Water pond under jack

[Jean Mercier]

Some months ago I discovered a water pond under my jack at this place:
https://www.theineosforum.com/threa...nadier-today.12411127/page-94#post-1333225304

The cavity only gets about half a centimeter water height and “only while driving in the rain”, well, that’s what I thought. Not in standstill in heavy rain, everything stays dry!

I checked, by placing some towels in the upper parts of the cavity, if it came from above the cavity, and no! The cloths stayed dry, and the cavity got a water pond.

Told this to my workshop, and they didn’t find the origin, but they only hosed the car! I told them clearly: “only while driving”.

Some days ago, after it had rained several days, and after making the cavity dry again, I had to drive on a dry road, no river crossings (still have to find one in Belgium). And to my surprise, even after driving only like 20km, there was again water in the cavity.

My conclusion: the water is coming from somewhere else in the car, therefore there is another pond in the car. I continued my diagnosis, and found (by putting a mirror in the cavity) that there are two “open” holes in the lower part of the cavity:

I removed my rubber mat from the back of the car and the trim part, removed a grommet, and did put a stick with some absorbing paper wrapped to it, and it came back completely wet.

Therefore, there is water in that cavity, and while driving, waves of water go from this lower cavity to the slightly higher cavity under the hydraulic jack.

I also removed another grommet to double check:

I tried to look at other factory pictures of the body of the car, but I don’t find an explanation yet.

As I don’t have the towing option, I also made some pictures through the hole of the towing connector, but at first sight I don’t miss grommets, but to be completely sure, I should need an endoscope!

I think I am very close to finding the real cause of the water infiltration, but need help from my dealer I guess? Wish me good luck, I am not sure he will believe me at once.

Any help appreciated.

 

[rovie]

Some months ago I discovered a water pond under my jack at this place:
https://www.theineosforum.com/threa...nadier-today.12411127/page-94#post-1333225304
View attachment 7837767

The cavity only gets about half a centimeter water height and “only while driving in the rain”, well, that’s what I thought. Not in standstill in heavy rain, everything stays dry!

I checked, by placing some towels in the upper parts of the cavity, if it came from above the cavity, and no! The cloths stayed dry, and the cavity got a water pond.

Told this to my workshop, and they didn’t find the origin, but they only hosed the car! I told them clearly: “only while driving”.

Some days ago, after it had rained several days, and after making the cavity dry again, I had to drive on a dry road, no river crossings (still have to find one in Belgium). And to my surprise, even after driving only like 20km, there was again water in the cavity.

My conclusion: the water is coming from somewhere else in the car, therefore there is another pond in the car. I continued my diagnosis, and found (by putting a mirror in the cavity) that there are two “open” holes in the lower part of the cavity:
View attachment 7837768

I removed my rubber mat from the back of the car and the trim part, removed a grommet, and did put a stick with some absorbing paper wrapped to it, and it came back completely wet.
View attachment 7837771
Therefore, there is water in that cavity, and while driving, waves of water go from this lower cavity to the slightly higher cavity under the hydraulic jack.
View attachment 7837769

I also removed another grommet to double check:
View attachment 7837772
View attachment 7837773

I tried to look at other factory pictures of the body of the car, but I don’t find an explanation yet.

As I don’t have the towing option, I also made some pictures through the hole of the towing connector, but at first sight I don’t miss grommets, but to be completely sure, I should need an endoscope!

View attachment 7837774

I think I am very close to finding the real cause of the water infiltration, but need help from my dealer I guess? Wish me good luck, I am not sure he will believe me at once.

Any help appreciated.

Hi @Jean Mercier , thank you very much for the detailed description. I had already removed all the trim in these places and looked at the cavities with a camera. However, not because of water but because it always vibrated quietly. I have found the cause. It was a screw that the French had dropped in and they had left it there and used another one.

But now I'll have to have a look at the water at the next opportunity.

 

[Jean Mercier]

Hi @Jean Mercier , thank you very much for the detailed description. I had already removed all the trim in these places and looked at the cavities with a camera. However, not because of water but because it always vibrated quietly. I have found the cause. It was a screw that the French had dropped in and they had left it there and used another one.

But now I'll have to have a look at the water at the next opportunity.

If you still have pictures of the cavity, it would be nice to share. Perhaps I have a missing grommet that I couldn't see. Good for you that you found your "problem".

 

[Karearea]

Such great investigations Jean. I’m sure we will all appreciate your boldness at disassembly at some time in our eventual ownership!

 

[rovie]

If you still have pictures of the cavity, it would be nice to share. Perhaps I have a missing grommet that I couldn't see. Good for you that you found your "problem".

I believe that I have always shared all the pictures so that others can benefit. I only looked at the stick camera, but didn't take any photos. What a pity. We could use the pictures now.
But I'll have another look at my photo archive.

 

[Jean Mercier]

I believe that I have always shared all the pictures so that others can benefit. I only looked at the stick camera, but didn't take any photos. What a pity. We could use the pictures now.
But I'll have another look at my photo archive.

Could be I overlooked some of your posts, and I know you share really a lot. But I don't remember pictures of that cavity, or perhaps I was not interested at that time.

 

[rovie]

Could be I overlooked some of your posts, and I know you share really a lot. But I don't remember pictures of that cavity, or perhaps I was not interested at that time.

Yes, that's what I meant too. My camera was too big for the remote corners of the bodywork. And I definitely didn't use the inspection system camera.

 

[acwiltshire]

Some months ago I discovered a water pond under my jack at this place:
https://www.theineosforum.com/threa...nadier-today.12411127/page-94#post-1333225304
View attachment 7837767

The cavity only gets about half a centimeter water height and “only while driving in the rain”, well, that’s what I thought. Not in standstill in heavy rain, everything stays dry!

I checked, by placing some towels in the upper parts of the cavity, if it came from above the cavity, and no! The cloths stayed dry, and the cavity got a water pond.

Told this to my workshop, and they didn’t find the origin, but they only hosed the car! I told them clearly: “only while driving”.

Some days ago, after it had rained several days, and after making the cavity dry again, I had to drive on a dry road, no river crossings (still have to find one in Belgium). And to my surprise, even after driving only like 20km, there was again water in the cavity.

My conclusion: the water is coming from somewhere else in the car, therefore there is another pond in the car. I continued my diagnosis, and found (by putting a mirror in the cavity) that there are two “open” holes in the lower part of the cavity:
View attachment 7837768

I removed my rubber mat from the back of the car and the trim part, removed a grommet, and did put a stick with some absorbing paper wrapped to it, and it came back completely wet.
View attachment 7837771
Therefore, there is water in that cavity, and while driving, waves of water go from this lower cavity to the slightly higher cavity under the hydraulic jack.
View attachment 7837769

I also removed another grommet to double check:
View attachment 7837772
View attachment 7837773

I tried to look at other factory pictures of the body of the car, but I don’t find an explanation yet.

As I don’t have the towing option, I also made some pictures through the hole of the towing connector, but at first sight I don’t miss grommets, but to be completely sure, I should need an endoscope!

View attachment 7837774

I think I am very close to finding the real cause of the water infiltration, but need help from my dealer I guess? Wish me good luck, I am not sure he will believe me at once.

Any help appreciated.

Hi Jean . I dont have any clues, but given my car is currently in dealer for footwell water ingress from the roof since day 1 here's another hypothesis.
Unless we have a complete 3D image of the body showing all cavities and routes, we cant discount that there is a complete 'underground' cavern of interconnecting chambers. All would slosh around to any low point. There are plenty of medical folks on the forum - one just needs to 'borrow' some operating theatre scopes for the answer ?

 

[7jjm]

Hi @Jean Mercier , I have this exact same issue currently. As I drive around a corner, I can hear water sloshing in the back and I have removed the panel and underneath the jack, there is a pool of water exactly the same as you had. It had around 5cm of snow on the roof and the water sloshing happened after that melted, so I guess it's coming from the roof drainage system? The car is completely dry inside. How did you solve this? Many thanks in advance, James

 

[Leonidas]

Interesting ,this would explain why my bottle jack was rusted and there was water between the jack's pistons !!

 

[Catpaw4x4]

I understand there is not a waterproof seal around the exterior roof grab bars (more accurate name??) so with heavy rains water can drip in. Had some interior "rain" following heavy exterior rains last year.

 

[CRH]

I understand there is not a waterproof seal around the exterior roof grab bars (more accurate name??) so with heavy rains water can drip in. Had some interior "rain" following heavy exterior rains last year.
View attachment 7885667View attachment 7885669

Did nobody test these things in the rain. It seems like they just went for extreme weather hot/cold and forgot it rains where most of us live. I get a drip from above the rear door when on an incline, which is my drive. Hopefully my drivers side safari roof is OK now because that's another thing that doesn't like an incline.

 

[Catpaw4x4]

Did nobody test these things in the rain. It seems like they just went for extreme weather hot/cold and forgot it rains where most of us live. I get a drip from above the rear door when on an incline, which is my drive. Hopefully my drivers side safari roof is OK now because that's another thing that doesn't like an incline.

Fortunately I have no safari window issues, just the drips on the panels of the cargo rear windows - an annoyance but nothing to harm (like electronics!!) back there.
Cheers!

 

[Tom109]

Fortunately I have no safari window issues, just the drips on the panels of the cargo rear windows - an annoyance but nothing to harm (like electronics!!) back there.
Cheers!

Something else must be wrong. I don’t have these drips.

 

[Dokatd]

For reference, my truck leaks at both rear windows. The seal for the windows is faulty. If the truck is washed with much more than trickling water you can see it coming down the inside of the window. I assume the rear windows are glued and sealed with typical urethane.

 

[Catpaw4x4]

Something else must be wrong. I don’t have these drips.

My independent mechanic has taken apart the interior of a Grenadier and is the one reporting that there are not waterproof seals lining the exterior grab bars mechanism on the roof. Takes a very heavy rain for any drips to be noticed ... but I haven't ever pulled out the interior to check beneath anything.
Very open to hear any thoughts by others!!
Cheers!

 

[Emil]

Not sure this is of any help - stumbled upon an older post according to which „there is a second set of drain plugs on the bottom OUTSIDE of the vehicle, removing the interior floor drain plugs empties the water into some type of holding tank“ - https://www.theineosforum.com/threads/got-it-stuck-on-the-first-time-out.12414344/

 

[DenisM]

My independent mechanic has taken apart the interior of a Grenadier and is the one reporting that there are not waterproof seals lining the exterior grab bars mechanism on the roof. Takes a very heavy rain for any drips to be noticed ... but I haven't ever pulled out the interior to check beneath anything.
Very open to hear any thoughts by others!!
Cheers!

I removed the front RHS grab bar and curved panel a while back to install a coax cable for UHF radio. Each of the six attachment screws holding the saddle clamps and curved panel in place has a circular seal under the saddle to prevent water ingress. The panel itself has a perimeter seal of the same material. One needs to replace them carefully when reinstalling. Currently in the summer " wet season" where during a fast moving 'super' storm cell, about 65 mm rain (2 1/2") fell in 50 minutes. No leaks, vehicle clean like new!