You now can’t use the Smartpass consumer output

TD5-90 · Dec 26, 2023

Logsplitter said:
Yes and works fine

Directly, but properly fused I bet?

Logsplitter · Dec 26, 2023

TD5-90 said:
Directly, but properly fused I bet?

Yes they are contained solar panels with mppt controllers and inline fuses

bemax · Dec 26, 2023

AnD3rew said:
The Smartpass is really just a battery isolator with a few extra features, 50a on the consumer output is fine for most fridges which is the main thing most people would use it for, it was never meant for more than that. Adding the D250SE makes it more of a full DC/DC system. Nevertheless INEOS still runs things differently. You can either choose to give in to the INEOS philosophy and just go with it and use the main battery as the source for everything and the second battery as the backup or rewire it all and go with a more traditional setup. As I have thought about it more, using a mix of the philosophies is probably a bad idea as you could end up with two flat batteries. Currently thinking that I will try the INEOS way for a bit and just go with it. Since disconnecting from the Smartpass I have had my fridge connected directly to the second battery but I think I may either connect to main battery or to the littelfuse block and see how it goes. The main downside to losing the Smartpass consumer output is that it has a cutoff to protect the battery if it goes too low and losing that means there is no built in protection.

But on the other side most fridges have a protection switch which prevents them to suck the battery to death, don’t they?
(My Snowmaster has this feature, so I guess it is the normal setup)

Logsplitter · Dec 26, 2023

bemax said:
But on the other side most fridges have a protection switch which prevents them to suck the battery to death, don’t they?
(My Snowmaster has this feature, so I guess it is the normal setup)

bemax said:
My ARB fridge has a low voltage cut out that you set yourself

255/85 · Dec 26, 2023

bakepl said:
Begs to wonder how they would be able to track down all owners of this product who have installed this device using the then available 80amp output?

Making the updated info freely available on their web site may have them legally covered. They do ask for the individual serial number of your Smartpass when you send in for the kit but they don't require it.

TD5-90 said:
To me even more significant is that they now demand that you mount the units on a "non-combustible" surface. That gives an indication that eventually the plastic case can melt/burn, and therefore they supply a free metal mounting plate on request...

It appears they're more concerned with the unit getting hot enough to burn or ignite whatever it's actually sitting on. If the Smartpass got hot enough to melt down I wouldn't think a thin metal stand-off would stop burning plastic from dripping onto whatever is below. The image of the extra plate looks barely the size of the Smartpass itself.

Jean Mercier · Dec 26, 2023

255/85 said:
Making the updated info freely available on their web site may have them legally covered. They do ask for the individual serial number of your Smartpass when you send in for the kit but they don't require it.

It appears they're more concerned with the unit getting hot enough to burn or ignite whatever it's actually sitting on. If the Smartpass got hot enough to melt down I wouldn't think a thin metal stand-off would stop burning plastic from dripping onto whatever is below. The image of the extra plate looks barely the size of the Smartpass itself.

View attachment 7837235

I understand your point, but the metal sheet will help to dissipate the heat. Perhaps they calculated (or tested) it and they estimate that this is sufficient.

bakepl · Dec 26, 2023

Jean Mercier said:
I understand your point, but the metal sheet will help to dissipate the heat. Perhaps they calculated (or tested) it and they estimate that this is sufficient.

Guess the Smartpass boffins carried out a risk assessment and tossed around a few ideas to limit their liability. One option could have been to design a unit that works without the possibility of catastrophic failure that could burn your car down and replace the defective units with the new one?

bakepl · Dec 26, 2023

Yes but not every appliance you might want to run will have low volt cutoff. I was hesitant to connect any further draw on the start battery as it already has a slight drain and like others am a little old school. Decided to fit victron smart battery protect and busbar to the aux battery (to replace the now unused ctek 'consumer out' and manage my own low v disconnect (and easily monitor v of the aux). For solar input via a ctek D250SE, I repurposed/rewired the roof 25amp dtp.

Jean Mercier · Dec 26, 2023

bakepl said:
... For solar input via a ctek D250SE, I repurposed/rewired the roof 25amp dtp.

I don't remember seeing how you did it. Could you explain or, in case I missed it give me the link to your post?
I have a suspicion, because I was thinking to do the same later on, but, I am eager to learn from others

bakepl · Dec 27, 2023

Jean Mercier said:
I don't remember seeing how you did it. Could you explain or, in case I missed it give me the link to your post?
I have a suspicion, because I was thinking to do the same later on, but, I am eager to learn from others

I ran a new cable from solar input of a D250se under the flooring and up the B pillar (drivers side RHD) to the exit/entry of cables for the DTP 25amp socket. This is described by Ineos as: connection point 'a' for front light bar. Take care not to inhibit side curtain airbag.

Removed existing pins from the DTP and replaced these with the new cable from the D250SE solar input noting polarity.

On an aside... the +ve cable I removed from the DTP is linked to switch 5 (Ext 2) and I used this cable (and switch) to turn on a Victron smart battery protect that in turn powers up a busbar that I connect ancillary items to the Aux battery... (basically replaces the Smartpass consumer out but is much more versatile). Hope this makes sense?

AnD3rew · Dec 27, 2023

bemax said:
But on the other side most fridges have a protection switch which prevents them to suck the battery to death, don’t they?
(My Snowmaster has this feature, so I guess it is the normal setup)

One of mine does (the newer one) one of mine doesn’t

Jean Mercier · Dec 27, 2023

bakepl said:
I ran a new cable from solar input of a D250se under the flooring and up the B pillar (drivers side RHD) to the exit/entry of cables for the DTP 25amp socket. This is described by Ineos as: connection point 'a' for front light bar. Take care not to inhibit side curtain airbag.

Removed existing pins from the DTP and replaced these with the new cable from the D250SE solar input noting polarity.

On an aside... the +ve cable I removed from the DTP is linked to switch 5 (Ext 2) and I used this cable (and switch) to turn on a Victron smart battery protect that in turn powers up a busbar that I connect ancillary items to the Aux battery... (basically replaces the Smartpass consumer out but is much more versatile). Hope this makes sense?

That is more or less what I had in mind after seeing pictures of the "naked" Grenadier posted by @ChaosDogg :

Thanks for the explanation

bakepl · Dec 27, 2023

Jean Mercier said:
That is more or less what I had in mind after seeing pictures of the "naked" Grenadier posted by @ChaosDogg :
View attachment 7837309
Thanks for the explanation

Great image thanks Jean and @ChaosDogg - saved for later reference. Suspect difficult to get to that deutsch with the roof lining in place. For my purpose did not need access as I used the red cable from the outside deutsch dtp.

globalgregors · Dec 28, 2023

Logsplitter said:
Great news. At some point I want to run a lead and connection point from the battery compartment to a connection point on the outside of the vehicle that I can just plug in to, this will save me having to open the bonnet to connect. Have you done something like this and if so you you send a picture for ideas.

Nothing fancy - I’m just keeping my solar blanket out of the dust and off the ground when parked in a compound. I run the lead in through the ajar rear window. The lead you see here also stores nicely in a padded packing cell in the battery compartment next to the battery: so it’s as simple as lifting the seat and connecting a couple of alligator clips.

That said I’ll also fit a connection point once the D250SE is installed and I’ve decided what to do with the whole battery setup.

At this stage it’s been perfectly adequate in the stock setup... just not as squared-away as I’d like.

TheDocAUS · Dec 28, 2023

Was

globalgregors said:
Nothing fancy - I’m just keeping my solar blanket out of the dust and off the ground when parked in a compound. I run the lead in through the ajar rear window. The lead you see here also stores nicely in a padded packing cell in the battery compartment next to the battery: so it’s as simple as lifting the seat and connecting a couple of alligator clips.

That said I’ll also fit a connection point once the D250SE is installed and I’ve decided what to do with the whole battery setup.

At this stage it’s been perfectly adequate in the stock setup... just not as squared-away as I’d like.

View attachment 7837422

Was that photo taken at the Innamincka Pub?

globalgregors · Dec 28, 2023

TheDocAUS said:
Was

Was that photo taken at the Innamincka Pub?

LOL - very close Doc: Tibooburra.

Clark Kent · Jan 4, 2024

255/85 said:
I haven't read through this thread but I thought it wise to make this link available.

SMARTPASS Product Safety Notice

Thanks for the share @255/85

At the above link there is a new installation kit available to order free of charge. There is no need to provide proof of ownership or a serial number. I said in the form comments it was for a Grenadier and I had a D250S installed so I received two metal brackets. The brackets are lightweight aluminium and act as a heat barrier. They're not useful as a mounting tray.
I ordered the kit on 25 Dec and it arrived in Australia today 4 Jan, ex China.

I do think Ineos should be delivering this as a service campaign but it seems they want to go one step further and disable the consumer output to protect the vehicle BMS from 3rd party loads.

Ragman · Jan 11, 2024

Logsplitter said:
Yes and works fine

Assuming your panels have a built in charge controller then?

Logsplitter · Jan 11, 2024

Ragman said:
Assuming your panels have a built in charge controller then?

Yes suitcase style 100watt with built in mppt controllers x 2

Jackattack13 · Jan 19, 2024

After reading all 11 pages, I have come to the conclusion that Ineos just wired everything backwards in comparison to what a majority of us would do. Isolate the starter battery from the house battery and use the house battery for all the toys and gizmos. At this point I would be more inclined to just install a Blue Sea ML ACR Smart Solenoid and call it a day, or if using lithium install a Redarc DC to DC charger with solar inputs. That will have to wait until my warranty is up for that one to happen.

I don't think that Ineos did the plastic plug mod to slight anyone, rather to cover their own asses in the case of liability. This community is much more inclined to make aftermarket modifications, so its a solid way to CYOA and not get sued if someone burns their car down from hooking up a 2500 watt inverter to that plug. Just act like the plug never existed and use a battery terminal on the house battery or main battery. I am still torn on whether I want my fridge on my main battery or the house battery for the risk of draining down both. Although my fridge has a low voltage cutoff, I would prefer not to roll the dice. LOL

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