Steering stabilizer bar

[MattG]

Hi Matt, where did you buy it and do you have a part number? I am in Melbourne

Hiya, I bought mine from Agile Off-road in Santee California (www.agileoffroad.com)
The part number is AGA1001.
It cost US$350 including delivery.
Cheers, Matt

 

[Zimm]

BTW has anyone actually died from "death" wobble???

Should we make his a poll?

Without witnesses, how does one prove death wobble at the scene of an accident?

 

[LC0013]

That's Australian dollars... it's roughly $450 USD.

Well, still too dang high for me. Gosh, a OME steering damper for a 2013 Land Cruiser is only $101 USD.

 

[Shopkeep]

Should we make his a poll?

Without witnesses, how does one prove death wobble at the scene of an accident?

Maybe we need a classification system, how much wobble qualifies it as a true death wobble? Maybe there is a serious injury wobble, or possibly a soiled my pants wobble?

 

[KLF]

Just searched up "death wobble" on the forum as I'm dealing with this issue at the moment. My unit has about 10K miles on it. I had an annoying bell ringing sound that was occurring on my Grenadier when on bumpy dirt roads coming from the steering damper... when I had my vehicle in to dealership for tow package install / routine maintenance, I had them put the fox unit in to address ringing sound, realizing the gains others have spoke of just an added bonus. That said, shortly afterward, I experienced severe and quite close to uncontrollable shaking while on highway at speed of roughly 70mph. The shaking was violent... and I was white knuckling it to get it to the side of the road. I had to park it, Uber an hour and half to an airport to catch a flight, and called the dealer to pick it up and address the issue. They did a detailed review over a week, but could not identify what caused the problem. Best they could gather was "something must have been temporarily caught in a wheel." I was away most of the summer, only recently taking the vehicle out on the highway again. First 60 miles or so... no problem. Then, out of nowhere, the same death wobble happened. No pot hole hit. Just straight, flat highway... again around 65-70mph. Here too, shaking was severe. Bad to point I again parked the car, really unable to drive it other than non highway trips around town. Dealer has now given me a loaner vehicle while they again try to figure out what is going on. Any guidance from others would be helpful as the general sense I'm getting is that I'm making the situation up. Passengers were with me both times... they are now scared to ride in the vehicle. Overall, I love the Grenadier but there is a dangerous issue, hopefully isolated to my vehicle, at play.

I came on here to see if what happened to me the other day has happened to anyone else. Your post hit too close to home! I had RDS install a steering stabilizer prior to picking it up. I went underneath it yesterday and it's OME. I only have 1,600miles so far. I was driving with my 17 year old son going about 65mph in the middle lane and the steering wheel started to violently shake. I was terrified. I'm on the smaller side 5'4" 125lbs and it took all of my might just to keep the car straight. I had an 18 wheeler to my right so I couldn't even get over to the shoulder. Of course it felt like it lasted forever but maybe it was 20 seconds. Once we got to our destination, my husband and I switched cars and the same thing happened to him on the way home! All I kept thinking was that if any of my 3 kids were driving the Grenadier when this happened I truly believe they would have had an accident. And just like your passengers, after what my son witnessed he was like mom- you are getting rid of this car and never driving it again. I had it towed to RDS (Philly) and they will look at it on Monday but I'm so nervous to get behind the wheel again!!

 

[shiv.nandak]

You installed a damper that is notably softer (and less able to dampen large impacts/motions) than the factory damper, it isn't all that surprising you had a wobble at high speed

I was very surprised that everyone jumping on the steering damper bandwagon did not foresee this . Almost like the engineers choose to make the steering worse for absolutely no reason.

 

[Shopkeep]

I came on here to see if what happened to me the other day has happened to anyone else. Your post hit too close to home! I had RDS install a steering stabilizer prior to picking it up. I went underneath it yesterday and it's OME. I only have 1,600miles so far. I was driving with my 17 year old son going about 65mph in the middle lane and the steering wheel started to violently shake. I was terrified. I'm on the smaller side 5'4" 125lbs and it took all of my might just to keep the car straight. I had an 18 wheeler to my right so I couldn't even get over to the shoulder. Of course it felt like it lasted forever but maybe it was 20 seconds. Once we got to our destination, my husband and I switched cars and the same thing happened to him on the way home! All I kept thinking was that if any of my 3 kids were driving the Grenadier when this happened I truly believe they would have had an accident. And just like your passengers, after what my son witnessed he was like mom- you are getting rid of this car and never driving it again. I had it towed to RDS (Philly) and they will look at it on Monday but I'm so nervous to get behind the wheel again!!

Calm you nerves and get your dealer to refit the factory damper.

It would be great to get some more data & perspective on these “death” wobble events, I might be wrong but they seem to be occurring exclusively in the US. Now this may be because there are far more US customers fitting aftermarket dampers to their Grenadiers, but may it also be due to the unique construction methods used on freeways there? Are the concrete freeways with their regular expansion joints contributing to the issue, does the rhythmic jolt of the expansion joints set off the wobble? Or have they also occurred on smoother asphalt surfaces?

I have driven extensively throughout the free world but the US freeways in major cities are by far the roughest and worst maintained I have encountered. I love the ones that have the expansion joints plus slabs that have settled and bowed in the middle, beats a carnival ride any day!

 

[Clark Kent]

Calm you nerves and get your dealer to refit the factory damper.

It would be great to get some more data & perspective on these “death” wobble events, I might be wrong but they seem to be occurring exclusively in the US. Now this may be because there are far more US customers fitting aftermarket dampers to their Grenadiers, but may it also be due to the unique construction methods used on freeways there? Are the concrete freeways with their regular expansion joints contributing to the issue, does the rhythmic jolt of the expansion joints set off the wobble? Or have they also occurred on smoother asphalt surfaces?

I have driven extensively throughout the free world but the US freeways in major cities are by far the roughest and worst maintained I have encountered. I love the ones that have the expansion joints plus slabs that have settled and bowed in the middle, beats a carnival ride any day!

I would add to that the empirical evidence of the 'how fast have you gone?' thread.
These live-axle rigs are not built for the Cannonball Run.

 

[Stu_Barnes]

I came on here to see if what happened to me the other day has happened to anyone else. Your post hit too close to home! I had RDS install a steering stabilizer prior to picking it up. I went underneath it yesterday and it's OME. I only have 1,600miles so far. I was driving with my 17 year old son going about 65mph in the middle lane and the steering wheel started to violently shake. I was terrified. I'm on the smaller side 5'4" 125lbs and it took all of my might just to keep the car straight. I had an 18 wheeler to my right so I couldn't even get over to the shoulder. Of course it felt like it lasted forever but maybe it was 20 seconds. Once we got to our destination, my husband and I switched cars and the same thing happened to him on the way home! All I kept thinking was that if any of my 3 kids were driving the Grenadier when this happened I truly believe they would have had an accident. And just like your passengers, after what my son witnessed he was like mom- you are getting rid of this car and never driving it again. I had it towed to RDS (Philly) and they will look at it on Monday but I'm so nervous to get behind the wheel again!!

Did RDS advise for you to change out the steering stabilizer prior to delivery?

 

[jcurtin]

All - my unit's wobble issue is actively being worked at my dealer. I have a loaner Grenadier in the meantime from them. They were able to finally recreate the issue themselves, believe it stems from the damper, will be putting original unit back on, expect that will fix the issue. Note that in June they were certain the damper was not the issue... this is an about face on their part.
Regarding a general sense of "relax" and "just chill" I'm sensing... I'd caution those that switched dampers to not take this topic too lightly. If what I experienced (twice) and it sounds like KLF experienced happens with others (which it, logically, at some point will)... it is not a matter of if... but rather when... a very bad accident will occur. I'll define bad for clarity. High speed interstate trafffic, driver loses control of Grenadier (because they are inexperienced, has one hand on a coffee cup, etc.)... multicar accident happens... and death results... damaging a brand that is still in process of establishing its name. The wobble here is not uncomfortable vibrations... it is white knuckle the steering wheel or lose control type shaking. It sounds like the stock Grenadier is fine on this front... but the Grenadier with the different damper (at least some of them) is not. Where the stock damper, however, at least on my unit, was not fine is for an entirely different issue. Taken offroad (ex: White Rim in UT)... my Grenadier sounds like an ice cream truck with all the ringing coming from the stock damper when going over bumps. As mentioned earlier, it was the ringing that had me switch over in the first place.

 

[jcurtin]

I came on here to see if what happened to me the other day has happened to anyone else. Your post hit too close to home! I had RDS install a steering stabilizer prior to picking it up. I went underneath it yesterday and it's OME. I only have 1,600miles so far. I was driving with my 17 year old son going about 65mph in the middle lane and the steering wheel started to violently shake. I was terrified. I'm on the smaller side 5'4" 125lbs and it took all of my might just to keep the car straight. I had an 18 wheeler to my right so I couldn't even get over to the shoulder. Of course it felt like it lasted forever but maybe it was 20 seconds. Once we got to our destination, my husband and I switched cars and the same thing happened to him on the way home! All I kept thinking was that if any of my 3 kids were driving the Grenadier when this happened I truly believe they would have had an accident. And just like your passengers, after what my son witnessed he was like mom- you are getting rid of this car and never driving it again. I had it towed to RDS (Philly) and they will look at it on Monday but I'm so nervous to get behind the wheel again!!

Thanks for sharing your experience... glad you're ok. They have a serious issue here... I'll reach out to Ineos to let them know another bad incident happened. Hopefully priority will increase to help others avoid same bad situation happening.

 

[Shopkeep]

Thanks for sharing your experience... glad you're ok. They have a serious issue here... I'll reach out to Ineos to let them know another bad incident happened. Hopefully priority will increase to help others avoid same bad situation happening.

Not sure Ineos Automotive has a serious issue as they will say don’t fit an aftermarket damper. Some US Ineos dealers who seem to have proactively fitted these aftermarket dampers may be the ones with the issue and may be a better target of your outreach.

 

[JP4]

Yes, fox makes one. It's part of their race series. 24 clicks of adjustment. But these need rebuilt after roughly 10k miles.

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Wait. What? After 10k? WTF?

 

[Aussie Battler]

Hi Matt, where did you buy it and do you have a part number? I am in Melbourne

Just a bit of interesting informatiom , I fitted a bilstien damper packaged for a grenadier and discovered that it is the same as a bilstien for a disco2 except for a spacer to make it fit one end , the disco2 damper is half the price spacer would cost about $20 at a nachine shop .certainly improved it but the greatest gain is to get the castor set at max spec of 2.3 degres . now my grenadier steeres as good as my disco2

 

[Stu_Barnes]

Thanks for sharing your experience... glad you're ok. They have a serious issue here... I'll reach out to Ineos to let them know another bad incident happened. Hopefully priority will increase to help others avoid same bad situation happening.

I’m not aware of any stock vehicles experiencing death wobble (so far) As people seem intent on modifying things it may be time to identify the part numbers for dampers that work and don’t.
The aftermarket have jumped on this subject pretty aggressively, I’d double check their R&D and testing regimen prior to installing. We’ve already seen some YouTube content from companies inventing a fix for an imagined problem. That’s not necessarily the case here but please be careful.

With regards to components that work. Hopefully we can identify a list of parts which work and root out those that aren’t up to the job.


As for me. I’m not messing with that aspect of my vehicle, it really doesn’t bother me that much and adds to the driving feel of the Grenadier. For those that do, I’d be seriously checking my insurance to make sure that I was still covered with using non homologated parts on the steering system, especially something that’s easily identifiable as non original.

 

[Catpaw4x4]

I came on here to see if what happened to me the other day has happened to anyone else. Your post hit too close to home! I had RDS install a steering stabilizer prior to picking it up. I went underneath it yesterday and it's OME. I only have 1,600miles so far. I was driving with my 17 year old son going about 65mph in the middle lane and the steering wheel started to violently shake. I was terrified. I'm on the smaller side 5'4" 125lbs and it took all of my might just to keep the car straight. I had an 18 wheeler to my right so I couldn't even get over to the shoulder. Of course it felt like it lasted forever but maybe it was 20 seconds. Once we got to our destination, my husband and I switched cars and the same thing happened to him on the way home! All I kept thinking was that if any of my 3 kids were driving the Grenadier when this happened I truly believe they would have had an accident. And just like your passengers, after what my son witnessed he was like mom- you are getting rid of this car and never driving it again. I had it towed to RDS (Philly) and they will look at it on Monday but I'm so nervous to get behind the wheel again!!

Do let us know what is determined to be the problem. Out of balance tires? (Probably not ) U joint ?? Had something similar happen on my 96 Discovery on the interstate coming home from the airport ~1am years ago - just out to the clear blue! Waited for AAA to come to the rescue.

 

[anand]

Wait. What? After 10k? WTF?

Or 1,000mi of off road driving....

 

[Tazzieman]

This is an interesting thread
Absolutely not changing my stock setup.

 

[Cheshire cat]

This is an interesting thread
Absolutely not changing my stock setup.

I can’t imagine what improvement I might get. Steering causes me no issues whatsoever. Well, with exception of turning circle

 

[KLF]

Did RDS advise for you to change out the steering stabilizer prior to delivery?

No, I requested it. They just called me to tell me the problem was with the OME stabilizer that was installed. So my 2 choices were to go back to factory or switch it to the Fox stabilizer. As terrifying as my experience was, I opted to go with the Fox. I have a 2020 Defender and that will be the only car that I take on the highway again. I'll just use the Grenadier for around town.