After sale service is terrible

Chuck Gaskin · Jun 22, 2024

I took delivery of my Fieldmaster 3 weeks ago from Regal Ineos in Atlanta. At 1100 miles my air conditioning failed. After 5 days of searching for someone to talk to someone finally answered the phone in the showroom. They were very helpful and informed me that my salesman hadn’t returned my calls because he had been in a bad accident. Hope John gets better soon.
I was transferred to Armando the service managers line and left a message. The bnext day nearing the end of business I called back he informed me I would have to pay for having it hauled to dealership or drive it myself. I have to wonder if my engine or transmission fails if they will require the same ?
I spoke with someone in the showrooms once again and gave a message to GM and Owner to call me and haven’t received a call.
After writing a check for 95k I would expect a dealership to have a working phone system or a voicemail that someone returns.
I can assure everyone that a great product in absence of service after the sale is sure to fail as a company. Ineos needs to look closer at who they partner with in their dealership network. Regal has failed miserably at SERVICE.
I WOULD NOT RECOMMEND ANYONE BUY FROM THIS DEALERSHIP.

anand · Jun 22, 2024

It's very unfortunate that you're having this experience, as most (including myself) have had nothing but great service and communication from the folks at Regal.

I can't say that I've ever called any of them on the phone, but their email response times are usually quite speedy.

Additionally, having to pay out of pocket to have the vehicle shipped (or towed) to the dealer makes sense to me as it isn't a fault that is rendering it immobile, but a convenience fault. If the engine or transmission failed, Ineos' roadside contract would cover towing (within the stated distance) to a dealer.

I've heard of some dealers coming to retrieve vehicles for service/repairs, but it certainly isn't standardized nor would I think it is expected unless specifically stated.

landmannnn · Jun 22, 2024

My experience is service centres who have employed ex BMW staff. No further comment required.

Chuck Gaskin · Jun 22, 2024

anand said:
It's very unfortunate that you're having this experience, as most (including myself) have had nothing but great service and communication from the folks at Regal.

I can't say that I've ever called any of them on the phone, but their email response times are usually quite speedy.

Additionally, having to pay out of pocket to have the vehicle shipped (or towed) to the dealer makes sense to me as it isn't a fault that is rendering it immobile, but a convenience fault. If the engine or transmission failed, Ineos' roadside contract would cover towing (within the stated distance) to a dealer.

I've heard of some dealers coming to retrieve vehicles for service/repairs, but it certainly isn't standardized nor would I think it is expected unless specifically stated.

If you think that driving 5 hours in 90 plus temps is just an inconvenience you should try it. A trip in an oven would compare. Truth is this service is what will crash Ineos

anand · Jun 22, 2024

Chuck Gaskin said:
If you think that driving 5 hours in 90 plus temps is just an inconvenience you should try it. A trip in an oven would compare. Truth is this service is what will crash Ineos

It doesn't render the vehicle immobile, which is generally what necessitates a tow. Plenty of people spent many years driving vehicles in 90 degree heat before air conditioning became mainstream, again I'm not discounting how uncomfortable that drive would be.

To be fair here, you bought a vehicle knowing full well that your closest dealer is 5 hours away should issued arise, personally it is prudent to plan for the worst, and an AC failure is far from the worst

anand · Jun 22, 2024

landmannnn said:
My experience is service centres who have employed ex BMW staff. No further comment required.

Luckily this isn't the case in the US

Zimm · Jun 22, 2024

Chuck Gaskin said:
If you think that driving 5 hours in 90 plus temps is just an inconvenience you should try it. A trip in an oven would compare. Truth is this service is what will crash Ineos

I’d take it to local ac shop for look first, considering the hike. It may be a loose connection they can take care of for minimal bucks.

I’m fence sitter for this reason here, but, RDS did suggest they would ship, as they have internal guys and carrier contacts that save them a ton. You’re not an RDS customer, but Maybe inquire if they would ship it at their cost. It could much cheaper than you doing it. It seems like its possibly the least sucky option at the moment.

Clark Kent · Jun 22, 2024

Zimm said:
I’d take it to local ac shop for look first, considering the hike. It may be a loose connection they can take care of for minimal bucks.

I'm a fan of being a part of the solution; where I can choose to improve a problem that isn't mine to solve but I have an interest in. Proactive or self-interest - call it what you like.

My AC lost gas through a leaking charge valve last summer. My agent is only 20 minutes away (part of my purchasing decision). Ineos Australia (IA) did not yet have the correct R1234yf gas and it was going to be a month before they could supply it to the agent. R1234yf gas is expensive and relatively new in Australia.

I found a local mobile AC repair guy who had the correct gas and equipment and could do the job. I linked my agent's service rep up with this guy to get a price to sub-let the repair. The agent would need to get approval from IA to proceed under warranty. I suggested that IA could choose to close this job quickly by accepting the sub-let cost, or delay the job for a month and maybe save a few bucks but definitely disappoint their customer. IA agreed and my AC was repaired within a few days. That was mature thinking by IA's after-sales team which I appreciated.

AUDIOBUS · Jun 23, 2024

Buying a new car and servicing a new car should not be one of the worst experiences in life, yet for many, it’s dreadful. Not Ineos specifically, but in general. I'm a real fan of the superman here @Clark Kent proactive method.

Serious question for anyone with more insight & experience than I have:

What is it about the automobile industry that produces such broad and consistent failures with customer satisfaction and resolution regarding service? Are the margins too low? Are the customers too problematic? A combination of low margins and difficult customers? Low margins, difficult customers, and a genuine difficulty in providing competent service due to any number of unknown reasons, including but not limited to inadequately trained labor? Or is it as simple as there are too many places to drop the ball, so the ball simply gets dropped, and because there are so many places for the ball to drop, either nobody is aware or nobody has been empowered to pick up the ball?

aB

Clark Kent · Jun 23, 2024

AUDIOBUS said:
Buying a new car and servicing a new car should not be one of the worst experiences in life, yet for many, it’s dreadful. Not Ineos specifically, but in general. I'm a real fan of the superman here @Clark Kent proactive method.

Serious question for anyone with more insight & experience than I have:

What is it about the automobile industry that produces such broad and consistent failures with customer satisfaction and resolution regarding service? Are the margins too low? Are the customers too problematic? A combination of low margins and difficult customers? Low margins, difficult customers, and a genuine difficulty in providing competent service due to any number of unknown reasons, including but not limited to inadequately trained labor? Or is it as simple as there are too many places to drop the ball, so the ball simply gets dropped, and because there are so many places for the ball to drop, either nobody is aware or nobody has been empowered to pick up the ball?

aB

Finding out-of-the-box solutions comes from my 35 years in the aviation industry, where keeping an aircraft on the ground while sorting your $hit out just isn't an option. Get it sorted, quickly. But in my world the budgets and wages are better and the stakes are higher so it's not a fair comparison.

I'll postulate that auto industry folks are from three tribes: Engineering, Sales, and Commercial. Not uncommon for most manufacturing industries.
Each tribe had their own agendas and measures of success. Rarely would these align. Outwards facing managers such as service department heads should be cross-tribe but they're likely constrained by cost controls and business process.

I've never met someone who got out of bed in the morning planning on having a rubbish day. "Y'know what, I'm going to completely ass this up today." I have no doubt there are many good folks in the auto industry who go to work hoping for a good day but get frustrated at their organisation's underperformance.

I'm reminded of this.
Pick two. You can't have three.

AUDIOBUS · Jun 23, 2024

Clark Kent said:
I've never met someone who got out of bed in the morning planning on having a rubbish day. "Y'know what, I'm going to completely ass this up today."

I have used a similar phrase in my own line of work for years -
$hit happens, but without the right corporate structure/support/culture even the best service manager or well meaning tech can get ham strung trying to do the right thing.

In the meantime, good luck everyone! May your AC be cool and your boots dry!

Deleted member 9047666 (user closed account) · Jun 23, 2024

Bad situation. My experience with Regal was positive on the sales side. In my opinion, Ineos took too long to launch the dealer network and I think the dealers are getting minimal support and everyone is suffering.

Chuck Gaskin · Jun 24, 2024

Offroad said:
Bad situation. My experience with Regal was positive on the sales side. In my opinion, Ineos took too long to launch the dealer network and I think the dealers are getting minimal support and everyone is suffering.

Yes. Good experience on sales side. They easy to get on phone and where all very pleasant. Not so when something breaks

I guess I expect same service I get from other dealers when I write a 95k check. Wish I would’ve went to Tampa

DaveB · Jun 24, 2024

Chuck Gaskin said:
If you think that driving 5 hours in 90 plus temps is just an inconvenience you should try it. A trip in an oven would compare. Truth is this service is what will crash Ineos

That temp is just a mild summers day here.
Just open the Safari windows and the cabin will cool down in no time.
Will be a bit noisier than with them closed of course.

DaveB · Jun 24, 2024

AUDIOBUS said:
Buying a new car and servicing a new car should not be one of the worst experiences in life, yet for many, it’s dreadful. Not Ineos specifically, but in general. I'm a real fan of the superman here @Clark Kent proactive method.

Serious question for anyone with more insight & experience than I have:

What is it about the automobile industry that produces such broad and consistent failures with customer satisfaction and resolution regarding service? Are the margins too low? Are the customers too problematic? A combination of low margins and difficult customers? Low margins, difficult customers, and a genuine difficulty in providing competent service due to any number of unknown reasons, including but not limited to inadequately trained labor? Or is it as simple as there are too many places to drop the ball, so the ball simply gets dropped, and because there are so many places for the ball to drop, either nobody is aware or nobody has been empowered to pick up the ball?

aB

I can't remember which US brand it was that first picked up on the Lexus/Mercedes approach to customer service but I remember reading the story about 25 years ago or so.

Most car dealerships reward their sales staff on commission basis which makes the sales guy look at the sale as a one off, because he may not be working there when the customer comes back in a few years time for a replacement vehicle.
This attitude flows right through the dealership.
Lexus and Mercedes take a longer view and want to make the buyer brand loyal.
As they also have a lot fewer dealerships they want to make the customer dealership loyal.

I was at Mercedes dealership a couple of years ago on the Gold Coast (Australia) and had a chat with the Sales Manager while waiting.
He said that if a customer comes in and says he is trying to decide if he wants (for example) a Mercedes or an Audi or a Toyota, then that is not a Mercedes customer and they are not interested.
If the customer says he is trying to decide if they want a C class or a GLC or GLE then that is a true Mercedes customer and they are very interested.

This attitude flows right through the dealership.
The service desks are staffed by people in suits.
They have a cafe staffed by baristas.

The service experience is seen as the beginning of the next sale.

flynnsk · Jun 24, 2024

Clark Kent said:
Finding out-of-the-box solutions comes from my 35 years in the aviation industry, where keeping an aircraft on the ground while sorting your $hit out just isn't an option. Get it sorted, quickly. But in my world the budgets and wages are better and the stakes are higher so it's not a fair comparison.

I'll postulate that auto industry folks are from three tribes: Engineering, Sales, and Commercial. Not uncommon for most manufacturing industries.
Each tribe had their own agendas and measures of success. Rarely would these align. Outwards facing managers such as service department heads should be cross-tribe but they're likely constrained by cost controls and business process.

I've never met someone who got out of bed in the morning planning on having a rubbish day. "Y'know what, I'm going to completely ass this up today." I have no doubt there are many good folks in the auto industry who go to work hoping for a good day but get frustrated at their organisation's underperformance.

I'm reminded of this.
Pick two. You can't have three.

View attachment 7860833

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landmannnn · Jun 24, 2024

DaveB said:
I can't remember which US brand it was that first picked up on the Lexus/Mercedes approach to customer service but I remember reading the story about 25 years ago or so.

Most car dealerships reward their sales staff on commission basis which makes the sales guy look at the sale as a one off, because he may not be working there when the customer comes back in a few years time for a replacement vehicle.
This attitude flows right through the dealership.
Lexus and Mercedes take a longer view and want to make the buyer brand loyal.
As they also have a lot fewer dealerships they want to make the customer dealership loyal.

I was at Mercedes dealership a couple of years ago on the Gold Coast (Australia) and had a chat with the Sales Manager while waiting.
He said that if a customer comes in and says he is trying to decide if he wants (for example) a Mercedes or an Audi or a Toyota, then that is not a Mercedes customer and they are not interested.
If the customer says he is trying to decide if they want a C class or a GLC or GLE then that is a true Mercedes customer and they are very interested.

This attitude flows right through the dealership.
The service desks are staffed by people in suits.
They have a cafe staffed by baristas.

The service experience is seen as the beginning of the next sale.

On the subject of Mercedes, in about 2000 they cancelled every single franchise agreement and took the dealership network in-house.
That was a direct result of the very poor feedback they were receiving from their customers.

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