Is a Grenadier right for you and my journey

lightning said:

l think it's great that both options are available.


Defender, a road optimised vehicle
that's competent off road
Grenadier, an off road optimised vehicle that's still competent enough on road.

Choose depending on your particular needs.

Click to expand...

There's another option.

Mercedes Unimog.
Indestructible off road. On road is something of a compromise.

I wouldn' consider the Unimog as the right vehicle for journeys and long time travelling.

It is very, very loud, it has too less negative suspension travel for driving tracks at an acceptable speed. You can change that and you need to change the differential gear ratio, as well, to reach an acceptable onroad speed. All at high costs.

Taking into account that really tough offroad driving is done by only a few people who also travel with their vehicles (while travelling), there are far more better suited trucks for that purpose. And believe me, also an Unimog can easily get stuck. There were people who crossed deserts in a BMW E24 635 and Unimog drivers who got stuck. It is more an issue of the driver, not the vehicle. And if you get stuck with a heavy vehicle you need another heavy vehicle to get it out again. It's all about weight and the possibilities to support that weight on the ground.



My impression is that we guys are fascinated by that vehicle, want to own and drive it, but to not take into account, that it was developed as a working horse which can cross tough terrain, but not as a offroad-camper. We're still kids, just our toys get larger....

Last weekend at the very rainy Abenteuer&Allrad fair in Bad Kissingen, Germany, two Unimogs tried to recover a truck from the camp ground meadow. Only the one with the tractor tires managed it. Even an 8x8 MAN KAT was stuck. No, not stuck, wrong term, it was immobilized. All 8 wheels were spinning but the truck didn't move. The tires made the difference, but who wants to travel with tractor tires? And it seems that the stuck people also rejected to deflate their tires.

I consider our Iveco 90-16 as one example for a very good vehicle to travel with, if you're looking for such size of a vehicle. It has a limited height as an emergency vehicle which must be able to drive under low bridges, as well. It has 4x4 and a center and rear diff lock. It has a straight 6 liter 6 cylinder turbo diesel engine, air cooled, running very smoth, quite and with a high comfort. and even the cabin is suited for long drives. A friend of mine bought one and we had a long chat about these kind of vehicles and his arguments got me, so we got one, as well.



AWo

Nice overlander. Whilst in agreement, who wouldn't want one of these?

As AWo says that’s a bone shaker worse than my wife’s 88

According to my experience with the very stiff leaf springs of my 109" Series 2a I was afraid about the same uncomfortable ride with the 101 FWC. But the 101 got parabolic springs and it really rides like a MB S-Class on leaf springs.... (ohhhkkkaaaaayyyyyy...if you ignore the heat, the petrol smell, the noise and a few minor things more...).

I do not understand why the Isuzu D-MAX or our new Hilux don't use parabolic springs, as well, as many van's do today.

AWo

We put parabolics on our 88 night and day

Still concidering buying one. I will only get one with the rough pack and rear trailer hitch. If I get one it will be used as intended and I won't concern myself with window tint, aftermarket wheels, larger tires, molle's, etc. I won't be trying to impress anyone, just using it to explore solo mostly. I've owned a few 4x4's in my day and my favorite to date was 97 Disco with Defender transfer case, 4.10 gears, ARB lockers, Old Man Emu suspension and 235/85r16 tires. Loved it, but it was stolen approx 10 years ago. Had a couple Jeeps since, but long for a purpose built 4x4 like a Grenadier. Only thing holding me back is I'm about to turn 75, so let's get real, if I can get 10 more good driving years in I'll be happy.

Winterhawk said:

Still concidering buying one. I will only get one with the rough pack and rear trailer hitch. If I get one it will be used as intended and I won't concern myself with window tint, aftermarket wheels, larger tires, molle's, etc. I won't be trying to impress anyone, just using it to explore solo mostly. I've owned a few 4x4's in my day and my favorite to date was 97 Disco with Defender transfer case, 4.10 gears, ARB lockers, Old Man Emu suspension and 235/85r16 tires. Loved it, but it was stolen approx 10 years ago. Had a couple Jeeps since, but long for a purpose built 4x4 like a Grenadier. Only thing holding me back is I'm about to turn 75, so let's get real, if I can get 10 more good driving years in I'll be happy.

Click to expand...

More reason to get one sooner than later!

Winterhawk said:

Still concidering buying one. I will only get one with the rough pack and rear trailer hitch. If I get one it will be used as intended and I won't concern myself with window tint, aftermarket wheels, larger tires, molle's, etc. I won't be trying to impress anyone, just using it to explore solo mostly. I've owned a few 4x4's in my day and my favorite to date was 97 Disco with Defender transfer case, 4.10 gears, ARB lockers, Old Man Emu suspension and 235/85r16 tires. Loved it, but it was stolen approx 10 years ago. Had a couple Jeeps since, but long for a purpose built 4x4 like a Grenadier. Only thing holding me back is I'm about to turn 75, so let's get real, if I can get 10 more good driving years in I'll be happy.

Click to expand...

You have probably already had many experiences in your life. You should also experience the Grenadier.

Winterhawk said:

Still concidering buying one. I will only get one with the rough pack and rear trailer hitch. If I get one it will be used as intended and I won't concern myself with window tint, aftermarket wheels, larger tires, molle's, etc. I won't be trying to impress anyone, just using it to explore solo mostly. I've owned a few 4x4's in my day and my favorite to date was 97 Disco with Defender transfer case, 4.10 gears, ARB lockers, Old Man Emu suspension and 235/85r16 tires. Loved it, but it was stolen approx 10 years ago. Had a couple Jeeps since, but long for a purpose built 4x4 like a Grenadier. Only thing holding me back is I'm about to turn 75, so let's get real, if I can get 10 more good driving years in I'll be happy.

Click to expand...

I'm 74 in a few weeks, already decided mine will see my driving days out. ( UK Grenadier has 5 year warranty as well). Make the commitment you won't regret it.

DO IT!

lightning said:

Vehicles such as New Defender are designed for a particular market and not niche markets such as yours.

Land Rover will say that the New Defender has been a complete success and for the market it's designed for, it has.

The Grenadier is a half way house between what you want and the new Defender. lt should be more long lasting (than a New Defender) but it still has over 40 microprocessors and a BMW engine full of sensors and electronics.

For someone like yourself l would be looking at commercial products designed for farmers, which are more geared to a hard life off road.

95% of New Defenders will never go off road, so most owners don't really care that it's not like the old Power Wagon. What they want is a vehicle that makes them think they are adventurous.

And don't forget l am saying this as an owner of one.

Click to expand...

You missed a 9 and a dot (.) - 99.5% of New Defender owners will not take their vehicle off road. One look at my region of the world says this is true.

lightning said:

l think it's great that both options are available.


Defender, a road optimised vehicle
that's competent off road
Grenadier, an off road optimised vehicle that's still competent enough on road.

Choose depending on your particular needs.

Click to expand...

Defender, sadly, is OVERWHELMINGLY more comfortable to drive compared to the GREN in all aspects of driving use. I have driven both, there is no comparison. About the only thing the New D has over the Gren in my impartially biased view!!!

A street car will always handle better then an off road vehicle, as well an IFS vehicle over a solid axle. This plays a part of the street cars being destroyed and stranded off road crisis that finally made the Park Service create 5,000.00 fines for driving a street car on trails. Who would have imagine 20 years ago having to tell people trashing AWD street cars off road is a bad idea? You can have a cushy, more fuel efficient commuter car or you can have a comfortable off road vehicle. But both you cannot have in 1 vehicle.

landmannnn said:

Nice overlander. Whilst in agreement, who wouldn't want one of these?
View attachment 7859055

Click to expand...

Here is the thing. Those monsters are impractical in the US. Do we have places they can go in the desert? Sure. But with so many skinny, tippy, rocky, mountain trails trails there are just too many places you cannot take it. I really think its Africa or Australia for these beasts. I spoke with a couple in an Iveco from Europe recently in Silverton, and they essentially could not do any trails up there. Size does matter, and with size comes restrictions and a lot of mass to get un stuck. I have found even an off road camper to be generally impractical. Very few trails I would take mine on, like say the Mojave Road.

trobex said:

You missed a 9 and a dot (.) - 99.5% of New Defender owners will not take their vehicle off road. One look at my region of the world says this is true.

Click to expand...

Actually more new Defenders than you might think, are taken properly off road or used for Overlanding. Although its probably still only a few % of the total sold.

lr says a lot about LR's marketing though, that the default off-road 18" steel wheels aren't even available in the USA. A country with many opportunities to go off road.

Andiamo said:

I’m fairly positive the auto down is on all the windows. The biggest test for reliability with regards to the interior is letting my 6 year old ride in the back. All the buttons get toggled repeatedly within 30 seconds of him entering the car. His comment the other day was the back window switch was broken because it would go down with one push but he had to hold it to get it to go back up.

True story - I had someone ask what kind of dog we had. They assumed by all of the window smudges on the rear window that we’d picked up another doberman…

Click to expand...

Wait till you put him in an airplane. Kids have been known to twist a lot of knobs and buttons, even a fuel a fuel switch.