What would you say if you could ?

[CountyV8]

I'll say again less bongs or at least stop them and the Manual.

Hi Année

 

[svmaven]

I'd ask when he plans to release all documentation needed to keep the IG running for 50 years with no factory support. Service manuals, supplier part numbers, CANBus protocols, ECU maps, whatever.

Starting a car company is a cool idea but the success rate for automotive startups is low. Lot of us took a chance and we'd just like to know we won't have a big paperweight in the garage or a 95% haircut selling an orphaned, unsupportable vehicle.

 

[Bruce B]

As I do not yet own a Grenadier I feel that any comments I might make would be meaningless. I do have one on order though and I have driven about 300 miles in one so, maybe I will share just this thought.
If you begin to compile a list of the “recommendations” found in this and other posts on this subject, you begin seeing a trend. That trend is toward a slightly more complex, slightly more feature rich, slightly more sophisticated vehicle. Cup holders, sunglasses storage, better back up cameras, adjustable lumbar support, more refined steering, deeper user integration in vehicle software etc all takes you down the path that virtually every other single automotive entity has followed to get to the vehicles we have to choose from in the market today. All except for Ineos with the Grenadier that is…
Forgive me if I smile at some of the suggestions and wonder to myself if perhaps some of the people making them might not be happier with the new Land Rover Defender rather than the Grenadier… Before anyone gets upset, I say this with the utmost of respect for anyone who has put their money down to own this incredibly cool vehicle!
To put it in a different light, it is in fact the crudeness of the Ineos that so endeared the design to me. Yes, I will be annoyed about something when mine is finally here. On the other hand the pureness of the design is something that I haven’t seen in a new vehicle in many, many years. This is a beautiful and incredibly unusual offering that I don’t expect I will see again in my lifetime. I will embrace the purity of the design, blemishes and all and I will consider myself fortunate to have been able to participate at this moment in time.
I would simply say to Sir James Arthur Ratcliffe, “thank you sir!”

 

[Zimm]

That trend is toward a slightly more complex, slightly more feature rich, slightly more sophisticated vehicle. Cup holders, sunglasses storage, better back up cameras, adjustable lumbar support, more refined steering, deeper user integration in vehicle software etc all takes you down the path that virtually every other single automotive entity has followed to get to the vehicles we have to choose from in the market today.

There's already a backup camera.
lumbar support can be a manual crank and is in base cars.
Steering has had return to center on live axles for 120 years.
The computer exists.
Sun-glass cubbies and cupholders are technology?

If you peal back the control panel, you have a printed circuit boards and switches, like every other new car. There's no linkage from the throttle to a cam. It's all electronic anyway. We haven't been spared any of the foibles of modern electronic cars.

If this was a truck built like a base truck in 1985, you would have a point, but it's got sensors and crash systems as it is. What we have in these areas of complain is poor execution, not simplicity. .

 

[Offroad]

I think many of the issues are to be expected from a new manufacturer, new vehicle, new dealer network, etc. That said, I think a big part of the disconnect is the the lack of communication from Ineos, in general. I really think they have failed the dealerships and us, the customers. In terms of the previous post from BruceB, I think we all really wanted less tech, not more but the larger issue is we want it to work. If you are close to a dealership, and they can actual solve a problem thats one thing but if you are hours away and have these nagging issues, thats a completely different deal.

We are coming up on 1 year since the launch date in the USA. Are things better, worse or the same from a customer service perspective?

 

[Zimm]

I think many of the issues are to be expected from a new manufacturer, new vehicle, new dealer network, etc. That said, I think a big part of the disconnect is the the lack of communication from Ineos, in general. I really think they have failed the dealerships and us, the customers. In terms of the previous post from BruceB, I think we all really wanted less tech, not more but the larger issue is we want it to work. If you are close to a dealership, and they can actual solve a problem thats one thing but if you are hours away and have these nagging issues, thats a completely different deal.

We are coming up on 1 year since the launch date in the USA. Are things better, worse or the same from a customer service perspective?

I don't think 1 year is enough time to say if it's better or worse. At least let year 1 cars be out for a while and actually need service.

As to the opening sentence, it is an existing car plant with trained personnel, engineered by people that designed the Gwagon and other vehicles, using suppliers that already make car parts, with a 10 old engine and transmission that's been sold in the millions, and every car dealer they chose has been selling cars for decades. THE WHOLE POINT of the process was that it utilized experienced suppliers, designers, manufacturing and sales. Nothing is new but the model. It wasn't supposed to have beta test issues. The only part that was supposed to be new, was the approach to service, and that never happened. Why do people keep making excuses for QA/QC? I really like my car, but similar to my rescue dog, as much as I like it, it's got baked in issues that I just gotta deal with.

 

[Offroad]

I don't think 1 year is enough time to say if it's better or worse. At least let year 1 cars be out for a while and actually need service.

As to the opening sentence, it is an existing car plant with trained personnel, engineered by people that designed the Gwagon and other vehicles, using suppliers that already make car parts, with a 10 old engine and transmission that's been sold in the millions, and every car dealer they chose has been selling cars for decades. THE WHOLE POINT of the process was that it utilized experienced suppliers, designers, manufacturing and sales. Nothing is new but the model. It wasn't supposed to have beta test issues. The only part that was supposed to be new, was the approach to service, and that never happened. Why do people keep making excuses for QA/QC? I really like my car, but similar to my rescue dog, as much as I like it, it's got baked in issues that I just gotta deal with.

I don't disagree with your perspective 'but' I would say the customer service is the same, which means bad. And as more vehicles get delivered it escalates fast.

 

[Bayford]

As I do not yet own a Grenadier I feel that any comments I might make would be meaningless. I do have one on order though and I have driven about 300 miles in one so, maybe I will share just this thought.
If you begin to compile a list of the “recommendations” found in this and other posts on this subject, you begin seeing a trend. That trend is toward a slightly more complex, slightly more feature rich, slightly more sophisticated vehicle. Cup holders, sunglasses storage, better back up cameras, adjustable lumbar support, more refined steering, deeper user integration in vehicle software etc all takes you down the path that virtually every other single automotive entity has followed to get to the vehicles we have to choose from in the market today. All except for Ineos with the Grenadier that is…
Forgive me if I smile at some of the suggestions and wonder to myself if perhaps some of the people making them might not be happier with the new Land Rover Defender rather than the Grenadier… Before anyone gets upset, I say this with the utmost of respect for anyone who has put their money down to own this incredibly cool vehicle!
To put it in a different light, it is in fact the crudeness of the Ineos that so endeared the design to me. Yes, I will be annoyed about something when mine is finally here. On the other hand the pureness of the design is something that I haven’t seen in a new vehicle in many, many years. This is a beautiful and incredibly unusual offering that I don’t expect I will see again in my lifetime. I will embrace the purity of the design, blemishes and all and I will consider myself fortunate to have been able to participate at this moment in time.
I would simply say to Sir James Arthur Ratcliffe, “thank you sir!”

Thank you Bruce for a slightly different perspective. I think you are onto something here.
The car has numerous foibles and irritations but then so does everything that I like. I know that we Brits are tarred with the traditionalist brush whilst the Americans are great adopters of the new but there are many cars and boats where "improved" models loose the soul that made the original great. The Jaguar XK120 was fantastic, the XK140 a slightly better drive but not as pretty or as much fun, and then the XK150 which was the fastest and most comfortable but also fat, ugly, and without character or appeal in my view. The original Bruce King designed Hinckley Jet boats are as beautiful as a motor boat can be - slim, elegant and not a straight line on them. Post about 2014 variants are the result of asking owners what improvements they would like to see - a bit more room here, another appliance there, etc etc - the result is a beautifully made and finished boat with middle aged spread that lacks the soul of the original. I hope the same doesn't happen to the Grenadier - sometimes less is more.

That said I would like a workshop manual for it.

 

[Annee Grenadier_girl]

Thank you all for your input, I’ll be going through all replies and cutting and pasting them, I have been unsuccessful in getting SJR’s personal email but have been given his PA’s so will direct them to her in the next week.

Do keep the questions coming.

Annee

 

[Skydance]

My sympathy to the person on Facebook who said that Ineos/dealer told them that the infotainment system is not backward compatible 2023 and therefore doesn’t have the larger maps and large reverse camera picture.

I know it’s probably different hardware but to be honest I was also under the impression that software could be just updated to have this new functionality. I mean I have new iPhone software on my old iPhone 12.

Lesson learned twice now for me. Don’t be an early adopter!!! Be a late adopter. I bought one of the last X5 and last Range Rover sports and guess what they were perfect.

I would ask Jim Ratcliffe why he signed off a screen so small for maps and reverse cameras when the Ineos is a big 4x4 with a big screen. Why!!!

Just joking, if they turned around and said they can’t turn off all the silly beeps on the US models (they promised) until the 25 models and it’s not backward compatible then folks will be up in arms