Useless Customer Service

[IslandFalconer]

I have to ask why? And a follow up to that is what you actually like about the Grenadier if you’d buy one again. We’ve seen 10 pages of venting on this thread alone so I’m sure I’m not alone in wondering why you would.

You live nowhere near a dealer, it’s essentially a first year production vehicle with numerous occasional and not so occasional faults very well documented here and elsewhere online for over a year now. The same goes with the inability to reset the maintenance indicator light (that was documented again almost a year ago) and the list goes on.

Really curious on this one.

Stu.

I didn’t type 10 pages but that’s ok.
It’s well built from a driveline perspectiv
It’s solid from a doors and body perspective.

Why it is you all seem to insist you don’t buy a new vehicle because it’s “new” is beyond me. When I placed an order no one owned one and no one was having issues. Why it is you all seem to think I should buy an established brand because “new” is frankly a dumb comment.

Had the vehicle been delivered as promised, with service manuals, with serviceability with some level of quality control. It would be great.

But yet again your comments of “you shouldn’t have bought it because it’s new” are pretty pointless

It was marketed as a work vehicle, but it was built at a less than stellar end product

The fact that someone telling it like it is bothers you is again, beyond me.

But whatever, I’ve concluded that some people are willing to accept mediocrity and unwilling to hear any bad things being said about their beloved Grenadier.

As a business owner the vehicle was directly marketed to the working class user for business. The fact it’s turning in to a list of more and more “shoddy” workmanship is just that “shoddy”
None of these issues should be this common.

I’m not the only one with these problems, and they’ve had well over 2 years to figure it out. But yet this was delivered with poor quality.

 

[Stu_Barnes]

When I placed an order no one owned one and no one was having issues.

This is a physical impossibility in the North American market and issues with the vehicle were apparent before the order books opened. Search for batch and hold.

I hear you on the rest. I don’t necessarily agree on it all but I hear you and I’m sure you’re not alone in some of the issues you are experiencing, good luck in getting them sorted out.

 

[Stu_Barnes]

The fact that someone telling it like it is bothers you is again, beyond me.

That’s rather a stretch, but I’ll take it on the chin.

 

[AUDIOBUS]

I’ll go out on a limb here, or maybe I should say out on a (raptors) wing: I myself spend most of my working day by myself. And I have read island falconers posts with this in mind, envisioning a mostly solitary work day sorting out the relationship with co-workers (birds) who can’t directly tell you what they need. Couple this to new a truck from a company that is, in the island falcon experience also uncommunicative. (maybe I'm wrong about all this)

Understanding the lack of feedback from the co-worker (the bird) is clear. Understanding the lack of feedback from a company you gave $85K to is not as clear, considering they have both language skills and opposable thumbs.

Enter a forum with (as far as I’m concerned) people who are empathetic, sympathetic, experienced, understanding, intelligent, resourceful, some (many) of whom have also had problems but all of whom are enthusiastic about the same truck —

In the end, I think islandfalconer simply wishes to be heard. That’s all. I don’t sense or read regret here, only disappointment. I don’t sense or read ill will or combative discourse, I read frustration and feeling unheard. I read here someone who has turned to a group of strangers for support in an arena where there is very little official support.

Some of the suggestions have been helpful, such as getting to a closer dealer like the one in Boston to sort some stuff out, but maybe unrealistic to accomplish at this time. And I think a large measure of the frustration comes from a perceived notion that the forum might not completely embrace some of the pushback. It’s not that the forums helpful intent is being rejected, it’s in the misunderstanding that the solution is unrealistic at this particular time. Emphasis on this particular time. This, and the very real disappointment of feeling that you've bought into excellence, but have received less than the excellence you yourself would provide someone should they hire you to prevent pigeons from mucking up an air intake or a cockpit windshield....

What I will continue to read here is an individual who needs a sounding board and some support, and a group which is trying to be helpful. That's it.

And maybe I’m completely wrong about everything I’ve said above, but I won’t know until I say it and learn something new.

In the meantime, as I sometimes ask my wife: do you want help/solutions, or do you just want me to listen? In any case, I hope you get your truck to a place of peace of mind soon.

~AB

 

[IslandFalconer]

I’ll go out on a limb here, or maybe I should say out on a (raptors) wing: I myself spend most of my working day by myself. And I have read island falconers posts with this in mind, envisioning a mostly solitary work day sorting out the relationship with co-workers (birds) who can’t directly tell you what they need. Couple this to new a truck from a company that is, in the island falcon experience also uncommunicative. (maybe I'm wrong about all this)

Understanding the lack of feedback from the co-worker (the bird) is clear. Understanding the lack of feedback from a company you gave $85K to is not as clear, considering they have both language skills and opposable thumbs.

Enter a forum with (as far as I’m concerned) people who are empathetic, sympathetic, experienced, understanding, intelligent, resourceful, some (many) of whom have also had problems but all of whom are enthusiastic about the same truck —

In the end, I think islandfalconer simply wishes to be heard. That’s all. I don’t sense or read regret here, only disappointment. I don’t sense or read ill will or combative discourse, I read frustration and feeling unheard. I read here someone who has turned to a group of strangers for support in an arena where there is very little official support.

Some of the suggestions have been helpful, such as getting to a closer dealer like the one in Boston to sort some stuff out, but maybe unrealistic to accomplish at this time. And I think a large measure of the frustration comes from a perceived notion that the forum might not completely embrace some of the pushback. It’s not that the forums helpful intent is being rejected, it’s in the misunderstanding that the solution is unrealistic at this particular time. Emphasis on this particular time. This, and the very real disappointment of feeling that you've bought into excellence, but have received less than the excellence you yourself would provide someone should they hire you to prevent pigeons from mucking up an air intake or a cockpit windshield....

What I will continue to read here is an individual who needs a sounding board and some support, and a group which is trying to be helpful. That's it.

And maybe I’m completely wrong about everything I’ve said above, but I won’t know until I say it and learn something new.

In the meantime, as I sometimes ask my wife: do you want help/solutions, or do you just want me to listen? In any case, I hope you get your truck to a place of peace of mind soon.

~AB

And You would be fairly correct in your reaponse.

The birds are easy, and they tell you a lot, if you understand them. Thats where skill and experience comes in. Theres a reason I charge what I do for what I do.

Yes Ineos frankly Sucks at communication, and have no wish to be urgent or helpful. The Dealer isn't much better. unanswered emails, unanswered phone messages. Just a lot of nothing.

Frankly the forum members who simply go on about not purchasing it and how it was a mistake and i should know better, are either callus, or just plain ignorant.
When I was sold this vehicle, and through marketing it was meant to be tough, and reliable, and fixable. It has so far been none of those things.

I hope it Gets sorted. All I want is a game plan, and than we can move forward.

As for Boston, they can not do Canadian Warranty work. Thats been made clear to me by both Ineos, and the Dealership in Boston, and my selling Dealership. Service yes, Warranty no.

thanks for your thoughtful response!

 

[IslandFalconer]

So here is the Update, if Ineos follows through I will update Again.

The plan is as follows, a Flatbed will be sent to pick up my Grenadier, on that flatbed will be a loaner Grenadier, the vehicle will be taken to Mississauga, and all the repairs will be performed. All this is to take place after the New software update is available. So until that update is available we wait.

 

[Roach]

Late but Sounds good

 

[landmannnn]

So here is the Update, if Ineos follows through I will update Again.

The plan is as follows, a Flatbed will be sent to pick up my Grenadier, on that flatbed will be a loaner Grenadier, the vehicle will be taken to Mississauga, and all the repairs will be performed. All this is to take place after the New software update is available. So until that update is available we wait.

Sounds good potentially.

 

[Jeremy996]

I can think of a couple of UK owners who had a similar solution eventually. Ineos Automotive does seem able to do the right thing, eventually!

 

[Catpaw4x4]

The people buying Ferraris and Bugattis I guess. I don’t know how the acceptance of mediocrity has become tolerable to people.

You’re free not to comment on the thread if it pisses you off so much.

So you are now a “Master”moderator instructing people what they can do or not do??

 

[IslandFalconer]

So you are now a “Master”moderator instructing people what they can do or not do??

I didn’t say I was a master moderator, I said you’re free to not read or comment if you don’t like the thread

 

[Trialmaster]

Please close this moan of a thread - we understand the problems and they will be fixed.

I come to this Forum to be inspired not to see wrist cutting threads!

 

[Catpaw4x4]

I didn’t say I was a master moderator, I said you’re free to not read or comment if you don’t like the thread

I didn't say you said you were a Master moderator - your actions spoke for you. Who are you to tell anyone on this Forum what they are free to read or comment on? Is your goal to shut up people who offer a different opinion, don't agree with you, etc? . You've "verbally" attacked several people on the Forum. Vast majority of people on this Forum have great intentions of helping others, offer up advice/experience - they don't have to agree with you to do that. This Forum is not your "Personal" platform. It is a platform to be shared, enjoyed and to be respectful of others.

 

[Jean Mercier]

I think we better stop discussing how we should communicate with each other, every one his own way, as long as we stay polite.

I completely understand the frustrations of @IslandFalconer.

I had myself quite some problems and was very pissed off with the zero communication of Ineos and the very un-dedicated and sometimes erroneous communication of my dealer.

It improved a lot after a hard meeting some months ago: I have now a dedicated technician, and he answers my questions.

Of course, I have luck, I live in Belgium. My dealer is at 30 minutes driving, and there are others at less than two hours.

 

[Jiman01]

So you are now a “Master”moderator instructing people what they can do or not do??

I didn't say you said you were a Master moderator - your actions spoke for you. Who are you to tell anyone on this Forum what they are free to read or comment on? Is your goal to shut up people who offer a different opinion, don't agree with you, etc? . You've "verbally" attacked several people on the Forum. Vast majority of people on this Forum have great intentions of helping others, offer up advice/experience - they don't have to agree with you to do that. This Forum is not your "Personal" platform. It is a platform to be shared, enjoyed and to be respectful of others.

You literally said it….and then go exponentially further by lecturing and chastising about the very statement you seemed to have gotten so triggered by. That level of cognitive dissonance would be funny if you weren’t so serious in your response. I 100% agree with @Jean Mercer and will refrain from any further comment.

I for one am very interested in this thread and hope that it is not closed until the OP gets a final disposition. On the one hand it’s nice to know that the vast majority of vehicles are relatively problem free, which is impressive for a NA first year run. On the other, it’s disappointing that their aftercare, when there is a problem, is/can be unimpressive.

Just going by the start date of this thread vs. the actual date of occurrence, two months doesn’t seem too bad (easy for me to say because I’m not living it). However the level of arm twisting and effort that had to be made to get to this point IMHO seems unreasonable.

 

[parb]

Ah yes the 21st century where mediocrity at every level is now the standard. And good service and excellence is reserved for the super elite. I forgot that society now accepts sub par as a standard,

A bit hyperbolic isn't it? Society is full of things that have quality problems, especially in its infancy. You can hardly pickup a review of any long term test of a vehicle in a magazine without them reporting on maintenance costs and faults.

Entire corporations and non profits exists solely to call out where the issues are, consumer reports, jd powers etc.

Things aren't infallible, nor are companies. You have essentially zero track record in a new company so you can't even make an educated guess on how they will respond to you in the event of issues.

I took all that into account. I live 5 hours from the nearest dealer but I got my car from a dealer 12 hours away. My calculus included carrying the cost of a flatbed to the dealer if I had to. I never assumed I'd get a loaner.

I find it incomprehensible that people aren't considering worst case scenarios for a new car like the Grenadier. I think this is part of being prepared. And I have another vehicle just in case I need it, my old xc90. I think that is just sound judgement and not an indication that I'm a pampered elite living a disconnected life from the rest of us.

I figured that if it is really bad I'll lemon law it or at least force a buy back with bad depreciation, worst case I took a big loss. To be honest that was a real concern. But early reports have mostly been good with an occasional issue that took time and insistence from the owner to get sorted. I think this is roughly what I expected.

I was far more worried about the fisker scenario or that ratcliffe would pass away and the heir wanted nothing to do with it and shutting down the project.

My few cents and I for sure hope you get it sorted soon.

 

[IslandFalconer]

I didn't say you said you were a Master moderator - your actions spoke for you. Who are you to tell anyone on this Forum what they are free to read or comment on? Is your goal to shut up people who offer a different opinion, don't agree with you, etc? . You've "verbally" attacked several people on the Forum. Vast majority of people on this Forum have great intentions of helping others, offer up advice/experience - they don't have to agree with you to do that. This Forum is not your "Personal" platform. It is a platform to be shared, enjoyed and to be respectful of others.

My dude, I didn’t personally attack you with this thread. If this thread bothers you so much, why do you read it? You can simply skip over it. No one, and I myself have not forced you to read it, or get angry at it. You’re entirely free to do as you choose. I never said “don’t comment” I said you’re “free” to not comment or participate in this thread. I certainly don’t mean you any insult, or any malice. Somehow this thread has angered you and for what reason I don’t know.

I hope you have a good rest of the day, the weeks almost over. If you’re ever in PEI feel free to stop by for a beer, I have no ill will for you whatsoever. I’m at a loss why you’re so angry at me for having a troublesome vehicle.

 

[Jackattack13]

I figured that if it is really bad I'll lemon law it or at least force a but back, worst case I took a big loss. To be honest that was a real concern. But early reports have mostly been good with an occasional issue that took time and insistence from the owner to get sorted. I think this is roughly what I expected.

With their lack of communication to customers and almost deafening silence regarding issues, I am curious how my Buy Back demand is going to go. My dealership wouldn't even talk to me regarding a Buy Back and would immediately brush me off and change the subject. So I sent a letter to Corporate. I have never been in this predicament, so will be interesting to see how this goes.

 

[parb]

With their lack of communication to customers and almost deafening silence regarding issues, I am curious how my Buy Back demand is going to go. My dealership wouldn't even talk to me regarding a Buy Back and would immediately brush me off and change the subject. So I sent a letter to Corporate. I have never been in this predicament, so will be interesting to see how this goes.

I hope it works out for you. Sometimes a legal counsel is useful in these communications.

 

[Jean Mercier]

With their lack of communication to customers and almost deafening silence regarding issues, I am curious how my Buy Back demand is going to go. My dealership wouldn't even talk to me regarding a Buy Back and would immediately brush me off and change the subject. So I sent a letter to Corporate. I have never been in this predicament, so will be interesting to see how this goes.

My wife understands you completely (she didn't read your post).

But she asked me several times why I kept the car with all the problems I had.

Ineos should be willing to buy it back. I want to keep the car, it is my dream . But Ineos still has to learn a lot concerning Customer Satisfaction.