Service Reminder - really irritating

[Arkaig]

I have the latest software version - 1946. My gren will be due its first service at 12,000 miles.

When my mileage hit 11,379, a reminder appeared on the headunit detailing Service in 621 miles. That's all very well, but what is particularly irritating is that the same Service in x miles message is now on a countdown each and every reducing mile, not just once in a mile but every 1/4 mile, so 4 times each mile. Having this flash in your peripheral vision on the headunit is so irritating - anyone else noticed the same?

 

[DaveB]

I have the latest software version - 1946. My gren will be due its first service at 12,000 miles.

When my mileage hit 11,379, a reminder appeared on the headunit detailing Service in 621 miles. That's all very well, but what is particularly irritating is that the same Service in x miles message is now on a countdown each and every reducing mile, not just once in a mile but every 1/4 mile, so 4 times each mile. Having this flash in your peripheral vision on the headunit is so irritating - anyone else noticed the same?

View attachment 7830116

I haven't noticed it
But i can't see your display from where I am sitting

 

[Jeremy996]

I feel your pain. Mine now says a "Service in 116?? miles" as it slowly counts down from 12,000. (I just had it serviced).

Damn silly bit of programming!

 

[AWo]

I have the latest software version - 1946. My gren will be due its first service at 12,000 miles.

When my mileage hit 11,379, a reminder appeared on the headunit detailing Service in 621 miles. That's all very well, but what is particularly irritating is that the same Service in x miles message is now on a countdown each and every reducing mile, not just once in a mile but every 1/4 mile, so 4 times each mile. Having this flash in your peripheral vision on the headunit is so irritating - anyone else noticed the same?

View attachment 7830116

The service interval is most probably calculated on your use profile, not miles run. That is normal.

A reason for that is dilution, water and fuel entering oil due to the combustion process. Many small drives lead to a higher dilution with water and fuel and thereby a reduced mileage until service.

A long drive, where the oil gets hot and water and fuel has time to evaporate leads to more miles or to be precise, a slower countdown.

Dilution in diesel engines is higher and lasts longer than in petrol engines.

All that is based on mathematic models based on test drives and measuring the dilution.

AWo

 

[Arkaig]

The service interval is most probably calculated on your use profile, not miles run. That is normal.

Rubbish, the normal service interval is the earlier of every 12,000 miles or 12 months.

 

[James]

Either way, none of us want the car flashing reminders every mile or more, let alone counting down from 12000 miles before a service. That’s nuts.
Although hopefully a ‘simple’ software fix, it does seem that the time between iterations of software is not quick….

 

[AWo]

Rubbish, the normal service interval is the earlier of every 12,000 miles or 12 months.

No, not rubbish! That is the common way for modern cars and explains the behaviour.

And why such harsh words?

AWo

 

[Eric]

I have the latest software version - 1946. My gren will be due its first service at 12,000 miles.

When my mileage hit 11,379, a reminder appeared on the headunit detailing Service in 621 miles. That's all very well, but what is particularly irritating is that the same Service in x miles message is now on a countdown each and every reducing mile, not just once in a mile but every 1/4 mile, so 4 times each mile. Having this flash in your peripheral vision on the headunit is so irritating - anyone else noticed the same?

View attachment 7830116

At least it will only happen ( for some ) once a year. I can live with that if that's all I have to complain about.

 

[Eric]

Rubbish, the normal service interval is the earlier of every 12,000 miles or 12 months.

Yep, The service interval on my cars is time based, X months from the date of reset or X miles from date of reset.

 

[AWo]

From a BMW service document:


SUBJECT
Engine Oil Service with CBS4

MODEL
[NEW]

E70, E71, E82, E88, E90, E91, E92, and E93 with the N51, N52, N52K, N54, N62TU, and N63 engines

[NEW] INFORMATION
With the introduction of the E90 also came the next generation of Condition Based Service CBS4.

The primary change from previous CBS strategies is that the oil service forecast distance remaining is calculated and displayed separately from the time-based or absolute service-due date.
The mileage interval forecast calculation by the DME is primarily based upon an actual fuel consumption variable, which reflects the current driving profile.

It is the total fuel consumption, and not the accumulated mileage, which influences when the next oil service will be forecast as due.

The displayed mileage until due is only a forecast, and begins to decrease at a quicker rate once the remaining percentage drops below 50%.

If the actual fuel consumption profile increases or decreases from baseline averages, the mileage interval forecast will effectively increase or decrease as well.

The learned driver profile (average fuel consumption) is also used to calculate the next forecast mileage after a CBS reset. For this reason, a starting point of up to 30,000 km (19,000 miles) may be expected for a vehicle achieving lower than average fuel consumption.

The oil service will also be forecast as due 24 months after the last CBS reset, and will prompt for the service if the forecast based upon fuel consumption has not been reached.

However, it is recommended in the US market to change the engine oil at least once a year. More details concerning the low mileage annual oil service may be found in SI B00 04 01.

The CBS intervals for other maintenance parts, such as the microfilter and spark plugs, are now linked directly to a multiple of the oil service. For this reason, it is important that the oil service counter be set to indicate the correct service currently being forecast.

The SBT 000104070 (Condition Based Service), SBT 000406148 (Modifications to Condition Based Service, and SBT 000206146 (CBS - E70/71) all contain additional information on Condition Based Service strategy and functionality.

WARRANTY
Information only

AWo

 

[Eric]

From a BMW service document:


SUBJECT
Engine Oil Service with CBS4

MODEL
[NEW]

E70, E71, E82, E88, E90, E91, E92, and E93 with the N51, N52, N52K, N54, N62TU, and N63 engines

[NEW] INFORMATION
With the introduction of the E90 also came the next generation of Condition Based Service CBS4.

The primary change from previous CBS strategies is that the oil service forecast distance remaining is calculated and displayed separately from the time-based or absolute service-due date.
The mileage interval forecast calculation by the DME is primarily based upon an actual fuel consumption variable, which reflects the current driving profile.

It is the total fuel consumption, and not the accumulated mileage, which influences when the next oil service will be forecast as due.

The displayed mileage until due is only a forecast, and begins to decrease at a quicker rate once the remaining percentage drops below 50%.

If the actual fuel consumption profile increases or decreases from baseline averages, the mileage interval forecast will effectively increase or decrease as well.

The learned driver profile (average fuel consumption) is also used to calculate the next forecast mileage after a CBS reset. For this reason, a starting point of up to 30,000 km (19,000 miles) may be expected for a vehicle achieving lower than average fuel consumption.

The oil service will also be forecast as due 24 months after the last CBS reset, and will prompt for the service if the forecast based upon fuel consumption has not been reached.

However, it is recommended in the US market to change the engine oil at least once a year. More details concerning the low mileage annual oil service may be found in SI B00 04 01.

The CBS intervals for other maintenance parts, such as the microfilter and spark plugs, are now linked directly to a multiple of the oil service. For this reason, it is important that the oil service counter be set to indicate the correct service currently being forecast.

The SBT 000104070 (Condition Based Service), SBT 000406148 (Modifications to Condition Based Service, and SBT 000206146 (CBS - E70/71) all contain additional information on Condition Based Service strategy and functionality.

WARRANTY
Information only

AWo

Except it is a Neusoft infomat head not a BMW unit so I bet it is programmed a bit more basic with 12 months and or 12k mileage
aka Land rover and Fiat in my case

 

[AWo]

Ok, then there is another software bug. ..

Hmmm...whereas I still would question which part of the software has the authority to calculate the service intervall. If there is still a BMW ECU controlling the engine, I bet it will feed Neusoft stuff.

Or is Neusoft controlling the engine? Completely? I don't believe that anything else than an BMW ECU with BMW software controls the engine. Software is a far too importand and integral part of a complete engine package.

But that is just an educated guess....

AWo

 

[Stu_Barnes]

I feel your pain. Mine now says a "Service in 116?? miles" as it slowly counts down from 12,000. (I just had it serviced).

Damn silly bit of programming!

Don’t we have an engine hours Indicator as well? It would be interesting to see theres any appreciable difference if any.

Commercially, small diesel engines are every 250hrs unless you’re changing oil based on condition monitoring. Then that’s a whole other conversation. Speaking of which I wonder if anyone has taken an oil sample for analysis yet…

But you’re right @Jeremy996 that’s a bit of silly programming.

 

[Steve.B]

Rubbish, the normal service interval is the earlier of every 12,000 miles or 12 months.

What AWo is pointing out is the accelerated deterioration of the oil with that kind of unfavourable use, but the computer settings are not sophisticated enough to take that in to account ( it doesn't have a built in test laboratory ). So hence 12,000 mile's, or 12 months, one would assume some redundancy should be built in BMW / Ineos service intervals, but like all manufacturers would recommend shortening service intervals with harsh use, or in harsh environment's.

 

[AWo]

The interval is calculated based on mathematic models which were created by many, many test runs and chemical analysis. I read once a Ford patent specification for that. It was published in the internet, maybe i can find it again.

I will also check with the famous Bosch car technology handbook and my engineering readings.

However, the BMW service document should be enough to explain that. These are well known, common strategies and processes leaving no space for guesses...

Like the saturation models of diving computers you put your life on...completely based on measurements and experience....

AWo

 

[JohnHeagney]

I am now about 1,100 miles away from the first service at 12,000 miles. Since I hit approximately 10,800 miles, I now get a very irritating BONG every time that I put the key into the ignition and start the Grenny, I have to listen to this count down BOMG every single time…. A visual reminder would happily suffice in my view!

 

[FieldMonster]

The interval is calculated based on mathematic models…

I bet it’s not though. I bet it’s based on 12 months or 12,000 miles.

I mean, it *could* be based on complex models and chemical analysis. I’m just saying it’s probably not, and there’s no evidence that Ineos have attempted anything so advanced here.

The owners manual (page 219) is pretty straightforward.

The last bit probably also explains why @Arkaig has started seeing the annoying warning after 11,000 miles. It’s a bit clumsy I’d say. I’d have preferred it to be a bit closer!

 

[AWo]

It is, as it is clarly written in the BMW manual I posted here in this thread. As long as Ineos uses the same ECU and software for the engine management (which is the case for sure) it is calculated.

AWo

 

[Mumblepants]

No, not rubbish? That is the common way for modern cars and explains the behaviour.

And why such harsh words?

AWo

Scotland vs Germany in a battle of bluntness and harsh words…

 

[FieldMonster]

As long as Ineos uses the same ECU and software for the engine management (which is the case for sure) it is calculated.

You really think they’re bringing up the warning nag based on interrogating the BMW ECU??

Your BMW example was interesting, but it is for a different car.

Personally, I’d put actual cash money on the Grenadier head unit having a very basic algorithm that essentially says

if ( odometer > 11000 OR date > last_service_date + 11 months ) {
nag
} else
do nothing
}

(It might not even be that clever. Who knows if they’re tracking the last service date. Failing to update it might explain some of the recent spurious warnings people have been seeing though. Thinking of @Jean Mercier)

If it is a simple distance+date check, I’m not disappointed. I’m glad that Ineos Automotive aren’t trying some clever warn-us-when-the-engine-is-tired complex wizardry. It’s hard enough to get the basics right, as we’ve seen, so even reusing BMW’s IP I suspect they’d struggle to make it sensible/fair/predictable.