Steering and Poor Stability

bigleonski · Feb 15, 2024

DaveB said:
You thinking your having steering problems.
I am having steer problems of a different kind.
This steer didn't take too kindly of me driving through his cave.
I had to nudge him with my bull bar (despite the fact he is clearly no longer a bull) and then he head butted the side of my vehicle and luckily he hit the side bar not the panel.

View attachment 7844131 View attachment 7844132 View attachment 7844133 View attachment 7844135 View attachment 7844136

Hmmmm, me thinks someone was a little impatient. You could have gotten out of your car and shooed it if you were in a hurry.

DaveB · Feb 15, 2024

bigleonski said:
Hmmmm, me thinks someone was a little impatient. You could have gotten out of your car and shooed it if you were in a hurry.

That's why we have bull bars
I was on my way to a meeting at a Gold Mine and the customer suggested this short cut.

bigleonski · Feb 15, 2024

DaveB said:
That's why we have bull bars
I was on my way to a meeting at a Gold Mine and the customer suggested this short cut.

I'd think the grazier would have a different view.

Boolboonda? Been a long time since I was up there.

and1939 · Feb 15, 2024

Krabby said:
Drop them down you should feel a huge difference.

Yes big help.

Now how about the 1 inch or so play in the steering wheel. Has anyone figured that out yet. My steering wheel appears to be slight off center when I am driving. Skued to the left. But when I come to a stop and I turn on the off road diagnostic I can get it to 0 deg and it's dead on just moves about an inch or so left to right before any steering starts..

Skydance · Feb 15, 2024

and1939 said:
Yes big help.

Now how about the 1 inch or so play in the steering wheel. Has anyone figured that out yet. My steering wheel appears to be slight off center when I am driving. Skued to the left. But when I come to a stop and I turn on the off road diagnostic I can get it to 0 deg and it's dead on just moves about an inch or so left to right before any steering starts..

That’s normal for offroad live axle vehicles, however, it can be improved with wheel alignment by adjusting the steering drag link and making sure the steering is set straight. It’s the same on my Suzuki Jimny too.

Cheshire cat · Feb 15, 2024

I must be really lucky as I have absolutely no issues with the steering. It is marginally vaguer than an independent set up but, that's all.

anand · Feb 15, 2024

Cheshire cat said:
I must be really lucky as I have absolutely no issues with the steering. It is marginally vaguer than an independent set up but, that's all.

For what it's worth, I drove ~20 of the PTO2 vehicles extensively off road and almost all of them at some short-ish (<4 mile) distance on pavement at, we'll call it moderate speed. Every single one felt the same planted/stable/no vagueness/etc. 17s, 18s, KO2s, Bridgestones, all felt effectively the same. The only difference was if they were still aired down.

I think the "issues" are minimal at best in the big picture of all vehicles sold, and that much of it is PEBSWAS due to an expectancy of something different.

DaveB · Feb 15, 2024

Here is a demo of my steering and cruise control.
No problems whatsoever with having to constantly correct the steering.
K02 tyres at 37 PSI cold

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fw2CnkkcCb4

Korg · Mar 5, 2024

DaveB said:
Here is a demo of my steering and cruise control.
No problems whatsoever with having to constantly correct the steering.
K02 tyres at 37 PSI cold

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fw2CnkkcCb4

Want to swap Grenadiers?
I have clocked up around 1,000km so far and have steering concerns. I have lowered the tire pressures to 36 psi, had a full steering alignment to fix castor and camber and driving at 100kmh still does not feel safe - I have to constantly battle steering adjustments from understeer and then oversteer with a few cm's of play in the steering wheel. I will wait for some more km's to accrue and if still present talk to the dealer.

Catpaw4x4 · Mar 5, 2024

and1939 said:
Yes big help.

Now how about the 1 inch or so play in the steering wheel. Has anyone figured that out yet. My steering wheel appears to be slight off center when I am driving. Skued to the left. But when I come to a stop and I turn on the off road diagnostic I can get it to 0 deg and it's dead on just moves about an inch or so left to right before any steering starts..

Exactly the same issue here!

DaveB · Mar 6, 2024

Korg said:
Want to swap Grenadiers?
I have clocked up around 1,000km so far and have steering concerns. I have lowered the tire pressures to 36 psi, had a full steering alignment to fix castor and camber and driving at 100kmh still does not feel safe - I have to constantly battle steering adjustments from understeer and then oversteer with a few cm's of play in the steering wheel. I will wait for some more km's to accrue and if still present talk to the dealer.

Doesn't sound good.
I overtook a line of vehicles yesterday in the overtaking lane, in the rain at 145 kmh and felt fine.
Mine self centres pretty well so maybe I have one with the steering all correct.
It is still a handful at low speeds in carparks but i accept that as it is a 3 tonne truck.
I have commented part way through this video about the steering doing 100 kmh on a rural gravel road.
Sorry about the commentary, I'm not trying to be a Youtube influencer, just using the channel as somewhere to store, edit and share my travels with family and friends.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mqi1XwUAi2w

DaveB · Mar 6, 2024

Catpaw4x4 said:
Exactly the same issue here!

Most people are used to Rack & Pinion or electrical assisted steering systems not recirculating ball steering
Recirculating ball steering is significantly less precise and also has a lot of play
This video explains the difference and also ives a good description of potential problems.
we all should have steering as good as mine does however.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G6Hv6_mwkB8

[ Adam ] · Mar 6, 2024

Step 1 - get your alignment checked.

DenisM · Mar 6, 2024

Once the steering wheel is "loaded" off centre. for example when negotiating a constant radius bend, I find the steering sensitivity and tracking to be quite precise and stable. In the straight ahead position however it has a propensity to wander especially when in close proximity to very large transports at highway speeds.
I suspect a tweak of the electric power assistance e.g. slightly increase the pump pressure and reduce the response time in the straight ahead position would improve this.

Cheshire cat · Mar 6, 2024

If you are experiencing steering issues, you need to follow this up. It is not a characteristic of the standard vehicle. Yes, the steering is different, but should not be having any effect on confidence.

Tazzieman · Mar 6, 2024

Mine has been stable on gravel and bitumen , and recently towing a 2.5T van on twisty and damp roads.
AT tyres , appropriately inflated. Nothing to remotely alarm me.
So as has been said , if alignment is per factory specs it may be something else.

Skydance · Mar 6, 2024

Korg said:
Want to swap Grenadiers?
I have clocked up around 1,000km so far and have steering concerns. I have lowered the tire pressures to 36 psi, had a full steering alignment to fix castor and camber and driving at 100kmh still does not feel safe - I have to constantly battle steering adjustments from understeer and then oversteer with a few cm's of play in the steering wheel. I will wait for some more km's to accrue and if still present talk to the dealer.

With regards to the play in the steering. I have a Suzuki Jimny which I had the suspension lifted. The steering wheel was off set to the right whilst driving straight after this mod. Went to get wheel alignment many times at different garages but never been 100% satisfied as there was play in the steering (1 inch to each side), where it seems like it did not nothing and also the steering wheel would still be offset despite the computer said it was bang on and the garage to say everything is normal.

After many years of DIY messing around with the steering drag link, I find that the play in the steering wheel can be adjusted/dialled in to make it perfect. (Micro adjustments, lengthening the drag link if the steering is offset to the right). Hence why some owners have this issue and some don’t.

I have no play in my Grenadier, it responds and tracks straight but my steering wheel is offset to the right 5 degrees which is annoying. I am tempted to DIY the grenadier soon but first of all I need to buy a big spanner for the steering drag-link nut and know the torque specs.

DaveB · Mar 6, 2024

Skydance said:
With regards to the play in the steering. I have a Suzuki Jimny which I had the suspension lifted. The steering wheel was off set to the right whilst driving straight after this mod. Went to get wheel alignment many times at different garages but never been 100% satisfied as there was play in the steering (1 inch to each side), where it seems like it did not nothing and also the steering wheel would still be offset despite the computer said it was bang on and the garage to say everything is normal.

After many years of DIY messing around with the steering drag link, I find that the play in the steering wheel can be adjusted/dialled in to make it perfect. (Micro adjustments, lengthening the drag link if the steering is offset to the right). Hence why some owners have this issue and some don’t.

I have no play in my Grenadier, it responds and tracks straight but my steering wheel is offset to the right 5 degrees which is annoying. I am tempted to DIY the grenadier soon but first of all I need to buy a big spanner for the steering drag-link nut and know the torque specs.

I think my steering is off to the right by about 5 degrees n my Grenadier.
If I look down at the little red line on the top of my steering wheel it seems to be about 12;15pm on the clock
Initially it annoyed me.
Now i just don't look at it.
i have owned about 30 vehicles that had no little red line.
i had no idea if the steering wheel was perfect or not.

NoMoTaco · Mar 6, 2024

Im sure my anecdotal theory is about to be blasted and debunked, but if I may...

My steering wheel was off to the LEFT from factory, I had an alignment done (due to statements on here regarding many out of spec vehicles from factory) as well as my steering wheel angle corrected. And though it is better, there is still the slightest LEFTward orientation while driving.

I am noticing that several of those located in RHD vehicles (Left lane travel countries) are experiencing slight RIGHTward orientation of their steering wheel.

I am curious how much the crown of the road and the recirculating ball steering system are playing into this? Meaning that the slight bit of play in the steering due to its lack of precision and the slight pitch of the road from crown (Coupled with this red indicator on the wheel) might cause us to notice the wheel being "off"

I tested this by doing two thing:
-On a straight length of road with no oncoming traffic I went into the opposite lane traveling at about 50 mph, and boom, I was slightly to the RIGHT
-Went to a large open parking lot, and though I couldn't achieve high speed, seemed to be able to go dead straight with red line at 12 o'clock

Thoughts...?

Cheshire cat · Mar 6, 2024

Hi No

NoMoTaco said:
Im sure my anecdotal theory is about to be blasted and debunked, but if I may...

My steering wheel was off to the LEFT from factory, I had an alignment done (due to statements on here regarding many out of spec vehicles from factory) as well as my steering wheel angle corrected. And though it is better, there is still the slightest LEFTward orientation while driving.

I am noticing that several of those located in RHD vehicles (Left lane travel countries) are experiencing slight RIGHTward orientation of their steering wheel.

I am curious how much the crown of the road and the recirculating ball steering system are playing into this? Meaning that the slight bit of play in the steering due to its lack of precision and the slight pitch of the road from crown (Coupled with this red indicator on the wheel) might cause us to notice the wheel being "off"

I tested this by doing two thing:
-On a straight length of road with no oncoming traffic I went into the opposite lane traveling at about 50 mph, and boom, I was slightly to the RIGHT
-Went to a large open parking lot, and though I couldn't achieve high speed, seemed to be able to go dead straight with red line at 12 o'clock

Thoughts...?

Hi No Mo
I haven't particularly noticed any bias to left or right, but now you mention it, the next time I am driving on a quiet section of road, I will see if I have the same experience.

Search

Search

Steering and Poor Stability

bigleonski

DaveB

bigleonski

and1939

Skydance

Cheshire cat

anand

Photo Contest Winner

DaveB

Korg

Catpaw4x4

GG 4101

DaveB

DaveB

[ Adam ]

Photo Contest Winner

DenisM

Cheshire cat

Tazzieman

Skydance

DaveB

NoMoTaco

Global Grenadier 0742

Cheshire cat

Similar threads

Latest posts

Share this page