Americas Price shock (US)

[DaveB]

There really needs to be some more information as to why that should be. Has anyone else received the same information?

There was information very early on that the diff housing was a different size and therefore the axle lengths different.

 

[Norb-TX]

They said pricing would be announced in the second quarter. Well, its the second quarter.

 

[Sunsetsavage]

They said pricing would be announced in the second quarter. Well, its the second quarter.

At the South Tampa Experience, the INEOS USA Rep stated in May the price would be revealed. So hang on this then...

 

[ADVAW8S]

They said pricing would be announced in the second quarter. Well, its the second quarter.

They have indicated 5/17 as the day they reveal pricing and dealership agreements. This concides with the last round of prototype drives which end 5/12.

 

[painter]

They have indicated 5/17 as the day they reveal pricing and dealership agreements. This concides with the last round of prototype drives which end 5/12.

Has there been an email since Mar 29, 2023 ?

That one said re test drives... To Be Announced: May; NY UT WA IL
and June; ON BC

I had been told earlier by lA CSR robot that US + Can would get info at same time.

Have all the USA drives been announced ?

 

[DDG]

Hi Christian - I think we're all in the same boat here. A few weeks back I spec'd the truck the way I truly want it in both UK and Aus prices and then used XE.com to convert into USD. There's lots of room for error, but when I do that it fits in my budget (barely). There are certainly things I will forgo need be to drop the price if I need to once US figures are announced.

If I am honest though, my true worry is d-bag dealers and their "market adjustment fees." I really do want a Grenadier - I have since the project got underway - but I will not pay over list. It's not right how dealers get away with it and what's worse, the manufacturers are helpless because of our own state laws. I'm not sure about the direct sales logistics working out (someone posted a map on a different thread) so maybe some states can offer direct sales through Ineos, but I know for a fact that my state, NJ, is not one of them. I have expressed to others that I am willing to travel to not get ripped off! I bought a Ford Raptor a few years back down in Florida because the dealer four miles from my house wanted $10k over when the order banks first opened. I said thanks but no thanks but a few months later, they had the balls to call to see if I was still interested and that the adjustment was up to $15k. Screw that. Greedy bastards.

Fully agree. Word for word with this sentiment

 

[ADVAW8S]

Has there been an email since Mar 29, 2023 ?

That one said re test drives... To Be Announced: May; NY UT WA IL
and June; ON BC

I had been told earlier by lA CSR robot that US + Can would get info at same time.

Have all the USA drives been announced ?

I think all the initial US drives have been announced. I was going to insert a bad joke about Canada but didn't want to get a polite negative response.

 

[CryHavoc]

Has there been an email since Mar 29, 2023 ?

That one said re test drives... To Be Announced: May; NY UT WA IL
and June; ON BC

I had been told earlier by lA CSR robot that US + Can would get info at same time.

Have all the USA drives been announced ?

There are dates for the remainder of US drive as well as for Canada. Registration for a lot of them (and final destination) has not opened. Everything is at grenadierevents.com

 

[AWo]

Who is "they" - Ineos or Dana?

Dana

 

[DaveB]

There really needs to be some more information as to why that should be. Has anyone else received the same information?

That information was around from the early test drives.
The Austrian test driver said there are 3 things that have to be ordered from the factory that can't be fitted afterwards

• Safari Windows
• Hi load wiring
• Lockers

There were several other video's where it was pointed out that the axles are different with or without lockers.
The lockers don't appear as an accessory anywhere. Only a standard factory option.

 

[SirJimR]

I know I'm late to the party on this conversation, but what you Yanks need to remember when comparing prices to Australia is that our two car markets are VASTLY different.

In 2022 there were nearly 14 Million "light vehicles" sold in the USA.
Compare that to Australia in 2022 - VFACTS shows that 1,081,429 new cars, SUVs and commercial vehicles were delivered in 2022,
Jeep sold over 180,000 Wranglers in the USA in 2022 - they sold only 6,658 vehicles total across their entire range into Australia in 2022

Cost comparison Jeep Wrangler Rubicon

• List Price before onroads USA: $45,000 US (approx. $66,996 AUD)
• List Price before onroads AUS: $90,450 AUD (approx. $60,749.14 USD)

So taking out local Aussie factors like Luxury Car Tax etc, our vehicles cost a hell of a lot more for manufacturers to import because our market is so small.
There's also the fact that it costs a lot to ship vehicles from overseas to Australia compared to the US due to distance. Volume also plays a part into this, we have less ships coming to Australia, so the costs are higher because the shipping companies charge more to make the run here.

Long story short - I wouldn't be using Australian pricing as an indicator for the US market whatsoever.

 

[Reducs]

OK, I was bored. Again.

I'm on record as being firmly against the "Belstaff As Base" trial balloon/rumor/leak that we'll be stuck with here in the U.S.

I decided to build a "Trialmaster" from the base Station Wagon on the UK configurator. The SW as of today is £58,030. Adding the options listed that make up the Trialmaster comes to £65,025.
If you click on the preconfigured Trialmaster instead, it starts at £69,240.

What am I missing? That's a £4,215 difference. I know the jackets are pricey, but they're not £4k pricey! I looked at the summaries side-by-side and don't see any difference. Aren't you supposed to save money by selecting the preconfigured Belstaff edition rather than building it up? I hope I'm overlooking something.

Anyway, another month and I guess we'll know.

 

[Wayneos]

OK, I was bored. Again.

I'm on record as being firmly against the "Belstaff As Base" trial balloon/rumor/leak that we'll be stuck with here in the U.S.

I decided to build a "Trialmaster" from the base Station Wagon on the UK configurator. The SW as of today is £58,030. Adding the options listed that make up the Trialmaster comes to £65,025.
If you click on the preconfigured Trialmaster instead, it starts at £69,240.

What am I missing? That's a £4,215 difference. I know the jackets are pricey, but they're not £4k pricey! I looked at the summaries side-by-side and don't see any difference. Aren't you supposed to save money by selecting the preconfigured Belstaff edition rather than building it up? I hope I'm overlooking something.

Anyway, another month and I guess we'll know.

I just did this with the Australian config:

Trialmaster - AU$109,525
Base model config'd to Trial spec - AU$111,055

 

[ryket]

I thought that the Belstaff editions were cheaper than selecting parts separately and I thought I checked this in the configurator. Maybe I'm misremembering?

I'm not keen on paying extra just for the jacket and badge. I have jackets already

 

[Reducs]

I just did this with the Australian config:

Trialmaster - AU$109,525
Base model config'd to Trial spec - AU$111,055

Weird. That's the way it's supposed to work!

 

[Wayneos]

Weird. That's the way it's supposed to work!

I've spec'd the base model but I'm going to actually change to the Trialmaster now and add accessories to that, works out the same cost as before but I get a couple more goodies, better value for the money.

 

[LCT]

I know I'm late to the party on this conversation, but what you Yanks need to remember when comparing prices to Australia is that our two car markets are VASTLY different.

In 2022 there were nearly 14 Million "light vehicles" sold in the USA.
Compare that to Australia in 2022 - VFACTS shows that 1,081,429 new cars, SUVs and commercial vehicles were delivered in 2022,
Jeep sold over 180,000 Wranglers in the USA in 2022 - they sold only 6,658 vehicles total across their entire range into Australia in 2022

Cost comparison Jeep Wrangler Rubicon

• List Price before onroads USA: $45,000 US (approx. $66,996 AUD)
• List Price before onroads AUS: $90,450 AUD (approx. $60,749.14 USD)

So taking out local Aussie factors like Luxury Car Tax etc, our vehicles cost a hell of a lot more for manufacturers to import because our market is so small.
There's also the fact that it costs a lot to ship vehicles from overseas to Australia compared to the US due to distance. Volume also plays a part into this, we have less ships coming to Australia, so the costs are higher because the shipping companies charge more to make the run here.

Long story short - I wouldn't be using Australian pricing as an indicator for the US market whatsoever.

This.

 

[Dr Zaius]

Just drove past my local Ford dealership stealership (the ones who tried to screw me) and they had a Bronco Raptor on the lot (oddly though not out front or in the showroom but rather kinda on the side). Sticker was $77k but there was a $25k “market adjustment.” Greedy bastards.

That's actually not terrible, believe it or not. I've scoured the earth in an attempt to secure a Bronco Raptor and the best I could do was $30 over MSRP. They're basically impossible to come by. I found two in California which were both $50k over MSRP.

I have something like eight Ford dealerships local to me, and even getting them to commit to an order if difficult. Authorization slots to order the Bronco Raptor are extremely rare, and every single dealership I spoke with either refused to take an order or demanded a $20-$30 dealer markup for the privilege of taking their authorization slot. On the Bronco forum there's a list of dealers who will take orders at MSRP, but the information is way out of date and I had no luck working with those I called.

Even more rare is the Raptor R truck. With a little effort, the regular Raptor truck can be found for $5-15k over MSRP. I've found exactly one Raptor R, and it went the same day for $190k ($80k dealer markup over MSRP). Yes, those prices are ridiculous. And yes, people are still paying it.

TRD Pros also have a big markup here and are hard to locate. Not sure what's going on, but the Toyota dealerships here are barren.

Lots of dealerships have TRD Pros, Broncos, Bronco Raptors, and Jeep 392s listed on their webpages. And the prices aren't horrible. But I've made trip after trip to dealerships all over the state, only to discover I was lied to and they don't actually have the vehicle which was listed on the page. I always call in advance to confirm, and they all tell lies just to get you on the lot. The truth is, dealerships have very little control over what appears on their webpage, and the sites are controlled by corporate. I've spoken to a ton of senior sales managers and it's a sore point with all of them. They have to deal with a constant stream of angry buyers who are upset the dealership doesn't have any of the vihicles listed on the website.

Take Planet Ford as an example. Lot of Broncos and even Raptor Broncos listed on their site. Basically none of those are actually available. I finally gave up on Broncos as the market here is crazy and the markups are in the tens of thousands. Not to mention, Ford just announced a HUGE mid-year price increase that went into effect this past Monday. So Broncos are even more expensive now....

Grenadiers selling for $65-75K here? I'll believe that when I see it.

 

[pioneerofthenile]

That's actually not terrible, believe it or not. I've scoured the earth in an attempt to secure a Bronco Raptor and the best I could do was $30 over MSRP. They're basically impossible to come by. I found two in California which were both $50k over MSRP.

I have something like eight Ford dealerships local to me, and even getting them to commit to an order if difficult. Authorization slots to order the Bronco Raptor are extremely rare, and every single dealership I spoke with either refused to take an order or demanded a $20-$30 dealer markup for the privilege of taking their authorization slot. On the Bronco forum there's a list of dealers who will take orders at MSRP, but the information is way out of date and I had no luck working with those I called.

Even more rare is the Raptor R truck. With a little effort, the regular Raptor truck can be found for $5-15k over MSRP. I've found exactly one Raptor R, and it went the same day for $190k ($80k dealer markup over MSRP). Yes, those prices are ridiculous. And yes, people are still paying it.

TRD Pros also have a big markup here and are hard to locate. Not sure what's going on, but the Toyota dealerships here are barren.

Lots of dealerships have TRD Pros, Broncos, Bronco Raptors, and Jeep 392s listed on their webpages. And the prices aren't horrible. But I've made trip after trip to dealerships all over the state, only to discover I was lied to and they don't actually have the vehicle which was listed on the page. I always call in advance to confirm, and they all tell lies just to get you on the lot. The truth is, dealerships have very little control over what appears on their webpage, and the sites are controlled by corporate. I've spoken to a ton of senior sales managers and it's a sore point with all of them. They have to deal with a constant stream of angry buyers who are upset the dealership doesn't have any of the vihicles listed on the website.

Take Planet Ford as an example. Lot of Broncos and even Raptor Broncos listed on their site. Basically none of those are actually available. I finally gave up on Broncos as the market here is crazy and the markups are in the tens of thousands. Not to mention, Ford just announced a HUGE mid-year price increase that went into effect this past Monday. So Broncos are even more expensive now....

Grenadiers selling for $65-75K here? I'll believe that when I see it.

78K usd for the base model is a good starting point. this is the amount they originally said including the 15% inflation hike. I don't see how anybody could approach things any other way.

can't rule out another price increase to the additional 15% they added last year as well. they can use inflation a great excuse to raise the price to whatever they want.









the bronco is a good example on where the market is. ineos could rape the us customers if they wanted to.

 

[bmore_burnsy]

@pioneerofthenile Ineos reps at drive events and several car mag reviews citing company sources have referenced a $70k price ballpark for the Trialmaster/Belstaff editions. Obviously we won't know the actual price points until 5/17, but it would be surprising to see the base model priced at $78k.