Grenadier Alternatives (Australia)

[emax]

woke ...

As @ADVAW8S has already written, this word comes from the black ethnic group.

Here's a true story from Germany:

Hanover. This caused a stir: the activists from Fridays for Future banned the appearance of the white artist Ronja Maltzahn with dreadlocks at their demo in Hanover. The band was therefore disinvited. Dreadlocks on white people are a sign of the oppression of black people, it was said. The band made a Fridays for Future message public on social media. “Dreadlocks on white people are a form of cultural appropriation,” it said, “since white people used it as a sign of oppression during the times of slavery.” The “Hannoversche Allgemeine Zeitung” initially reported.

Unbelievable. Stupid. And interesting. "Dreadlocks are a form of cultural appropriation." My understanding is they mean that white people have no right to wear Dreadlocks, since this is kind of stealing an ethnic attribute from the black people.

But what about 'woke'?

It is precisely these moralists who misuse this word for their self-portrayal - even though it comes from a different ethnic group and originally has a completely different meaning and context. They do nothing less than put themselves in the position of those really having been persecuted and threatened. What a vain mockery for the historically badly treated black people from whom this word comes.

They are those who live in prosperity and rise to nothing less than being the saviors of our planet. They have nothing to do with "woke", definitely not. They are, at best, disrespectful, self-absorbed lemmings.

This alone shows how stupid, lying and self-aggrandizing these "we-save-manhood" idiots are.

 

[Tazzieman]

Whenever some woke person mentions saving the planet to me I reply with "well to be honest I don't think the planet deserves to be saved".
It sort of terminates the conversation , which is quite handy.

 

[LC0013]

The discussion of "woke" belongs in the "Chuckle in your Day! (AKA the joke thread) thread as it is a pathetically laughable idea.

 

[klarie]

If you think this in and end to end matter no one but Scottish people should be permitted to wear kilt, - noone but of bavarian origin is allowed to wear dirndl / leather pants .. or on food. - Think of beers, pizza, coffee, etc.
The idea of wokism is by itself .. pretty fascist. To me this is entirely opposition of German Art 2 GG (Basic Law / "Constitutional") right to free development of personality If someone wears dreads so what . that is part of personality. .. If the person feel likes so..
Indeed a joke ..

 

[Max]

So what are the Grenadier Alternatives...I think we should all go to the pub and have a chat about them... I share the last para from Desiderata in which I find a release

And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should. Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be. And whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life, keep peace in your soul. With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be cheerful. Strive to be happy.


by Max Ehrmann ©1927

 

[DenisM]

So what are the Grenadier Alternatives...I think we should all go to the pub and have a chat about them... I share the last para from Desiderata in which I find a release

And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the off-beaten track is unfolding as it should. Therefore be at peace with your Genadier, whatever you conceive it to be. And whatever your labours and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of an over revving engine keep peace in your soul. With its indirect steering , fuel thirst and unstable software, it is still a beautiful machine. Be cheerful. Drive it and be happy.


with apologies to Max Ehrmann ©1927

small edit above

 

[DesertGecko]

Pricing for the LC 70 series update has been released. These prices are pre on roads, but none the less it was the ball park I had hoped Ineos were going to inhabit. I'll take a top of the line wagon for 80 +1500 for F&R diff locks. Should be OTR for 90. Extensive dealer network and a massive amount of aftermarket support.

https://www.carsauce.com/car-news/2...es-higher-pricing-and-specs-revealed-for-2024

2024 Toyota LandCruiser 70 Series Pricing and Specs Summary:​

Single-Cab (LC79) Pricing:

WorkMate:

• 2024 Price: $76,800 (4 Cyl) | $80,900 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,250 (4 Cyl) | +$10,350 (8 Cyl)

GX:

• 2024 Price: $78,800 (4 Cyl) | $82,900 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,250 (4 Cyl) | +$10,350 (8 Cyl)

GXL:

• 2024 Price: $80,900 (4 Cyl) | $85,000 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,250 (4 Cyl) | +$10,350 (8 Cyl)

Double-Cab (LC79) Pricing:

WorkMate:

• 2024 Price: $79,300 (4 Cyl) | $83,400 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,200 (4 Cyl) | +$10,300 (8 Cyl)

GXL:

• 2024 Price: $83,500 (4 Cyl) | $87,600 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,300 (4 Cyl) | +$10,400 (8 Cyl)

Troop Carrier (LC78) Pricing:

WorkMate:

• 2024 Price: $79,200 (4 Cyl) | $83,300 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,250 (4 Cyl) | +$10,350 (8 Cyl)

GXL:

• 2024 Price: $82,500 (4 Cyl) | $86,600 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,350 (4 Cyl) | +$10,450 (8 Cyl)

Wagon (LC76) Pricing:

WorkMate:

• 2024 Price: $75,600 (4 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,600

GXL:

• 2024 Price: $79,800 (4 Cyl) | $83,900 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,700 (4 Cyl) | +$10,800 (8 Cyl)

Additional Information:

• Engine Specs:
• 4 Cyl offers 150kW and 500Nm of torque.
• 8 Cyl 4.5-litre turbodiesel produces 151kW and 430Nm of torque.

Options:

• Premium paint: +$675
• Front and rear differential locks: +$1500

Note: All prices are in AUD and do not include on-road costs.

 

[James]

Pricing for the LC 70 series update has been released. These prices are pre on roads, but none the less it was the ball park I had hoped Ineos were going to inhabit. I'll take a top of the line wagon for 80 +1500 for F&R diff locks. Should be OTR for 90. Extensive dealer network and a massive amount of aftermarket support.

https://www.carsauce.com/car-news/2...es-higher-pricing-and-specs-revealed-for-2024

Good option of course, but given you already have a defender, with much better ride/articulation…
I‘ve always loved 70s, and defenders, but have not wanted to own the ride/handling in a 70. Great cars or campervans to use, hire and borrow. No question on that. If you’re not doing a grenadier for a few years, and want to change the defender, why not a tidy 100 or 200 series?
hope you love whatever you use, just thinking out loud.

 

[Solmanic]

Pricing for the LC 70 series update has been released. These prices are pre on roads, but none the less it was the ball park I had hoped Ineos were going to inhabit. I'll take a top of the line wagon for 80 +1500 for F&R diff locks. Should be OTR for 90. Extensive dealer network and a massive amount of aftermarket support.

https://www.carsauce.com/car-news/2...es-higher-pricing-and-specs-revealed-for-2024


Wagon (LC76) Pricing:

GXL:

• 2024 Price: $79,800 (4 Cyl) | $83,900 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,700 (4 Cyl) | +$10,800 (8 Cyl)

Additional Information:

• Engine Specs:
• 4 Cyl offers 150kW and 500Nm of torque.
• 8 Cyl 4.5-litre turbodiesel produces 151kW and 430Nm of torque.

Options:

• Premium paint: +$675
• Front and rear differential locks: +$1500

Note: All prices are in AUD and do not include on-road costs.

Well thought out and sensible but is it worth it considering you will spend every drive dying inside a little?

 

[DesertGecko]

Good option of course, but given you already have a defender, with much better ride/articulation…
I‘ve always loved 70s, and defenders, but have not wanted to own the ride/handling in a 70. Great cars or campervans to use, hire and borrow. No question on that. If you’re not doing a grenadier for a few years, and want to change the defender, why not a tidy 100 or 200 series?
hope you love whatever you use, just thinking out loud.

For the moment I'll just sit and watch I think. Lots of options compared to 135k for a Gren. No rush now. Good suggestion about a tidy 200. If I had a regret - when I bought the defender I looked at 80 series but I probably should have looked harder. Oh well.

 

[DaveB]

Pricing for the LC 70 series update has been released. These prices are pre on roads, but none the less it was the ball park I had hoped Ineos were going to inhabit. I'll take a top of the line wagon for 80 +1500 for F&R diff locks. Should be OTR for 90. Extensive dealer network and a massive amount of aftermarket support.

https://www.carsauce.com/car-news/2...es-higher-pricing-and-specs-revealed-for-2024

2024 Toyota LandCruiser 70 Series Pricing and Specs Summary:​

Single-Cab (LC79) Pricing:

WorkMate:

• 2024 Price: $76,800 (4 Cyl) | $80,900 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,250 (4 Cyl) | +$10,350 (8 Cyl)

GX:

• 2024 Price: $78,800 (4 Cyl) | $82,900 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,250 (4 Cyl) | +$10,350 (8 Cyl)

GXL:

• 2024 Price: $80,900 (4 Cyl) | $85,000 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,250 (4 Cyl) | +$10,350 (8 Cyl)

Double-Cab (LC79) Pricing:

WorkMate:

• 2024 Price: $79,300 (4 Cyl) | $83,400 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,200 (4 Cyl) | +$10,300 (8 Cyl)

GXL:

• 2024 Price: $83,500 (4 Cyl) | $87,600 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,300 (4 Cyl) | +$10,400 (8 Cyl)

Troop Carrier (LC78) Pricing:

WorkMate:

• 2024 Price: $79,200 (4 Cyl) | $83,300 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,250 (4 Cyl) | +$10,350 (8 Cyl)

GXL:

• 2024 Price: $82,500 (4 Cyl) | $86,600 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,350 (4 Cyl) | +$10,450 (8 Cyl)

Wagon (LC76) Pricing:

WorkMate:

• 2024 Price: $75,600 (4 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,600

GXL:

• 2024 Price: $79,800 (4 Cyl) | $83,900 (8 Cyl)
• Price Increase: +$6,700 (4 Cyl) | +$10,800 (8 Cyl)

Additional Information:

• Engine Specs:
• 4 Cyl offers 150kW and 500Nm of torque.
• 8 Cyl 4.5-litre turbodiesel produces 151kW and 430Nm of torque.

Options:

• Premium paint: +$675
• Front and rear differential locks: +$1500

Note: All prices are in AUD and do not include on-road costs.

Yes but then you have to add $30,000 of modifications to the 70 series to make it liveable.

 

[Tazzieman]

Grenadier goes like a rabbit and handles like a car - almost. Very comfortable and quiet.
But obviously that's part of the deal that ends up at the price point.
Toyotas will always be alternatives, and complimentary to what's also out there.
Apples vs oranges!

 

[DesertGecko]

Yes but then you have to add $30,000 of modifications to the 70 series to make it liveable.

Do I? Really? And It's probably more like 45k at these prices. And I reckon even if I got my new Grenadier I'd still end up sinking more into it on top of standard.

I guess it depends what you want. The main thing that I can think of that I'd need to add to the Toyota that the grenadier has would be a dual battery system and a roo bar. Plus the optional factory diff locks. I'd also need a cargo barrier, and UHF. I would think I'd get change out of 10k.

I mean if you really wanted to lay into the after market stuff you probably could get a 70 wagon close to a grenadier. Coil conversion etc.. But I mean
frankly the Grenadier needs a GVM increase too. It just hasn't been developed yet. I guess it depends what you class "need" and "want".

 

[TheDocAUS]

Do I? Really? And It's probably more like 45k at these prices. And I reckon even if I got my new Grenadier I'd still end up sinking more into it on top of standard.

Only you can work that out, but for me when I costed earlier this year it was more than 45K, more like 55K. The IG was a cheaper and better option for me. It is just better than a 70 Series Toyota.

Someone I was talking to at the Dealer said a Toyota 70 Series fitted out the way he wanted was 195K and the IG came in more than 30K cheaper.

 

[bigleonski]

Do I? Really? And It's probably more like 45k at these prices. And I reckon even if I got my new Grenadier I'd still end up sinking more into it on top of standard.

I guess it depends what you want. The main thing that I can think of that I'd need to add to the Toyota that the grenadier has would be a dual battery system and a roo bar. Plus the optional factory diff locks. I'd also need a cargo barrier, and UHF. I would think I'd get change out of 10k.

I mean if you really wanted to lay into the after market stuff you probably could get a 70 wagon close to a grenadier. Coil conversion etc.. But I mean
frankly the Grenadier needs a GVM increase too. It just hasn't been developed yet. I guess it depends what you class "need" and "want".

I think the $30k is for setting up the the dual cab more so than the wagon, and I reckon that's conservative by the time you put the canopy on and then upgrade the vehicle itself - more than $30k I reckon.
Ride is chalk and cheese though - something to consider. At $130-140k drive away the IG is very expensive. I reckon you'd set up a wagon for about $20-25k max, so $115k v $140k.

Would a troopy be a better option @DesertGecko ? Or a GX 300.

 

[Steve.B]

Do I? Really? And It's probably more like 45k at these prices. And I reckon even if I got my new Grenadier I'd still end up sinking more into it on top of standard.

I guess it depends what you want. The main thing that I can think of that I'd need to add to the Toyota that the grenadier has would be a dual battery system and a roo bar. Plus the optional factory diff locks. I'd also need a cargo barrier, and UHF. I would think I'd get change out of 10k.

I mean if you really wanted to lay into the after market stuff you probably could get a 70 wagon close to a grenadier. Coil conversion etc.. But I mean
frankly the Grenadier needs a GVM increase too. It just hasn't been developed yet. I guess it depends what you class "need" and "want".

70 series, power of a 4 cylinder, fuel consumption of V8 petrol, Hilux front diff centre, fragile manual gearbox that can't tow in overdrive vs bomb proof ZF, 44 to 1 first low vs 56 to 1 for Gren, narrow rear wheel track, low grround clearance (rear springs ) terrible stability, the list goes on basically a vintage car.

 

[TheDocAUS]

70 series, power of a 4 cylinder, fuel consumption of V8 petrol, Hilux front diff centre, fragile manual gearbox that can't tow in overdrive vs bomb proof ZF, 44 to 1 first low vs 56 to 1 for Gren, narrow rear wheel track, low grround clearance (rear springs ) terrible stability, the list goes on basically a vintage car.

You forgot the 70 Series has a different size front and rear axle, which come back to haunt you off road. Apparently the new 4 cylinder still does not even fix that.

 

[DaveB]

Do I? Really? And It's probably more like 45k at these prices. And I reckon even if I got my new Grenadier I'd still end up sinking more into it on top of standard.

I guess it depends what you want. The main thing that I can think of that I'd need to add to the Toyota that the grenadier has would be a dual battery system and a roo bar. Plus the optional factory diff locks. I'd also need a cargo barrier, and UHF. I would think I'd get change out of 10k.

I mean if you really wanted to lay into the after market stuff you probably could get a 70 wagon close to a grenadier. Coil conversion etc.. But I mean
frankly the Grenadier needs a GVM increase too. It just hasn't been developed yet. I guess it depends what you class "need" and "want".

I was thinking more

• soundproofing
• seats
• rear wheel track the same as front
• Power & torque
• suspension.

 

[DesertGecko]

Only you can work that out, but for me when I costed earlier this year it was more than 45K, more like 55K. The IG was a cheaper and better option for me. It is just better than a 70 Series Toyota.

Someone I was talking to at the Dealer said a Toyota 70 Series fitted out the way he wanted was 195K and the IG came in more than 30K cheaper.

If you want exactly what the grenadier offers then it's probably value.

Me - I just wanted a modern defender that was a bit more comfortable. Personally I can't justify spending that much money on a car I'm just going to wreck in the bush.

 

[DesertGecko]

70 series, power of a 4 cylinder, fuel consumption of V8 petrol, Hilux front diff centre, fragile manual gearbox that can't tow in overdrive vs bomb proof ZF, 44 to 1 first low vs 56 to 1 for Gren, narrow rear wheel track, low grround clearance (rear springs ) terrible stability, the list goes on basically a vintage car.

It's going to be some time until we find out what the weak points of the Grenadier are. You might know what the issues are with the Toyota - but the Grenadier is as yet a known unknown. I hope their aren't any but I consider it unlikely that there won't be some issues.

The last trip I did was a big group. The most popular single type of car was the 70 series. There may be issues but people are managing ok with them.