

My final update to this thread for those that coming looking later.

The water pooling/collecting in the door shuts/jams and related water ingress into the footwells getting under the trims on the sills is caused by a misalignment of the door seals. The fix that has been documented involves the dealer using chalk powder to ensure the inner and outer door seals/gaskets are aligned.

The de-lamination (fancy word for glue not sticking) is a secondary issue and is resolved by using a secondary adhesive to re-stick the seals to the door. If the de-lamination is significant then the dealer is directed to replace the door seal. Even then the adhesion is poor and may still need additional adhesive applying.

The reason the seal alignment is so critical is the badly designed roof trim (rubber piece top corners of the windshield) ducts water into the A pillar channel and overwhelms the door seals. If there is any misalignment or gap caused by lack of adhesion, this fills the area between the two door seals with water. There it sits leaking into the car and causing a deluge and foot wash when you open the door, as the collected water gushes free.

Alignment will also be an issue for water ingress when wading.

As of the date of this post my Grenadier has been out in multiple rain storms with zero water ingress. The problem is solved. Now onto the next one - AC drips into the footwell and occasional software glitches (CarPlay randomly disconnects and when I hit a big bump I get a random bong like the low fuel warning, but no indicator lights or warning messages).

Karearea · Jun 8, 2024

nodric said:
My final update to this thread for those that coming looking later.

The water pooling/collecting in the door shuts/jams and related water ingress into the footwells getting under the trims on the sills is caused by a misalignment of the door seals. The fix that has been documented involves the dealer using chalk powder to ensure the inner and outer door seals/gaskets are aligned.

The de-lamination (fancy word for glue not sticking) is a secondary issue and is resolved by using a secondary adhesive to re-stick the seals to the door. If the de-lamination is significant then the dealer is directed to replace the door seal. Even then the adhesion is poor and may still need additional adhesive applying.

The reason the seal alignment is so critical is the badly designed roof trim (rubber piece top corners of the windshield) ducts water into the A pillar channel and overwhelms the door seals. If there is any misalignment or gap caused by lack of adhesion, this fills the area between the two door seals with water. There it sits leaking into the car and causing a deluge and foot wash when you open the door, as the collected water gushes free.

Alignment will also be an issue for water ingress when wading.

As of the date of this post my Grenadier has been out in multiple rain storms with zero water ingress. The problem is solved. Now onto the next one - AC drips into the footwell and occasional software glitches (CarPlay randomly disconnects and when I hit a big bump I get a random bong like the low fuel warning, but no indicator lights or warning messages).

I’m really pleased that your boot wash problem is solved and personally I really appreciate the detailed descriptions you have frequently used to describe the issues and attempts at resolving the problem!
I’m hoping to arrive at a similar conclusion myself soon but fear it will be a “DIY” solution due to my global location and local separation from my supportive dealer.
Great work and good luck with the other issues!
I LOVE Shitake and live with her personality traits with a wonderous eye

Karearea · Jun 23, 2024

HEAVY rain here last night and we now have water ingressing to the footwell area and Pooling around wiring looms etc…

Anyone else have this level of water intrusion?
I noticed that when attempting to remove the trim around the bonnet/hood release there seemed to be a new release of water. I’m wondering if I have water getting in elsewhere

NO Safari Windows btw

JSDKMS! · Jun 23, 2024

nodric said:
My final update to this thread for those that coming looking later.

The water pooling/collecting in the door shuts/jams and related water ingress into the footwells getting under the trims on the sills is caused by a misalignment of the door seals. The fix that has been documented involves the dealer using chalk powder to ensure the inner and outer door seals/gaskets are aligned.

The de-lamination (fancy word for glue not sticking) is a secondary issue and is resolved by using a secondary adhesive to re-stick the seals to the door. If the de-lamination is significant then the dealer is directed to replace the door seal. Even then the adhesion is poor and may still need additional adhesive applying.

The reason the seal alignment is so critical is the badly designed roof trim (rubber piece top corners of the windshield) ducts water into the A pillar channel and overwhelms the door seals. If there is any misalignment or gap caused by lack of adhesion, this fills the area between the two door seals with water. There it sits leaking into the car and causing a deluge and foot wash when you open the door, as the collected water gushes free.

Alignment will also be an issue for water ingress when wading.

As of the date of this post my Grenadier has been out in multiple rain storms with zero water ingress. The problem is solved. Now onto the next one - AC drips into the footwell and occasional software glitches (CarPlay randomly disconnects and when I hit a big bump I get a random bong like the low fuel warning, but no indicator lights or warning messages).

Same with my Car Play - Please let me know if you get it sorted out

IGL · Jun 23, 2024

Heavy rain yesterday and wet feet. Surprisingly, this is a new "feature".

I hope that the loose rubber seal is the only cause.

landmannnn · Jun 23, 2024

Karearea said:
HEAVY rain here last night and we now have water ingressing to the footwell area and Pooling around wiring looms etc…
Anyone else have this level of water intrusion?
I noticed that when attempting to remove the trim around the bonnet/hood release there seemed to be a new release of water. I’m wondering if I have water getting in elsewhere
NO Safari Windows btw

Simple answer is yes with heavy rain.
Mine filled up the gap between the inner and outer sills which then overflowed into the cabin. A layer of water across the whole floor.

BigJock2024 · Jun 23, 2024

I am due to collect my beastie next weekend. This does scare me a little bit. The dealer has told me a number of rectification procedures need to be carried out and these have all been done over the past week. He will go through them all with me when I collect.

I know that Ineos were replicating the Defender with this vehicle, and all this reminds me of the 110 I had which actually came with an additional manual called "Defender Water Ingress - Service Rectification Procedures".

Firstly it sets out the 11 *known* sources of water ingression and then details how to fix them. Quite incredible that a new vehicle would be delivered in this condition! I wonder if Ineos have gone a bit too close...! For those interested, the manual can be found here. State of the art reprographics throughout...

https://www.landroverweb.com/Pdf-files/Manuals/Land_Rover_Defender_Water_Ingress_Manual.pdf

The new LR Discovery 5 has a known reputation for dowsing the driver's right arm and all the door electrical switchgear with rainwater if you open the window after it's been sitting in a heavy shower... Seems humankind can do a trip to the moon, but not seal a car door..

Best of luck nodric - I hope you can come back and tell us once it's all sorted.

rovie · Jun 23, 2024

I can say from experience that it is only due to the loose seal. I had it once last summer. I looked at the seal and some parts of them were no longer glued on. I fixed them with 3M Power Tape. Nothing has happened since then. The punching out that INEOS and the dealers do does not eliminate the cause. That's why I specifically told my dealer not to follow INEOS' instructions and cut out the seal. Then I'll get uncomfortable.

Tom109 · Jun 23, 2024

I have not had the water pooling but I decided to check my door seals anyway, and found all four had gaps behind the door check straps. Three of the four pushed back in place and the adhesive appears to hold, passenger door it will not stick. I'll add all door seals to the next dealer visit list.

Note: I need to check the cargo door seals....

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