Steering and Poor Stability

stickshifter · Feb 2, 2024

MRO said:
I agree entirely. I have the KO2 tyres and they were horrible at cruising speed for the first 3k miles and are now fine having worn in and reduced pressures to 37. I tried a dealer car with Bridgestones and they are much better on the road.

None of this should surprise us. When we buy a normal 4wd with OEM road biased tyres and switch to ATs we accept that we are making a big compromise. The difference with the Grenadier is we start with ATs and forget we have made that compromise up front and judge the car unfairly as a result.

Yesterday I drove a Grenadier on the highway up and down a 10,000 foot pass on brand new BFG KO2 tires. Literally - one finger steering. There was maybe a one centimeter "dead zone" or one centimeter of play in the steering wheel at dead center when going straight. That is pretty damn good for a vehicle on solid front axles, with recirculating ball steering, and with kingpin knuckles.

I have never felt there was much in the way of on-road compromise with BFG KO2 tires. We've owned four sets on three vehicles and the on-road performance is excellent. I've never known them to need a break-in period. Maybe it was your air pressure?

Sure, the Bridgestones will be a little smoother on the road, but the KO2 is one of the best on-road driving AT tires you can buy. Your truck should be running great on the KO2s. It sounds like you've run ATs before. What vehicle are you coming from?

Tom109 · Feb 2, 2024

Mine was delivered 40psi-Front/46psi-Rear. Drives great if a little firm. I’m going to drop to 36F/40R and reset the TPMS. From my LR’s they all drove best with slightly higher rear psi.

Mountain4x4 · Feb 2, 2024

You think the stock PSI is bad, Ram recommends 65PSI! Talk about brutal off-road. And EVERY time you go to a tire shop they fill them to 65-90 PSI

DaveB · Feb 2, 2024

Mountain4x4 said:
You think the stock PSI is bad, Ram recommends 65PSI! Talk about brutal off-road. And EVERY time you go to a tire shop they fill them to 65-90 PSI

What do you mean by "every time you go to a tyre shop"???
Surely you only go there once to get new tyres.
Then you don't go back until they need to be replaced a couple of years later.

stickshifter · Feb 2, 2024

DaveB said:
What do you mean by "every time you go to a tyre shop"???
Surely you only go there once to get new tyres.
Then you don't go back until they need to be replaced a couple of years later.

Two possible explanations:

A lot of the good tire shops (e.g. Discount Tire - which is a national chain) do free tire rotations if you buy tires from them. Sure, you can do that in your garage or drive way, but with a standard jack, it takes quite a while. The tire shop does it in a few minutes for free.

Another possibility - many people who live in the mountains run a dedicated winter tire. This puts you at the tire shop at least twice per year (once in the fall to put on the winter tires, and then again in the spring to take them off). If you are driving high miles you might be back more often for the free rotation.

DaveB · Feb 2, 2024

stickshifter said:
Two possible explanations:

A lot of the good tire shops (e.g. Discount Tire - which is a national chain) do free tire rotations if you buy tires from them. Sure, you can do that in your garage or drive way, but with a standard jack, it takes quite a while. The tire shop does it in a few minutes for free.

Another possibility - many people who live in the mountains run a dedicated winter tire. This puts you at the tire shop at least twice per year (once in the fall to put on the winter tires, and then again in the spring to take them off). If you are driving high miles you might be back more often for the free rotation.

Makes sense but not something I am used to.
Previous car had 255/30/18 on the rear and 225/35/18 on the front, so rotation not possible.
Winter here is 15-20 degrees and summer is 30- 40 degrees Celsius so no winter tyres either.

stickshifter · Feb 2, 2024

DaveB said:
Makes sense but not something I am used to.
Previous car had 255/30/18 on the rear and 225/35/18 on the front, so rotation not possible.
Winter here is 15-20 degrees and summer is 30- 40 degrees Celsius so no winter tyres either.

Yeah, I figured you weren't running snow tires in that part of AUS

Didn't you do a side-to-side "rotation" with your staggered tires?

DaveB · Feb 2, 2024

stickshifter said:
Yeah, I figured you weren't running snow tires in that part of AUS

Didn't you do a side-to-side "rotation" with your staggered tires?

No
It had dynamic/active suspension which helped it wear tyres pretty evenly.
Except the rears would wear out a lot.
No idea why

Skydance · Feb 2, 2024

Tom109 said:
Mine was delivered 40psi-Front/46psi-Rear. Drives great if a little firm. I’m going to drop to 36F/40R and reset the TPMS. From my LR’s they all drove best with slightly higher rear psi.

I’ve done a little experimenting and in my opinion on a unladen vehicle (17 inch Ko2). 38psi front and 36 psi rear (cold pressures) Makes the steering lighter at the front, without rattling my fillings out and the rear bouncing around.

Tazzieman · Feb 2, 2024

DaveB said:
Except the rears would wear out a lot.
No idea why

I see you've pressure washed the skid marks off your cul de sac

DaveB · Feb 3, 2024

Tazzieman said:
I see you've pressure washed the skid marks off your cul de sac

She would light up the traction control light accelerating at 150 KMH

Tazzieman · Feb 3, 2024

DaveB said:
She would light up the traction control light accelerating at 150 KMH

That Benz is very capable. They do chew tyres and pads though.

DaveB · Feb 3, 2024

Tazzieman said:
That Benz is very capable. They do chew tyres and pads though.

Front rotors also.

MTNDOG · Feb 3, 2024

stickshifter said:
Two possible explanations:

A lot of the good tire shops (e.g. Discount Tire - which is a national chain) do free tire rotations if you buy tires from them. Sure, you can do that in your garage or drive way, but with a standard jack, it takes quite a while. The tire shop does it in a few minutes for free.

Another possibility - many people who live in the mountains run a dedicated winter tire. This puts you at the tire shop at least twice per year (once in the fall to put on the winter tires, and then again in the spring to take them off). If you are driving high miles you might be back more often for the free rotation.

My F150 has the heavy duty payload package and a higher tire PSI recommended on the payload sticker, but every time I go in to have the oil changed they reset it to a the regular F150 tire PSI, same when I go in for rotation at Discount. So usually end up having to add 10 PSI back to each tire after any maintenance is done.

Catpaw4x4 · Feb 3, 2024

MTNDOG said:
My F150 has the heavy duty payload package and a higher tire PSI recommended on the payload sticker, but every time I go in to have the oil changed they reset it to a the regular F150 tire PSI, same when I go in for rotation at Discount. So usually end up having to add 10 PSI back to each tire after any maintenance is done.

Been using Tire Discounters on my 96 Discovery for 15+ yrs. PSI at 40 all round and "toe" set at zero for > 20 yrs. Excellent handling and wear!!.

Tazzieman · Feb 3, 2024

DaveB said:
Front rotors also.

Very true , esp if you live on a hill.
My wife liked her GLC a lot but was getting sick of the service and fuel costs so we changed.

AnD3rew · Feb 3, 2024

DaveB said:
Front rotors also.

Used to be that rotors rarely needed changing as long as you kept up the pad changes but modern cars, performance cars particularly but also Land Rovers seem to need rotors almost as often as pads.

DaveB · Feb 3, 2024

AnD3rew said:
Used to be that rotors rarely needed changing as long as you kept up the pad changes but modern cars, performance cars particularly but also Land Rovers seem to need rotors almost as often as pads.

Mine wasn't a full AMG but had the uprated AMG Sport pack.
That included the dynamic suspension, different gearbox and larger diameter and thickness ventilated front brakes and performance pads.
Apart from tremendous stopping power it also meant lots of brake dust and pad change every 12 months and discs every 2 years or so.
Of course if I had driven it sensibly it wouldn't have been such a problem.........but......

Mountain4x4 · Feb 4, 2024

Yes, tire shop for rotation or repair and BAM the air the suckers all the way up

Even when you tell them not to.

Tazzieman · Feb 4, 2024

AnD3rew said:
Used to be that rotors rarely needed changing as long as you kept up the pad changes but modern cars, performance cars particularly but also Land Rovers seem to need rotors almost as often as pads.

People have been conditioned to extra bitey brakes and accept the soft materials as being "usual".
And then they complain about ownership being like living in a pelican colony.
Huge bills everywhere!

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Steering and Poor Stability

stickshifter

Tom109

Mountain4x4

DaveB

stickshifter

DaveB

stickshifter

DaveB

Skydance

Tazzieman

DaveB

Tazzieman

DaveB

MTNDOG

Catpaw4x4

GG 4101

Tazzieman

AnD3rew

Inch deep and a mile wide.

DaveB

Mountain4x4

Tazzieman

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