The Grenadier Forum
Register Now for enhanced site access.
INEOS Agents, Dealers or Commercial vendors please contact admin@theineosforum.com for a commercial account.

Diff locks.

Max

Grenadier Owner
Lifetime Supporter
Local time
11:37 AM
Joined
May 9, 2022
Messages
1,361
Reaction score
2,684
Location
Sunshine Coast Queensland Australia
Some companies would do, Ineos perhaps, but I will have to wait one year or more I guess.


I looked and think some are inside the plastic cover, but I will have to think how to remove them. And thanks for the tip.
I would love one of the aftermarket companies create these for us...it may have helped you Jean...I will be investigating when I have my Gren in hand...sorry to see it...to remove the plastic bits, if you can use a skewer with blue tack squashed onto the end of it and push it onto the loose plastic piece, you may stick to it and be able to remove it through the hole...good luck.
 

Attachments

  • Grenadier rear copy.jpg
    Grenadier rear copy.jpg
    121.4 KB · Views: 44
Last edited:

255/85

Grenadier Owner
Forum Donor
Local time
8:37 AM
Joined
Mar 4, 2023
Messages
714
Reaction score
809
Location
Western U.S.
Looks to me like a small amount wheel slip is required to engage the factory lockers.

Standard rear diffs turned around and used in front axles run on the weak side of the gears. They are stronger in reverse.
 

To

Grenadier Owner
Local time
11:37 AM
Joined
Jul 12, 2022
Messages
142
Reaction score
538
Not only that. When you lock your diff(s), you usually do so because you are stuck or in a difficult situation. That hardly seems like a scenario where you would be going left and right at will to me. That's ridiculous.
The locks in the Grenadier are not there to be inserted when you are stuck. This is done before entering such a section. It is good to know what to expect. Then you can decide whether it can work only with the middle, the rear or all three. In my Grenadier, the locks lock into place. This works even when driving very slowly, because there are always certain steering movements. And don't be constantly distracted by the LEDs and error messages in the car. It all works when you use your brain. Most people will never need the use of three locks. The Grenadier is built so that even with just the center differential locked, they can get through almost anywhere with some momentum. Everything else actually needs some preparation as well (trail walking). No lock in the world will help you more if you get stuck in a deep mud hole. The momentum before, however, would probably have helped one. And that even without front and rear lock. These are really only for extreme situations such as very steep very long and very slippery passages. Everything else in Central Europe creates the middle lock. That's my opinion.
 

DCPU

Grenadier Owner
Local time
4:37 PM
Joined
Jul 27, 2022
Messages
6,005
Reaction score
13,343
Looks to me like a small amount wheel slip is required to engage the factory lockers.
Where are you getting that from?

If you watch the e locker video above; and if that's the system in the Grenadier, then wheel slip is not required - a small amount of wheel rotation is required for the locking pins to be driven into the locking plate, and the locking plate to engage with the hub.
 

Fab

Grenadier Owner
Local time
5:37 PM
Joined
Dec 18, 2022
Messages
176
Reaction score
306
Location
Dinslaken Germany
I tried all three locks yesterday on soft ground.
Low -> easy
Middle diff lock -> easy
rear diff lock -> took me some time (25 meters)
Front diff lock -> some more… (25 meters )
Disengagement rear and front -> took some time (30 meters)
Middle diff lock and high -> no problem at all.
Have I mentioned that the Torsen diff locks (front and rear) in my Defender always worked without a problem and without engaging them actively…
That’s what they’re torsens for. They always work. I have them on the Land Rover too, love them.
 

Tinki

Grenadier Owner
Lifetime Supporter
Local time
4:37 PM
Joined
Jun 29, 2022
Messages
414
Reaction score
1,023
I thin the EATON locker work with ball bearings and not pins . So for them to engage you need at least half rotation . let me see if i can find something on the net .
 

rovie

Grenadier Owner
Lifetime Supporter
Local time
11:37 AM
Joined
May 19, 2022
Messages
2,124
Reaction score
3,995
The locks in the Grenadier are not there to be inserted when you are stuck. This is done before entering such a section. It is good to know what to expect. Then you can decide whether it can work only with the middle, the rear or all three. In my Grenadier, the locks lock into place. This works even when driving very slowly, because there are always certain steering movements. And don't be constantly distracted by the LEDs and error messages in the car. It all works when you use your brain. Most people will never need the use of three locks. The Grenadier is built so that even with just the center differential locked, they can get through almost anywhere with some momentum. Everything else actually needs some preparation as well (trail walking). No lock in the world will help you more if you get stuck in a deep mud hole. The momentum before, however, would probably have helped one. And that even without front and rear lock. These are really only for extreme situations such as very steep very long and very slippery passages. Everything else in Central Europe creates the middle lock. That's my opinion.
I agree with you there. But especially the diff locks should be used every now and then so that they work when you really need them years from now. Just like the reduction and other moving parts.
 

Tinki

Grenadier Owner
Lifetime Supporter
Local time
4:37 PM
Joined
Jun 29, 2022
Messages
414
Reaction score
1,023
Right that is the older version of the e locker, I was expecting the "newer" version, although I have no knowledge of when the change was made?
I remember seeing a part number somewhere in the early days floating about and googling it and came up with this one . But for the life of me i cannot remeber where i saw it . or find it again . i bet the hive mind here will come up with a part number soon enough .
 

DCPU

Grenadier Owner
Local time
4:37 PM
Joined
Jul 27, 2022
Messages
6,005
Reaction score
13,343
Well the video you have posted in from 13 years ago ~ the one I posted 5 years ago.

What makes you think we have the older version?
 

255/85

Grenadier Owner
Forum Donor
Local time
8:37 AM
Joined
Mar 4, 2023
Messages
714
Reaction score
809
Location
Western U.S.
Where are you getting that from?

If you watch the e locker video above; and if that's the system in the Grenadier, then wheel slip is not required - a small amount of wheel rotation is required for the locking pins to be driven into the locking plate, and the locking plate to engage with the hub.

I have seen that video several times previously but not just now.
When the locker is activated the pins are not pushed into the lock ring until the demonstrator holds one side gear and axle shaft stationary. In other words not until there is differentiation in wheel speed. Toward the end of the video there appears to be enough friction going from forward to reverse to then hold the magnetic actuator stationary. It's the only time that he is only touching the crank handle and not both axle shafts.
 

255/85

Grenadier Owner
Forum Donor
Local time
8:37 AM
Joined
Mar 4, 2023
Messages
714
Reaction score
809
Location
Western U.S.
Hard to know for certain on the older video but it also appears that the locker does not engage until the right side axle has rotated some amount. The left side is stationary until full lock up meaning differentiation or wheel slip. This won't easily happen on solid ground.
 

Tinki

Grenadier Owner
Lifetime Supporter
Local time
4:37 PM
Joined
Jun 29, 2022
Messages
414
Reaction score
1,023
Well the video you have posted in from 13 years ago ~ the one I posted 5 years ago.

What makes you think we have the older version?
As i said , early days i found a part number that lead me to said locker and video . I appreciate this is the old one . and as i said i cannot be sure if this is what we have .
Unless someone pulls an axle appart or gets ineos to give us the part number i am only speculating .
Based on what people describe when they are locking their diffs i assumed that the ball bearing locking diff might explain what they are experiencing .
Happy to be proven wrong .
 

DCPU

Grenadier Owner
Local time
4:37 PM
Joined
Jul 27, 2022
Messages
6,005
Reaction score
13,343
I have seen that video several times previously but not just now.
When the locker is activated the pins are not pushed into the lock ring until the demonstrator holds one side gear and axle shaft stationary. In other words not until there is differentiation in wheel speed. Toward the end of the video there appears to be enough friction going from forward to reverse to then hold the magnetic actuator stationary. It's the only time that he is only touching the crank handle and not both axle shafts.
Right, I see what you are saying, but I'm struggling to see it working this way. He has to hold one or other of the axle shafts as both have effectively no resistance and the torque through an open diff will just turn one (the side with the lock ring engagement) and so the opposite side will never move the little required to move the pins into engagement with the lock ring.

If it worked how you describe, then you are saying the rear will never lock if you drive in a straight line?
 

Cheshire cat

Grenadier Owner
Lifetime Supporter
Local time
4:37 PM
Joined
May 30, 2022
Messages
1,927
Reaction score
4,588
Location
Cheshire, UK
Decided to take mine off road this evening in order to test out the diff locks on a dry grass surface. Engaging centre diff in both high and low, no problem. Engaging front / rear locks a bit fiddly but got there in the end. Managed to disengage from diff but warning lights for both diff's went red and would not extinguish. Turned off engine but no resolve. Checked the status panel only to see a series of faults including: Hill Hold Control malfunction, Button of the rear diff lock is defective, Button of front diff lock is defective, Iugh usage of electric consumer, Transmission not detected, Reduced vehicle stability - ESC.
Parked up and check again in the morning. If no better, a call to the dealer.
 

DaveB

Grenadier Owner
Local time
2:37 AM
Joined
Mar 18, 2022
Messages
7,442
Reaction score
15,158
Location
Toogoom, Fraser Coast Queensland
That's correct. Engaged Rear and then front. Tried to disengage front, then rear. Rear disengaged, front failed.
Only other thing I can recall is that you have to be in low range with the centre diff locked.
So maybe try a slow sequence.
Engage low range make sure it is working
Engage centre diff lock " " " " "
Engage rear diff lock " " " " "
Engage front diff lock " " " " "
Obviously if any of the previous steps don't work there is no point going further.
I have seen some people trying to engage front and rear at the same time and that doesn't work.
 

Cheshire cat

Grenadier Owner
Lifetime Supporter
Local time
4:37 PM
Joined
May 30, 2022
Messages
1,927
Reaction score
4,588
Location
Cheshire, UK
Only other thing I can recall is that you have to be in low range with the centre diff locked.
So maybe try a slow sequence.
Engage low range make sure it is working
Engage centre diff lock " " " " "
Engage rear diff lock " " " " "
Engage front diff lock " " " " "
Obviously if any of the previous steps don't work there is no point going further.
I have seen some people trying to engage front and rear at the same time and that doesn't work.
Hi Dave
My method was as you have suggested and worked well. The problem occurred when trying the reverse sequence. The front diff lock would not disengage. I then went through the sequence again only this time neither diff lock would disengage even though center diff did disengage. I didn’t want to try driving at 40 MPH whereby they should automatically disengage without further advice.
 
Back
Top Bottom