Trialmaster, 2000 miles first impression

[jly]

Hey all, have been reading this forum for the past year or so while I tried to decide if I wanted to take the chance on a new manufacturer. In the end, I decided to go with a Trialmaster, and got it in early July. The third day of ownership, a spring in the ignition broke and it would not start. Had to be towed to the dealership. Crown in St Pete was great, and immediately took a new ignition cylinder out of a new Grenadier on the lot, and replaced mine with it. Was returned within a day. Unfortunately, this weekend, I was pulling out of my driveway, and the engine stalled. Felt like fuel not making it to the engine. Had it towed into Crown, they suspect a failed fuel pump. Replacement fuel pump and controller should be able to be sourced in a week or two. That's now twice in 4 months and 2000 miles that the truck has had to be towed back to the dealership for being completely inoperable. This does not inspire much trust in the ability to take it to remote areas, which was my original plan for this truck. Have had good experiences with Crown and Ineos roadside assistance, at least, but the truck itself seems to be failing far too often.

Additionally, there are of course the minor annoyances to be expected. The safari windows leak, seatbelt alarm goes off even when seatbelt is buckled, heat comes on for no reason. rear tailgate alarm often goes off even when the tailgate is shut. Those are to be expected from a new manufacturer, and they aren't a huge deal. I've owned old Defenders for years and years, minor annoyances are par for the course for trucks like this.

 

[anand]

Your two primary failures are definitely not common ones (or ones that I've heard of on the forum as of yet).

As for the rest, there is a TSB for the Safari leak and the dealer can easily rectify that (surprised they haven't yet), the rear door alarm means the catches need to be adjusted slightly, this also should be able to be done by the dealer in literally <5 minutes (or yourself with a wrench in the same time span)

 

[jly]

Your two primary failures are definitely not common ones (or ones that I've heard of on the forum as of yet).

As for the rest, there is a TSB for the Safari leak and the dealer can easily rectify that (surprised they haven't yet), the rear door alarm means the catches need to be adjusted slightly, this also should be able to be done by the dealer in literally <5 minutes (or yourself with a wrench in the same time span)

Yup, the minor annoyances are no big deal - dealer is fixing those as best they can while it's in. It's the major things that seem concerning. They said they have seen other fuel pump failures as well. The ignition was a one off.

 

[Phred]

May I ask your trucks build date on the sticker on drivers door.

 

[jly]

May I ask your trucks build date on the sticker on drivers door.

Build date is 03/24.

 

[SkiBum1]

Hey all, have been reading this forum for the past year or so while I tried to decide if I wanted to take the chance on a new manufacturer. In the end, I decided to go with a Trialmaster, and got it in early July. The third day of ownership, a spring in the ignition broke and it would not start. Had to be towed to the dealership. Crown in St Pete was great, and immediately took a new ignition cylinder out of a new Grenadier on the lot, and replaced mine with it. Was returned within a day. Unfortunately, this weekend, I was pulling out of my driveway, and the engine stalled. Felt like fuel not making it to the engine. Had it towed into Crown, they suspect a failed fuel pump. Replacement fuel pump and controller should be able to be sourced in a week or two. That's now twice in 4 months and 2000 miles that the truck has had to be towed back to the dealership for being completely inoperable. This does not inspire much trust in the ability to take it to remote areas, which was my original plan for this truck. Have had good experiences with Crown and Ineos roadside assistance, at least, but the truck itself seems to be failing far too often.

Additionally, there are of course the minor annoyances to be expected. The safari windows leak, seatbelt alarm goes off even when seatbelt is buckled, heat comes on for no reason. rear tailgate alarm often goes off even when the tailgate is shut. Those are to be expected from a new manufacturer, and they aren't a huge deal. I've owned old Defenders for years and years, minor annoyances are par for the course for trucks like this.

I have never heard of the first two issues. That is so weird actually. Look, it is a brand new vehicle and bound to have a few bad apples in the barrel. I think it is more a case of bad luck vs a problem with the entire brand. Maybe just shoot your dealer a note and ask if you can swap your for a different one all together. Usually each states lemon laws allow this after so many issues in a short period of time. Maybe the frenchies made yours after a long lunch of Bordeaux of something??

 

[jly]

Just an update - had another fuel pump-related CEL come on, and my A/C which has been intermittently blowing hot even when set to cold is now permanently blowing hot. Back at the dealership, and have begun lemon law proceedings. Two of my neighbors had deposits down on them, but canceled after hearing from me and seeing mine on a tow truck on three separate occasions. It seems the QC on this truck just isn't up to par. I like the idea of the truck, but the execution has simply failed.

I don't have bad things to say about Crown Ineos in particular, but I have been incredibly disappointed with the quality of service from Ineos themselves.

 

[ryket]

Maybe the frenchies made yours after a long lunch of Bordeaux of something??

I blame every build quality issue on this.

@jly if you change your mind, I would take the truck on a long road trip to see if it breaks down again. If it doesn't, then you're probably fine. Catastrophic failures seem to be pretty rare on these.

What vehicle are you looking at as a replacement?

There is a known issue with the CEL coming on due to a fuel tank sensor issue. There's a software fix for it. Not sure if this is the problem you're seeing.

 

[jly]

I'd say I've already had 2 catastrophic failures, in that they completely immobilized the truck (ignition and fuel pump), and required towing to the dealership. This A/C one has been ongoing since purchase, and they had been unable to diagnose it any of the other times back at the dealership. Now they're saying it was low on coolant from the factory, but I'm skeptical of that considering it's been back there twice for the other issues, this complaint was disclosed, and they apparently never noticed that the coolant was low before.

I'm not sure that I'll replace it with anything, I have 3 other vehicles and I'll probably just use those. It's too bad, I really like the Grenadier when it works, but it just seems to have endless issues. The only thing that I'd say is comparable is the G-wagen, and I've never really liked those.

 

[DoubleDoom]

This A/C one has been ongoing since purchase, and they had been unable to diagnose it any of the other times back at the dealership. Now they're saying it was low on coolant from the factory, but I'm skeptical of that considering it's been back there twice for the other issues, this complaint was disclosed, and they apparently never noticed that the coolant was low before.

uneven coolent levels is the most common reason for the heating. There is a bulletin to dealers telling them how to do it. However, it appears some dealers have not been doing it correctly.

 

[ryket]

Fair enough, if my truck got towed twice I probably wouldn't trust it either. If you can get your money back then that's a rational choice - hopefully build quality will improve in the next few years and you can try again...

As DoubleDoom said, the coolant issue is a common problem so your dealer is probably telling the truth.

 

[CRH]

As the lemon law exists in US then it must get used for other vehicle manufacturers. I would be interested to see percentages of each manufacturers as a genuine comparison of quality

 

[anand]

As the lemon law exists in US then it must get used for other vehicle manufacturers. I would be interested to see percentages of each manufacturers as a genuine comparison of quality

It gets used very frequently amongst other manufacturers... I'm not sure if any/how many have been bought back by Ineos, but if any have, I would strongly assume the number is less than a handful. On the other hand, I've heard from a friend who used to work at a fairly busy Mercedes dealer that they were processing a handful (or more) buybacks each month just through their dealer alone

 

[Tenac]

As the lemon law exists in US then it must get used for other vehicle manufacturers. I would be interested to see percentages of each manufacturers as a genuine comparison of quality

That is a great question, I do not know if any of them actually track that number publicly. It would be interesting for sure, I do know if it was lemon in AZ but still fixable and back on sale it must show that before sale. I have seen online one or two time to time that show lemon but not more than a couple. My guess is only way to find that out would be the loss they take each year and try to find details. I'm kinda on the opposite side of anand here. I would assume a new vehicle company would be fast to act on trouble some vehicles to get them back for engineering review. They are early and taking hit on loss isn't as impactful as one may think when compared to an established company.

 

[LeeroyJ]

Because of the labeling requirements mentioned by @Tenac I suspect that avoiding the "lemon" label being associated with a particular vehicle is important to manufacturers and dealers. As a result, they probably often fight the proceedings just to the brink, but then back off and agree to accept the return before it actually must officially be labeled a "lemon". That way they can repair the current issues, polish it up, and try to sell it to the next unsuspecting consumer without disclosing the lemon status. If my suspicion is true, then it would also make the statistical reporting mentioned by @CRH inaccurate.

For what its worth, I had a bunch of problems the first 3,000 miles and debated going the lemon-law route. I'm now almost at 15,000 miles and haven't had any problems in the last 12,000... knock on wood.