Q&A Americas What -exactly- is ADAS 1 Intelligent Speed Assistance?

[Reducs]

(Pg. 23 of the US brochure under "Assistance Systems")

I'm assuming, as are many others, that this is adaptive (RADAR) cruise control? Some think it's speed limit warnings based on signage or GPS? Is it both? Is it either? Does it encompass other features? Thanks!

 

[CountyV8]

With 20mph speed limits coming into play in parts of the UK, can anyone say if the speed limiter option will actually limit the speed? For example, the BMW system, where you just press a button to get it to set the maximum speed to stop you from breaking the law and getting a fine/points?

Newbie (so, please be kind!)

don't go to Wales

 

[Eric]

don't go to Wales

Problem is they are starting to role out the 20mph in towns and villages in Scotland as well. Border Council already has, Dumfries and Galloway are going to role it out later this year.

 

[DaveB]

It isn't about size, more a people thing. 350million of them, all wanting to go somewhere.
Highway safety features make long drives much safer and easier.
A regular run for me to the AZ desert is 3 days at highway speed on interstates.
2200 miles each way.
People in the US cover a lot of ground.
I find it interesting how everyone's needs/uses vary so much worldwide.
It's quite the challenge bringing an adaptable vehicle platform to market that can easily be enjoyed in each market.

Wow, you either live or play in the wrong place.
2200 miles each way or 3,540 kms is a huge trip
The circle below is 2200 miles radius from Michigan if you were flying.
I guess the roads are a lot more indirect, not to mention hills and valleys.

 

[Carolinaride]

I’ll be shutting 3 out of the 4 down every time I start it up. These are all federal regulations unfortunately. Adaptive cruise would have been nice and I have a hard time faulting emergency braking but lane assist really pisses me off the majority of the time.

I would like to blow up the adaptive cruise and lane departure every time i get in a car with it.

 

[Lord Ripon USA]

Wow, you either live or play in the wrong place.
2200 miles each way or 3,540 kms is a huge trip
The circle below is 2200 miles radius from Michigan if you were flying.
I guess the roads are a lot more indirect, not to mention hills and valleys.

View attachment 7827769

It is about 2150 from Hillman to Sierra Vista. Undoubtedly because of the highway routes.
It is Oak savannah there. Prime quail hunting, and beautiful scenery. Much like the African veldt, actually.
We are there a couple months every year.
It is About 2450 down to San Diego. One of my kids lives there.

I understand many places people don't travel like we do. And the roads are narrower, and rougher.
It's nice the Grenadier can accomodate such wide differences.
For instance, The fuel tank size is of no concern to me. Other places, it's a deal breaker.
14-15 mpg doesn't look very good, one would think that after 20 years of development that number could have improved.
I say that because my 2001 4.0l Jeep Cherokee Sport Upland version(XJ) (similar shape, and L6 motor) got 20mpg when new, and after 300,000 miles was still doing 15mpg mixed. Same general drive line, but slightly smaller vehicle.
That is a horror in many markets for people.

 

[Lord Ripon USA]

I would like to blow up the adaptive cruise and lane departure every time i get in a car with it.

You can put the car on 100mph and then let the computer do all the accelerating and braking for you. It guarantees you will be driving with the flow of traffic wherever you are.
I don't care so much for lane assist, but it will teach you to use turn signals when making a lane change.

 

[anand]

Wow, you either live or play in the wrong place.

Living on the East coast and having explored our area of the country first, nearly all of our trips start and end with 1700-2600 miles of highway travel (our summer '22 trip to Prudhoe Bay, AK tallied around 17,000mi in 5 weeks). Doing a "team drive" we usually accomplish the out or the back in ~2 days (I do the first 10-12hrs, then my girlfriend and I rotate 4-6hrs drive/sleep stints); is it annoying, yes. Have we seen every cross country interstate multiple times, also yes (we did 3 coast to coast trips, including nearly the entire lengths of the West and East coasts during the Summer of '21).

I turn off lane departure warning in every vehicle that has it, but I have grown quite fond of the radar cruise control in our Sprinter (not so much of a fan of the Toyota system as it is much jerkier); with that being said, I'll go without given the known issues that come with inherently upgrading and modifying bumpers or grilles with vehicles that have those systems (we've encountered this on the Sprinter, her Tacoma, as well as my previous Tundra).

 

[DaveB]

It is about 2150 from Hillman to Sierra Vista. Undoubtedly because of the highway routes.
It is Oak savannah there. Prime quail hunting, and beautiful scenery. Much like the African veldt, actually.
We are there a couple months every year.
It is About 2450 down to San Diego. One of my kids lives there.

I understand many places people don't travel like we do. And the roads are narrower, and rougher.
It's nice the Grenadier can accomodate such wide differences.
For instance, The fuel tank size is of no concern to me. Other places, it's a deal breaker.
14-15 mpg doesn't look very good, one would think that after 20 years of development that number could have improved.
I say that because my 2001 4.0l Jeep Cherokee Sport Upland version(XJ) (similar shape, and L6 motor) got 20mpg when new, and after 300,000 miles was still doing 15mpg mixed. Same general drive line, but slightly smaller vehicle.
That is a horror in many markets for people.

Yes we tend to have long highways and limited availability of fuel, water and alcohol restrictions too.

 

[Trialmaster]

It is about 2150 from Hillman to Sierra Vista. Undoubtedly because of the highway routes.
It is Oak savannah there. Prime quail hunting, and beautiful scenery. Much like the African veldt, actually.
We are there a couple months every year.
It is About 2450 down to San Diego. One of my kids lives there.

I understand many places people don't travel like we do. And the roads are narrower, and rougher.
It's nice the Grenadier can accomodate such wide differences.
For instance, The fuel tank size is of no concern to me. Other places, it's a deal breaker.
14-15 mpg doesn't look very good, one would think that after 20 years of development that number could have improved.
I say that because my 2001 4.0l Jeep Cherokee Sport Upland version(XJ) (similar shape, and L6 motor) got 20mpg when new, and after 300,000 miles was still doing 15mpg mixed. Same general drive line, but slightly smaller vehicle.
That is a horror in many markets for people.

I don't measure with these improper sized gallons. The Imperial Gallon Diesel Trialmaster is doing 25 mpg in mixed driving (only done 1500 miles though).

 

[Trialmaster]

Yes we tend to have long highways and limited availability of fuel, water and alcohol restrictions too.

View attachment 7827770View attachment 7827771View attachment 7827772View attachment 7827773View attachment 7827774

Doesn't look like a very welcoming country.

 

[DaveB]

Doesn't look like a very welcoming country.

Extremely welcoming in most places, but lots of area's that will get you killed if you are stupid and ill prepared.

 

[Lord Ripon USA]

Extremely welcoming in most places, but lots of area's that will get you killed if you are stupid and ill prepared.

Dave, do you think Ineos could actually make it on the volume that rural places would generate? If they go down in price, they are head to head with other more established competitors, and if they go much higher, they are in the G wagon zone.

I think, more or less, that the target from the beginning is actually the upper end of the North American Mid to large SUV market. I think the hook is the OD style, and the Steyr chassis. Interest rates are putting a kink in that, affordability wise.
having built and retooled car plants for my entire career, it costs a lot of money. Easy to spend 500 mil on a refurb. Tough to recapture without good volume and good pricing (read high).
The whole game is based on volume.
I have a thought for sometime that the concept of the bare-bones, bottom of the line cheap Grenadier, was pie in the sky. That’s Mahindrah territory.

 

[Lord Ripon USA]

I don't measure with these improper sized gallons. The Imperial Gallon Diesel Trialmaster is doing 25 mpg in mixed driving (only done 1500 miles though).

Is that a good number for you? I don’t have perspective on it.
We’ll never get a euro diesel here. 25 mpg from a diesel seems like very good Mileage.
I think the Duramax 3.0l runs about that in a 1500 series 4wd pick up here. Very torquey, very quiet.

 

[DaveB]

Dave, do you think Ineos could actually make it on the volume that rural places would generate? If they go down in price, they are head to head with other more established competitors, and if they go much higher, they are in the G wagon zone.

I think, more or less, that the target from the beginning is actually the upper end of the North American Mid to large SUV market. I think the hook is the OD style, and the Steyr chassis. Interest rates are putting a kink in that, affordability wise.
having built and retooled car plants for my entire career, it costs a lot of money. Easy to spend 500 mil on a refurb. Tough to recapture without good volume and good pricing (read high).
The whole game is based on volume.
I have a thought for sometime that the concept of the bare-bones, bottom of the line cheap Grenadier, was pie in the sky. That’s Mahindrah territory.

While this is a passion project Ineos owners are still smart enough business men to have done their financial due diligence.
It was always planned as a limited production volume, boutique car manufacturer.
Also keep in kind their target customers are people who own, or covet, old series landrovers and want a modern day equivalent.
This is why their initial target markets have been UK, Africa, Australia and Europe.
The US market has volume restrictions but more importantly has totally different needs/tastes in vehicles.
I think in reality it will always be toy/extra vehicle in the US as opposed to primarily a daily driver in the other markets.
Unless Ineos build more production plants (unlikely I think) their production volume is limited to about 30-40,000 vehicles a year, of all model types.
So as the orders for the Station Wagon reduce the quartermaster starts to ramp up.
Then the electric version is released. Maybe even a hybrid.
I am pretty sure they will do a station wagon on the pickup chassis, maybe even a two door troopy (doubt it though).
Then hydrogen starts up in about 10 years time.
By that time it is ready for an update of the original.

Based on volume restrictions I agree with you that it has to be high end not bare bones.

I am sure you will see a lot of specialty sub models to keep the orders flowing.
Mining spec and cab chassis ute for Australia.
Chelsea tractor version
2 door 90 series replacement??

I think the early orderers were the only ones that will ever get a cheap Grenadier.

 

[moosetown]

Lane assistance is useless and has been downright dangerous in my opinion. For instance, when you need to do an evasive maneuver and it prevents you.

Drowsy driver detection seems silly as well. If you are drowsy and choose to drive, you know it, and will keep on driving ignoring it. Auto braking is decent but ACC would've been nice.

 

[Carolinaride]

You can put the car on 100mph and then let the computer do all the accelerating and braking for you. It guarantees you will be driving with the flow of traffic wherever you are.
I don't care so much for lane assist, but it will teach you to use turn signals when making a lane change.

Well, i have rented a bmw x7, range rover and Audi suv and all three at the lowest distance would insist i stayed a quarter mile from the car in front of me. Maybe i am more aggressive than the computer but i don’t need a vehicle thinking for me. Ugh.

 

[anand]

Well, i have rented a bmw x7, range rover and Audi suv and all three at the lowest distance would insist i stayed a quarter mile from the car in front of me.

While I appreciate the dramatics, your range is a bit skewed... For Audi specifically, the follow distance is adjustable between 1 second and 2.3 seconds. To leave 1/4 mile gaps, that would mean your travelling speed is ~390mph. The upper limit of cruise control (per their own docs, YMMV) is 200kph (125mph), which means on the farthest setting, your cruise distance (at 125mph) would be 421 feet, or about 1/12 of a mile

 

[DaveB]

While I appreciate the dramatics, your range is a bit skewed... For Audi specifically, the follow distance is adjustable between 1 second and 2.3 seconds. To leave 1/4 mile gaps, that would mean your travelling speed is ~390mph. The upper limit of cruise control (per their own docs, YMMV) is 200kph (125mph), which means on the farthest setting, your cruise distance (at 125mph) would be 421 feet, or about 1/12 of a mile

How much easier that would have been using metric.

 

[Lord Ripon USA]

Not familiar with BMW. GM and Acura have 3 distances, the close one is great for traffic.
when you see pile-ups during rush hour, mostly nose to tail, “I wasn’t paying attention for just a moment”, ass packing, You get the understanding that the computer never answers the phone, never texts, and measures that distance hundreds of times a second. They are way better drivers than we are.
I see it every afternoon.
But turning it off is cool too.
Had a Tesla self driver last weekend, that was really something else.
In our little fleet, my wife hasn’t wrecked a car since we went all in on Level lll safety features in her Tour-X. (Opel Insignia gs, I think)

 

[anand]

How much easier that would have been using metric.

Significantly, but you understand that here in the US we'll use anything but metric