OBD codes etc.

Jemsquash · Dec 28, 2022

Has anyone heard what ineos are doing with OBD codes? Will all codes be open and available i.e. freely listed. Any further integration with the infotainment system?
I've struggled to get OBD codes for my current 4wd, some Russian hackers ( traditional use of the word) have put together a nice list but hopefully Ineos will be helpful in this space.

Jeremy996 · Dec 28, 2022

I had a long conversation with the gentleman responsible for warranty and service in Europe during the drive experience and was told that the emission codes are the standard OBD II set, but other codes will need a laptop and a software package. He estimated the cost at being around £600. Much will be explained in the electronic manual, but access will need to be via specific tools as some parts have to be locked down. So much for "Open Source", but I guess there is enough there for me to work around it.

As the vehicle gets older, the dealers of conventional vehicles lose interest in servicing the existing vehicle and get Sales to press a purchase order on you, so I will hope for an equivalent of the dedicated marque tools, so I can kick some dealers into the long grass!

Jemsquash · Dec 29, 2022

Hmmm, I can understand some codes remaining unpublished with regards to safety and security.
I don't particularly want to carry another tool around with me, some scanners are massive.
I currently connect up my Android phone and can do most of what I need including look up codes, resetting codes, a few other maintenance items and monitor a bunch of things. It has saved my bacon a few times in remote locations.
When overlanding, space is at a premium, a smart phone has a lot more uses than a scan tool.
Let's hope that all regular maintenance items can be done through their open OBD codes.

DaveB · Dec 29, 2022

Jemsquash said:
Hmmm, I can understand some codes remaining unpublished with regards to safety and security.
I don't particularly want to carry another tool around with me, some scanners are massive.
I currently connect up my Android phone and can do most of what I need including look up codes, resetting codes, a few other maintenance items and monitor a bunch of things. It has saved my bacon a few times in remote locations.
When overlanding, space is at a premium, a smart phone has a lot more uses than a scan tool.
Let's hope that all regular maintenance items can be done through their open OBD codes.

I have owned over 20 vehicles or more in the last 44 years and never once needed to look up an OBD code.
Ink the problem isn’t the access to the codes it is the quality of the vehicle

ECrider · Dec 29, 2022

DaveB said:
I have owned over 20 vehicles or more in the last 44 years and never once needed to look up an OBD code.
Ink the problem isn’t the access to the codes it is the quality of the vehicle

Very true re quality of the vehicle. Had to reset my D4 3 times (air intake) with my ebay special plug in reader on my drive home yesterday (2hrs). Really like the car but the reliability and computer trickery will send it to an auction sooner rather than later.

Tazzieman · Dec 29, 2022

DaveB said:
I have owned over 20 vehicles or more in the last 44 years and never once needed to look up an OBD code.
Ink the problem isn’t the access to the codes it is the quality of the vehicle

You have a Benz GLC ; our GLC threw up a code (thermostat) however the system was running fine . And I killed the code error.
No way was I taking it to any stealership for diagnosis and "treatment"!
I'm afraid you need to be comfortable with OBD codes in modern cars that leave the safety blanket of the city.

Jean Mercier · Dec 29, 2022

Tazzieman said:
... stealership ...

DenisM · Dec 29, 2022

I look at it this way: the IG is over-engineered mechanically and sporting a detuned Eurospec 6 petrol/diesel engine coupled to a strengthened ZF gearbox to optimise reliability. (And there's a top end anti-theft device which if it plays up can immobilise the hapless owner..... ;-( ...but let's not be concerned about that as yet! )

So, I have been dipping into various BMW forum websites to try and gauge what might go wrong / how to fix engine-wise. I am pleasantly surprised at the number of BMW owners who actually appear get their hands dirty maintaining their vehicles ...there's a lot of useful information "out there".

I 'll wager, given the current collaborative "vibe" of this forum, that as we get more collective ownership experience, there will be a significant increase in "technical" threads and we will build a pretty good picture of the overall care and maintenance of the Grenadier.

What is in our favour, is that unlike the now fiendishly complicated product mix of, for example, JLR models with their myriad technologies, we have at least a basic Grenadier with various levels of trim but essentially it's all fundamentally the same (until they start playing with battery toys and hydrogen) ...so the information sharing for the time being will be less complex for enthusiasts. Problems and fixes will be flagged early. That's what I hope anyway.

Jemsquash · Dec 29, 2022

I tend to keep my cars a long time. I've put on just over 300000 kms on my current 4wd with a fair bit of beach, dunes, bumpy lumpy wheel lifting tracks, dusty outback driving etc. Cars of this age have issues no matter how good they are.
I do my own maintenance on my cars mainly because I've been disappointed too often by my local mechanics and feel that I should give myself the best chance of getting out of a sticky situation in remote areas. Knowledge of maintenance and repairs gives me a good chance.
I don't think one can realistically avoid OBD
codes on modern vehicles if one maintains them themselves. For example when changing injectors or suction control valves one needs to inform the ecu that they've changed so that it can relearn them and not to spit the dummy. You might get away with not doing this but it would be inefficient at best. Also don't get me started on DPFs.

This is my experience and I believe in "right to repair" it's part of who I am. Ineos have talked a good game so far in this respect, I'm hoping they deliver.

Jeremy996 · Dec 29, 2022

Like Jemsquash, I keep vehicles a long time and are happy working on them myself. I kept my '89 LR110 CSW 15 years and 250,000 miles, but other than the radio and the alternator, it was as basic as a mantle clock. My 1991 LR90 is little different.

I've been taking baby steps with a 2012 Fiat 500C, a 2002 Vauxhall Aglia and a pre OBD, but fuel injected 2000 MX5. For all of these so far, a basic code reader, (or for the Mazda, an LED's tails pushed into the diagnostic socket), has been sufficient.

Ineos did talk a good game, but "Open Source" seems to be dead in the water. Commercial reality, I suppose.

Ovrland Bill · Dec 29, 2022

DaveB said:
I have owned over 20 vehicles or more in the last 44 years and never once needed to look up an OBD code.
Ink the problem isn’t the access to the codes it is the quality of the vehicle

I don’t think you have had the pleasure of owning a North American Specification Defender

. (I have to keep my OBDII reader close by!)

Disco Dave · Dec 29, 2022

I have an after market, vehicle specific OBD reader for my D2. I consider it an essential item. Have used it many times in remote locations. I mostly use it to help diagnose problems whilst at home. Will be getting a reader for my IG.

DenisM · Dec 30, 2022

Good advice!
I had a "Black Box" years ago for the P38 Rangie... excellent investment. Will consider something equivalent for the Grenadier...

DenisM · Dec 30, 2022

UPDATE: check out the following for the ZF 8HP70 and 750 boxes respectively... the specs might change marginally in the meantime, but the articles indicate that different vehicle manufacturers use their own controllers for the same "modular" transmission!
good info ... something to while away the time waiting for your contract/delivery date ...you too can become an "expert"!

ZF 8HP70 Transmission Problems & Specs

www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com

ZF 8HP75 Transmission Problems & Specs

www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com

stickshifter · Dec 30, 2022

DenisM said:
UPDATE: check out the following for the ZF 8HP70 and 750 boxes respectively... the specs might change marginally in the meantime, but the articles indicate that different vehicle manufacturers use their own controllers for the same "modular" transmission!
good info ... something to while away the time waiting for your contract/delivery date ...you too can become an "expert"!

ZF 8HP70 Transmission Problems & Specs

www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com

ZF 8HP75 Transmission Problems & Specs

www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com

Interesting stuff here, thanks for posting! Just so we are clear though, these are not the ZF variants found in the Grenadier (but maybe there is crossover - I don't know).

The gas (petrol) version, or B58 engine, is paired with the ZF 8HP51
The diesel version, or B57 engine, is paired with the ZF 8HP76

Here is a screen shot from the UK Brochure:

DenisM · Dec 31, 2022

stickshifter said:
Interesting stuff here, thanks for posting! Just so we are clear though, these are not the ZF variants found in the Grenadier (but maybe there is crossover - I don't know).

The gas (petrol) version, or B58 engine, is paired with the ZF 8HP51
The diesel version, or B57 engine, is paired with the ZF 8HP76

Here is a screen shot from the UK Brochure:

View attachment 7798872

True! However, they are fundamentally similar albeit with, for example, different 'strength' clutch pack modules and torque converters etc for whatever end-use is proposed. As well, the suite of sensors appear to be essentially similar throughout the range. It is the OBDII codes which are of interest here.For example if you have a Grenadier with a transmission sensor diagnostic problem, you might find a hint of what's wrong through trawling various websites dealing with everything from tractors to Roll Royce models such is the wide spectrum of application for this family of 8sp transmissions... sometimes different sites explain the interpretation of the same OBDII trouble code in a different context which provides the clue to one's own situation...it doesn't have to be the same vehicle class. The choice of the ZF transmission seems to me to reinforce the Ineos Automotive philosophy of selecting proven "off the shelf" technology.

Fidei Defensor · Dec 31, 2022

Ovrland Bill said:
I don’t think you have had the pleasure of owning a North American Specification Defender. (I have to keep my OBDII reader close by!)

I'm guessing you must have a 1997 NAS D90. You are in luck: the '95 does not even have a proper maintenance manual. And the wiring, ECU etc are all partly from Disco, partly just kludges...... and no OBDII!

Jean Mercier · Feb 23, 2023

Went to my dealer today:

The OBDII connector (On-Board Diagnostics II) is located somewhere "hidden" but accessible at the left under the dashboard (therefore door side) of my left hand driving car. I suppose it should be the other side for the right hand driving cars.

ECrider · Feb 23, 2023

Tks Jean, good to know.

Hannes01 · Feb 23, 2023

Jemsquash said:
Has anyone heard what ineos are doing with OBD codes? Will all codes be open and available i.e. freely listed. Any further integration with the infotainment system?
I've struggled to get OBD codes for my current 4wd, some Russian hackers ( traditional use of the word) have put together a nice list but hopefully Ineos will be helpful in this space.

Maybe a thing for https://bimmercode.app/de/
when they list the IG

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OBD codes etc.

Jemsquash

Jeremy996

Jemsquash

DaveB

ECrider

Tazzieman

Jean Mercier

GG#920

DenisM

Jemsquash

Jeremy996

Ovrland Bill

Disco Dave

DenisM

DenisM

ZF 8HP70 Transmission Problems & Specs

ZF 8HP75 Transmission Problems & Specs

stickshifter

ZF 8HP70 Transmission Problems & Specs

ZF 8HP75 Transmission Problems & Specs

DenisM

Fidei Defensor

Jean Mercier

GG#920

ECrider

Hannes01

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