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- Joined
- Dec 26, 2023
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- Location
- Albuquerque, NM, USA
I am sure many come here looking for some idea on whether this is the right vehicle for them. At 90K+ its a big decision. I did not find any solid posts on this, and I think its important. Lets get it out of the way, Ineos is not for 99.999% of all people. Just as my Power Wagon is not, or where I live, or where I am going to retire which involves off road driving, hauling your own trash, making your own power, hills that can require dual lockers in the winter, and so on.
My journey starts with driving Mitsubishi Monteros 1988- now. Mitsubishi ceased making SUVs around 2000 for the US market,( 3rd gen does not count as it is IRS) at the time they were about as tough as you could get. My 1996 has a solid axle swap and Rubicon 4:1 t case for example and is my main trail rig. For something newer I moved on to a 2005 Nissan Xterra, which while 1000X stronger then the prior generation but was still astonishingly brittle. I had to dump that thing. A few years of Austerity occurred, then building a home, 120hr work weeks during COVID...then finally we started getting back to wheeling and other hobbies. We bought a 2015 Four Runner TRD Pro, but its extensive use of plastic and staggering costs to modify quickly dampened my desire to go full on overlanding build. In 2017 I bought a Power Wagon, like the Grenadier something NO ONE drives. Big, lifted, extreme duty, twin lockers and winch, metal bumpers I have now towed up to 15K around off-road for work on off-road trails endlessly and used it for logging....a real aha moment for what a 4x4 could be. Despite being too big its hard to deny its 100X more capable then a 4 runner. Here we are 9 years later thinking, what next?
1. A Rubicon Jeep is still just too small, too common and has a ton of things that need upgraded, and not real comfortable.
2. The Bronco was PURE genius ! They gave us EVERYTHING we wanted in a 4x4, except they missed the boat on engineering we would find out. Its questionable if anything other then a 20,000.00 SAS will fix it.
3. Well equipped pick up options are exploding, and while I want a Gladiator or Quartermaster for retirement, and another Power Wagon for towing heavy equipment,( its used for a daily driver and sales and is at 165K already!) we want an SUV trail rig and daily driver for now, for my wife.
4. If its does not come with a solid axle, twin lockers and metal bumpers forget it. So what are you going to find with all that?
The "aha" moments came when we went to look at the Grenadier in person. Really, more of a lark as we could wait a couple of more years we decided to set an appointment while out of town for the holidays. After all, 90K is absurd! What were the aha moments?
1. Its the ONLY well equipped 4x4 that will tow our off road camper. Its a 16' or 23' total MDC which is pretty big, but I use it for working on our land and back country subdivision developments.
2. Living with an SAS is Soooooooo much nicer, and other then a Rubicon or an SAS what are you going to buy?
3. Built on Purpose. That slogan really rang with my wife, but makes sense. We prefer extreme duty, utilitarian vehicles. We do not drive cars. And the idea that this rig could live on forever as an off road trail rig.
Here are some tests for you, to see if this is the right choice, in my humble opinion.
1. Is this for commercial off road use at times? If yes its for you.
2. Are you just looking for something cool looking? Not for you. The looks are awesome, but the lack of comfort items will turn you off.
3. Have you SERIOUSLY considered a new Defender? This is not for you. The Defender is a delicate, un-reliable plastic street car, not in the same class. Forget the old Defender, which honestly was not either.
4. Price and Build a Defender. Did you vomit un-controllably? I mean a 100 screens asking what plastic trim, colors, rims, and leather details you want and nothing about off-road stuff. Then yes, its for you.
5. Do you primarily commute or live in a city? Not for you
6. Do your hobbies mostly involved the outdoors? Not just 4 wheeling or overlanding, but most of your hobbies? It may be for you.
7. Did you cross compare any AWD street cars? ( anything AWD is a street car) Then its not for you.
8. Have you owned other SAS rigs? Then this may be for you.
9. Have you changed at least a half dozen CV axles, or tie rods, along with drag links and a-arms on the trail? Then this may be for you.
10. Are you "that guy" that wants to drive something nutty and totally different then everyone else? Clearly, the Grenadier is for you.
11. Can you see beyond the big up front cost and see the long-term durability potential? Then this may be for you.
12. Do you clearly understand the weaknesses of the Grenadier? Gearing, tire size and sway bar discos and know you will have to upgrade? Then it may be fore you.
13. Do you have at least a 1000 miles of operation in a Low range? Then this might be for you.
14. Are you considering a lease? Then it is not for you.
15. Would you join other owners a week after taking delivery for a difficult off-road trip? Then this is for you.
16. Do you understand we are facing then end of our hobby and government lands access in the US, AU, UK and so on? And do you get involved in stopping it? Then this may be for you.
17. Do you like Subarus? Then this is definitely NOT for you! Remember these are my opinions
18. Do you think cool traction control settings will do anything for you? RUN another direction.
I will probably add to this over time. Hopefully my random ramblings help someone.
My journey starts with driving Mitsubishi Monteros 1988- now. Mitsubishi ceased making SUVs around 2000 for the US market,( 3rd gen does not count as it is IRS) at the time they were about as tough as you could get. My 1996 has a solid axle swap and Rubicon 4:1 t case for example and is my main trail rig. For something newer I moved on to a 2005 Nissan Xterra, which while 1000X stronger then the prior generation but was still astonishingly brittle. I had to dump that thing. A few years of Austerity occurred, then building a home, 120hr work weeks during COVID...then finally we started getting back to wheeling and other hobbies. We bought a 2015 Four Runner TRD Pro, but its extensive use of plastic and staggering costs to modify quickly dampened my desire to go full on overlanding build. In 2017 I bought a Power Wagon, like the Grenadier something NO ONE drives. Big, lifted, extreme duty, twin lockers and winch, metal bumpers I have now towed up to 15K around off-road for work on off-road trails endlessly and used it for logging....a real aha moment for what a 4x4 could be. Despite being too big its hard to deny its 100X more capable then a 4 runner. Here we are 9 years later thinking, what next?
1. A Rubicon Jeep is still just too small, too common and has a ton of things that need upgraded, and not real comfortable.
2. The Bronco was PURE genius ! They gave us EVERYTHING we wanted in a 4x4, except they missed the boat on engineering we would find out. Its questionable if anything other then a 20,000.00 SAS will fix it.
3. Well equipped pick up options are exploding, and while I want a Gladiator or Quartermaster for retirement, and another Power Wagon for towing heavy equipment,( its used for a daily driver and sales and is at 165K already!) we want an SUV trail rig and daily driver for now, for my wife.
4. If its does not come with a solid axle, twin lockers and metal bumpers forget it. So what are you going to find with all that?
The "aha" moments came when we went to look at the Grenadier in person. Really, more of a lark as we could wait a couple of more years we decided to set an appointment while out of town for the holidays. After all, 90K is absurd! What were the aha moments?
1. Its the ONLY well equipped 4x4 that will tow our off road camper. Its a 16' or 23' total MDC which is pretty big, but I use it for working on our land and back country subdivision developments.
2. Living with an SAS is Soooooooo much nicer, and other then a Rubicon or an SAS what are you going to buy?
3. Built on Purpose. That slogan really rang with my wife, but makes sense. We prefer extreme duty, utilitarian vehicles. We do not drive cars. And the idea that this rig could live on forever as an off road trail rig.
Here are some tests for you, to see if this is the right choice, in my humble opinion.
1. Is this for commercial off road use at times? If yes its for you.
2. Are you just looking for something cool looking? Not for you. The looks are awesome, but the lack of comfort items will turn you off.
3. Have you SERIOUSLY considered a new Defender? This is not for you. The Defender is a delicate, un-reliable plastic street car, not in the same class. Forget the old Defender, which honestly was not either.
4. Price and Build a Defender. Did you vomit un-controllably? I mean a 100 screens asking what plastic trim, colors, rims, and leather details you want and nothing about off-road stuff. Then yes, its for you.
5. Do you primarily commute or live in a city? Not for you
6. Do your hobbies mostly involved the outdoors? Not just 4 wheeling or overlanding, but most of your hobbies? It may be for you.
7. Did you cross compare any AWD street cars? ( anything AWD is a street car) Then its not for you.
8. Have you owned other SAS rigs? Then this may be for you.
9. Have you changed at least a half dozen CV axles, or tie rods, along with drag links and a-arms on the trail? Then this may be for you.
10. Are you "that guy" that wants to drive something nutty and totally different then everyone else? Clearly, the Grenadier is for you.
11. Can you see beyond the big up front cost and see the long-term durability potential? Then this may be for you.
12. Do you clearly understand the weaknesses of the Grenadier? Gearing, tire size and sway bar discos and know you will have to upgrade? Then it may be fore you.
13. Do you have at least a 1000 miles of operation in a Low range? Then this might be for you.
14. Are you considering a lease? Then it is not for you.
15. Would you join other owners a week after taking delivery for a difficult off-road trip? Then this is for you.
16. Do you understand we are facing then end of our hobby and government lands access in the US, AU, UK and so on? And do you get involved in stopping it? Then this may be for you.
17. Do you like Subarus? Then this is definitely NOT for you! Remember these are my opinions
18. Do you think cool traction control settings will do anything for you? RUN another direction.
I will probably add to this over time. Hopefully my random ramblings help someone.