Grenadiers Towing

MrMike · Jun 23, 2023

DCPU said:
Can we keep this thread as mainly for photos of Grenadiers in action towing?

There's a separate thread for techie and other aspects:

Towing Again

When the configurator first appeared there were at least 3 options of tow hitch ,NATO 2inch ball and ball and pintle now when configuring a trail master only the 2inch ball is showing what's going on £600 for 2inch ball. The rear of the vechicle is drilled for NATO 2inch ball and also a 2inch...

www.theineosforum.com

Back on topic:
View attachment 7817581

Is this better @DCPU ?

ECrider · Jun 23, 2023

Everytime I see those red recovery eyes and chequer plate I'm sold all over again!

Still think it looks the bees knees towing.

MrMike · Jun 23, 2023

AnD3rew said:
Yes my agent says they haven’t seen it yet, but are expecting Grenadier specific instructions for a Redarc Tow Pro

One (TowPro Elite V3) has been fitted so far that I know of, he also changed or should I say, bypassed the trailer wiring and put in a flat plug, same with the NATO plug, he just ran a feed for the Anderson style connection to the rear and left it in place.
The Redarc unit apparently wasn't too difficult to fit.

DCPU · Jun 23, 2023

DCPU · Jun 23, 2023

And an interesting drop hitch:

DCPU · Jun 24, 2023

First Grenadier towing, where trailer seems to be actually towing low:

Maybe full load weight in the boot?

Eric · Jun 24, 2023

DCPU said:
First Grenadier towing, where trailer seems to be actually towing low:
View attachment 7817699
Maybe full load weight in the boot?

Looking at the way the trailer is sitting on its springs, I would say it is overloaded. And the way the backend of the grenadier is down I would suggest that the "s" of 350kg has been exceeded.

MarkH · Jun 24, 2023

The Gren will start to sag in the arse with about +275kgs trailer nose/ball weight, like most vehicles. That setup needs weight distribution bars or similar to return lost weight to the front axle, or steering and braking is compromised. And fitting airbags or stiffer rear springs does not return lost weight to the front axle.

Miki · Jun 24, 2023

Eric said:
Looking at the way the trailer is sitting on its springs, I would say it is overloaded. And the way the backend of the grenadier is down I would suggest that the "s" of 350kg has been exceeded.

The 'car' either needs to be moved back on the trailer or turned around so that the engine/wieght is futher back. You can see the trailer wheels/axles are not equally loaded.
Impressive looking thing though ....

AnD3rew · Jun 24, 2023

MrMike said:
One (TowPro Elite V3) has been fitted so far that I know of, he also changed or should I say, bypassed the trailer wiring and put in a flat plug, same with the NATO plug, he just ran a feed for the Anderson style connection to the rear and left it in place.
The Redarc unit apparently wasn't too difficult to fit.

There is at least one PTO that has a redarc as well

MarkH said:
The Gren will start to sag in the arse with about +275kgs trailer nose/ball weight, like most vehicles. That setup needs weight distribution bars or similar to return lost weight to the front axle, or steering and braking is compromised. And fitting airbags or stiffer rear springs does not return lost weight to the front axle.

unfortunately Weight Distribution devices are great on smooth terrian but can be disastrous on uneven groud. The better solution is to not tow anything heavier than your tow vehicle and set up your trailer well to keep as much weight over the trailer axles as possible

bigleonski · Jun 24, 2023

I’m surprised that given Ineos have about a thousand different spring types (ok a small exaggeration) based on various accessories fitted, that they didn’t allow a heavier spring option for those who selected the tow pack for example. I would have opted for slightly heavier springs in the back for example. Without opting for a lift (may do in the fullness of time) I’ll probably look at airbags depending on what sort of sag there is with a van behind.

AnD3rew · Jun 25, 2023

bigleonski said:
I’m surprised that given Ineos have about a thousand different spring types (ok a small exaggeration) based on various accessories fitted, that they didn’t allow a heavier spring option for those who selected the tow pack for example. I would have opted for slightly heavier springs in the back for example. Without opting for a lift (may do in the fullness of time) I’ll probably look at airbags depending on what sort of sag there is with a van behind.

If you put springs that are too stiff in the back it will handle like a dog when it is unloaded. Better off putting adjustable airbags in if you are going to be heavy towing regularly

MrMike · Jun 25, 2023

bigleonski said:
I’m surprised that given Ineos have about a thousand different spring types (ok a small exaggeration) based on various accessories fitted, that they didn’t allow a heavier spring option for those who selected the tow pack for example. I would have opted for slightly heavier springs in the back for example. Without opting for a lift (may do in the fullness of time) I’ll probably look at airbags depending on what sort of sag there is with a van behind.

I'm definitely looking at airbags, the last thing I want to do is destroy the suspension tuning that make the IG what it is.

Davman · Jun 25, 2023

Miki said:
The 'car' either needs to be moved back on the trailer or turned around so that the engine/wieght is futher back. You can see the trailer wheels/axles are not equally loaded.
Impressive looking thing though ....

I think it needs to be moved back a little - but only a little. The weight engine needs to be over, or in front of the trailers axles - the other way around that trailer would be swaying all over the place.
The Gren is designed and engineered to have 350kg on the back so load it up, even though this will cause the front steering wheels to have less weight on them, causing less steering confidence.

DCPU · Jun 25, 2023

Davman said:
The Gren is designed and engineered to have 350kg on the back so load it up, even though this will cause the front steering wheels to have less weight on them, causing less steering confidence.

In theory yes but in practice people are getting bespoke stickers like this:
Post in thread 'Towing Again' https://www.theineosforum.com/threads/towing-again.12411575/post-1333179476

Eric · Jun 25, 2023

Davman said:
The Gren is designed and engineered to have 350kg on the back so load it up, even though this will cause the front steering wheels to have less weight on them, causing less steering confidence.

I think that statement is a bit misleading. The grenadier is designed and engineered to have a maximum 350kg "s" load. Not a 350kg optimum/preferred working load.

Steve.B · Jun 25, 2023

MarkH said:
The Gren will start to sag in the arse with about +275kgs trailer nose/ball weight, like most vehicles. That setup needs weight distribution bars or similar to return lost weight to the front axle, or steering and braking is compromised. And fitting airbags or stiffer rear springs does not return lost weight to the front axle.

The Grenadier has a rear overhang of 874mm, A wheelbase of 2922mm which will minimise weight transfer front to rear, and better compared to most off its competitors such as a 200, or 300 series L/C 1210mm rear overhang and 2850mm wheel base, and the 79 series half a football field between its rear wheels and tow bar.
There must be a huge weight on that Grenadiers tow ball.

Davman · Jun 25, 2023

Eric said:
I think that statement is a bit misleading. The grenadier is designed and engineered to have a maximum 350kg "s" load. Not a 350kg optimum/preferred working load.

Please define what the optimum/preferred working load of the Grenadier is then.
I have not seen that figure stated anywhere in any documentation.

Surely optimum/preferred is the setup that allows you to safely and legally tow your heavy load in a stable fashion - anywhere up to the stated "S" figure, or GCM, GVM of the vehicle.

MarkH · Jun 25, 2023

Do Ineos recommend using a weight distribution system in the manual when towing over a certain weight? Some manufacturers do. Jeep recommends one on the Grand Cherokee when towing over 2250kgs which typically produces a 225kgs ball/nose weight (10%). The GC has a 350kg ball weight rating.

MrMike · Jun 25, 2023

MarkH said:
Do Ineos recommend using a weight distribution system in the manual when towing over a certain weight? Some manufacturers do. Jeep recommends one on the Grand Cherokee when towing over 2250kgs which typically produces a 225kgs ball/nose weight (10%). The GC has a 350kg ball weight rating.

I've heard nothing from IA in regard to this, I doubt they would seeing as they are not ideal for off road or track use. I'd rather get my load balanced properly than have to use those.

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