Grenadier QM over Gladiator

[stickshifter]

Wow, I see they've upped the tow specs on the Gladiator. Maybe by using the full-float Dana 44 which they've only now thrown in to rob some thunder from the QM? Jeep could have done that before but didn't until now because there hasn't been any direct competitors for to the Gladiator (solid axles, BOF, F&R lockers). They're certainly screaming "Best in Class" at this point. Carraro also offers a FF rear so I imagine it's coming as an upgrade in a year or two on the Ineos products. But that's not the whole story.

The higher Gladiator tow rating is with the anemic old V6. It matches the petrol BMW in the Quartermaster for horse power but puts out 100 ft.-lbs. of torque less. I doubt the 3.6 will hold up long term to very heavy towing in ruff conditions despite it's naturally aspirated simplicity. It's probably fine on the highway but don't get yourself bogged. Jeep's diesel engine must be one heavy lump to cut the tow capacity by 1700 lbs! I didn't look to see what the 392 version (?) can tow.

Even if you call it a wash on the towing, the QM is still built heavier and that's a consideration for those not on the blacktop. I'm not in the market for a mid-sized pickup but my money would be on the QM for longevity. Then there's the issue of brake size and trailering software. Who's got the better ESC when the GCWR is high?

Yeah - the 3.6 can get bogged on the highway, especially at altitude (like when you are in the left lane and a semi pulls in front of you to pass another semi, and you have to quickly slow down; then you scramble for a deep downshift with the manual gearbox). Also - even though max horse power numbers are similar between the 3.6 and the B58 in the Gren - all the power and torque from the B58 is available at ~1,400 rpms, unlike the 3.6, which needs to be revved out past 3,500 rpms. Like you said, not only will the QM hold up to abuse much longer than the Gladiator, it will be a better towing experience with power available at much lower rpms.

 

[Mountain4x4]

I honestly do not need one for a few years, and would be getting a Hurricane engine instead.

 

[Tinaxerler]

I won't even try to be comprehensive here, nor do I know anything about pricing of either vehicle in your country, so this will just be my take on the major differences. I'm also not going to get into reliability, as it will take years for us to know as much about the Grenadier and QM as we do about the Jeep products.

QM advantages
1- Much better drive train. The 3.6 Pentastar in the Gladiator is not very powerful, and the 3.0 Eco-Diesel has not been very reliable. The BMW engines are better, and the German-produced ZF transmission is probably better quality than the ZF in the Gladiator, which is made in either the US or Mexico (I forget which). Both BMW engines provide good low-end torque (much better than the 3.6). The 3.0 Eco-Diesel in the Gladiator also has excellent low-end torque, but seems to have over-heating issues when under significant load.
2- Stronger frame, axles, running gear (e.g. tie rod, track bar, drag link), and a stronger body with beefier good-sealing doors.
3- More comfortable seats (at least for most people)
4- Quieter on the highway
5- I think the QM has a better suspension, but the Rubicon and Mojave versions of the Gladiator are both pretty good
6- The QM has a fixed roof, which may or may not be regarded as an advantage. To me it is an advantage, as it is more secure, stiffer, quieter, and the roof is stronger (i.e. can bear a heavier load).
7- The 2.5:1 transfer case is much better for dune bashing than the 4:1 transfer case in the Gladiator

Gladiator advantages
1- The 4:1 transfer case is much better for rock-crawling than the 2.5:1 transfer case in the QM
2- The gear selector in the Gladiator is much better for off-road driving than the BMW shifter in the QM
3- Some people love the removable roof panels - that's a personal preference (I prefer a fixed roof)
4- Easier to modify: (a) there are - as yet - no aftermarket gears for the Carraro axles in the QM, but you can get a tone of different gears for the Dana axles in the Gladiator, (b) multiple different lockers for Dana axles, (c) there must be close to a hundred companies making suspension lifts for the Gladiator, (d) you can get aftermarket tie-rods, drag links, track bars, etc. for the Gladiator, and lastly, (e) the Gladiator is basically engineered with the expectation that an owner will want larger tires.
5- Stock tires on a Rubicon or Mojave are 33-inches (stock on the QM are 31.6 inches - if it is the same as the Grenadier)
6- Disconnecting front sway bar (though it can have issues if repeatedly submerged)
7- The lockers engage and disengage better
8- Heated steering wheel as an option
9- Larger image for backup camera, and the backup camera comes on whenever you put the truck in reverse. The Grenadier's backup camera does not come on when the vehicle is in "off-road mode" - I would guess the same will be true in the QM.
10- If you buy one soon, the Gladiator won't have ADAS (again, this is a personal preference, but I do not like ADAS - you might like it)

Conclusion: the QM has a better drive train and is built more stoutly. These are huge advantages over the Gladiator.

 

[Roadking01]

Will the Gladiator be required to have ADAS soon?

No, we are Americans

 

[Roadking01]

Jeep was started in 1941 and Land Rover using Jeep chassis and drivetrain was 1947.

 

[bikesandguitars]

I have an order for a QM in Colorado.

I love Jeeps. I owned a Mojave Gladiator that I enjoyed. I currently own an Eco-Diesel Willys that I’m modding - and I love. The Eco Diesel is the engine that truck should’ve had from the beginning. I’m very impressed with it.

It sounds like you wheel regularly. Obviously, the Jeep is going to have more options available for wheeling. But the QM is just cooler, for the time being.

Buy the QM. You can always go back to Jeep. There’s no guarantee that gas / diesel QM’s will be around for long. Thats my reasoning for paying $20K USD additional in tax in the states to own one. It will be a very rare bird.

 

[Swampy888]

Let's have a discussion on the Grenadier QM vs Gladiator.

I'm currently in the market for a new vehicle and located in the Middle East. Current ride is a Jeep Gladiator Rubicon and I love it though unfortunately I can't take it to my next destination.

Now, I can probably buy another Gladiator but the Ineos Grenadier QM looks to be an interesting alternative. However, I'm finding it bit of hard sell considering the price (the station wagon is ~20k usd more expensive vs comparable Jeep) as well as lack of features.

I know some people here insist that owning a Jeep is a headache not to mention unreliable but I own 2 Jeeps here (KL Cherokee Trailhawk and JT Rubicon) and both are doing great despite the sand and heat.

The Gladiator goes offroad almost every weekend during the cooler months and a few times during the summer. We're taking about dune bashing running up and down 100-200ft tall dunes while doing 80-100km desert crossing. So far at 40,000 km I had been nothing but reliable with only some problems below.

Out of dealership issues:
1. Defective 4WD actuator, my 4wd keeps on disengaging after a while. Fixed within 2 trips to the service center and has no issues since
2. Too flexible inner fender liner that gets torn easily. Replaced by the dealer with a better sturdier version

Self inflicted issues:
1. Front driveshaft going bust. I lifted the car 2.5" and fitted 35s with higher offset rims but didn't change the control arms causing stress to the drive shaft due to high angle and it went bust after almost 1 year. Changed the driveshaft and control arms and now it's going great

Preventive Maintenence
1. Changed the belt and pulleys after almost 40k kms when they start to sound weird as using it in desert environment would cause the bearing to wear down

And it's not just me, the JK and JL within my offroad group also had no major issues. So no Jeep is a headache and unreliable please.

Now back to the QM vs Gladiator. What would be the QM advantages over the Gladiator? I've tested driven the station wagon and my finding as follows:

1. I have no issues with the size (Gladiator is also a long vehicle).
2. Steering is a bit slow to return for the last quarter of turn but not a deal breaker
3. Steering is more firm feeling, thus enjoyable for highways. Then again I have no issues with the "loose" steering on my Gladiator since I'm used to it
4. Engine feels a bit rough, sounds rough and lack refinement. Overall NVH is probably the same though
5. The stamp size reverse camera view is a big letdown for a vehicle this price. My Jeep has both front and rear camera from factory and shows up full size on screen which helps a lot when maneuvering tight spaces or even offroad. It's the least you can expect for the price
6. Lack of any driver's assistance. I know MY24 cars are getting some but this should be an option even right now and much more. The Jeep has Adaptive Cruise Control (which I use from time to time), Blind Spot Monitor (super useful), AEB (standard on MY24 Grenadier supposedly), and Rear Cross Traffic Alert (RCTA) which I find to be the most useful thing ever on the Jeep as both people and drivers here don't really care that you're reversing, they would literally walk or drive behind you, kids on scooters included!
7. Rear seat space is quite limited and a bit awkward to get in and out. Lack of grab handles is quite an inconvenience (also no driver side grab handles)

On the plus side I do feel that the Grenadier is very sturdy and built like a tank. Not to mention it's new and has the cool factor. But the price and lack of features is a big let down. Yes this is supposed to be a car for purist and serious offroader but what better way to increase creature comfort (ie as simple as grab handles) and offer more safety options that it can be a multipurpose car for many people especially for such a high price.

So yeah I'm still looking for an "it" factor that can sway me to buy a Grenadier so please go ahead and fill me in

Heh Champ, hope you're well? I love the idea of sand dune driving, I've seen vids of you guys racing on these and it looks awesome. Stay safe out there.
I own a QM, I'm in Australia and before my QM I had the Gladiator. I loved my Gladiator, BUT . . . I love my QM even more. I bought the diesel engine and I'm loving it's power and torquey grunt. I feel significantly more confident in the QM and where I can take it then the Gladiator, and that's saying slot. Lastly, I love the fact I have more foot space in the QM. The only thing I disliked about the Gladiator was no space for my feet (RH Drive).
Enjoy whatever you decide to do, stay safe, have fun.
Swampy from Australia.