Incoming: The Review To Define All Reviews - Jeremy Clarkson

James · Jul 17, 2023

DCPU said:
Just to qualify the seat statement - it does rather depend on having the front seats far enough forward to allow. Clarkson's quite a big chap, so it's possible it wasn't possible for him to do it and maintain enough room to get in the front:
View attachment 7820263

it is surprising they havent put clips instead of screws holding the pivoting seat base onto its front edge frame. These could allow the bases to be removed from the car (pivot up and then pull off) which would really help seat back levelling, as well as length of load. I plan to do this by removing I think 4 sets of 4 screws, but hope I can use something else, wingnuts, whatever in the long term to make this faster. It should also allow an 1800mm sleeping space, just, with the front seats fully forward and upright.

DCPU · Jul 17, 2023

James said:
it is surprising they havent put clips instead of screws holding the pivoting seat base onto its front edge frame. These could allow the bases to be removed from the car (pivot up and then pull off) which would really help seat back levelling, as well as length of load. I plan to do this by removing I think 4 sets of 4 screws, but hope I can use something else, wingnuts, whatever in the long term to make this faster. It should also allow an 1800mm sleeping space, just, with the front seats fully forward and upright.

Yes, I must admit I've briefly looked at the underseat mountings and wondered what it would take to make them easier to take out and put in:

Two immediate thoughts were whether something like this could be used:

Or an internal tube locked in place each end, with cutouts in the external tube for the clamps to pass through/align with as the internal tube is pushed through.

Wayneos · Jul 17, 2023

DCPU said:
Yes, I must admit I've briefly looked at the underseat mountings and wondered what it would take to make them easier to take out and put in:
View attachment 7820269

Two immediate thoughts were whether something like this could be used:

If those screws go into metal within the seat base, then you should be able to remove them as often as you like, but if they're screwing into plastic, you will only be able to do that so often before the holes strip out.

Has someone removed that seat base yet? What do the screws go into, plastic or metal?

James · Jul 17, 2023

DCPU said:
Yes, I must admit I've briefly looked at the underseat mountings and wondered what it would take to make them easier to take out and put in:
View attachment 7820269

Im thinking along the same lines. Your photo shows that the fastening has evolved since the last prototype ive seen, but…

ive owned a few cars where, effectively those plastic brackets were cut, so that the seat base is not held in place unless in it’s ‘normal’ position, where it cannot move backwards. Effectively in your photo the part that is not visible is cut off. When pivoted up, the seat base simply lifts off with a small tug.
assuming these plastic brackets can be replaced at low cost, i’ll consider trying that minor butchery, if it looks like the seat base is strongly located when in use. It might benefit from a couple more screws too.
Like wayneos said, threads into plastic dont like repeated use.

DCPU said:
.

PBD · Jul 17, 2023

DCPU said:
Yes, I must admit I've briefly looked at the underseat mountings and wondered what it would take to make them easier to take out and put in:
View attachment 7820269

Two immediate thoughts were whether something like this could be used:
View attachment 7820270

Or an internal tube locked in place each end, with cutouts in the external tube for the clamps to pass through/align with as the internal tube is pushed through.

My longterm plan is to remove the seats on my Trialmaster entirely. just waiting for an aftermarket “platform” to be available. Also not sure what to do with the seatbelts, had enough trouble with them and the alarms already

DCPU · Jul 17, 2023

PBD said:
My longterm plan is to remove the seats on my Trialmaster entirely. just waiting for an aftermarket “platform” to be available.

I haven't looked too closely but it did occur to me that removing the bolts in the yellow rectangles may allow the seats and tubular framework to be removed, whilst leaving in place the stanchions with excellent (M10?) mounting points for simple right angle brackets. A simple rectangle of plywood, ali sheet or high density plastic would give a good platform?

PBD said:
Also not sure what to do with the seatbelts, had enough trouble with them and the alarms already

I don't get (understand) these rear seatbelt alarms. From reading the manual, I thought they only go into alarm mode when being unfastened whilst the vehicle is moving. Mine are never fastened but still alarm.

I've now unplugged the circuit on one (necessary to remove the top trim section), so it will be interesting to see what alarms I get on my next startup...

LC0013 · Jul 17, 2023

DCPU said:
There's always been "plenty" of cash flowing into the business from the contract work of building Smarts and assemblies for MB.

Got a cash flow statement you can share....

YellowLab · Jul 17, 2023

Getting back to the topic - the article from Jeremy is not a surprise as these are all issues yet to be addressed by IG. My two cents (about all its worth) if IG does not address these issues in production it will turn into the shortest life span of an auto maker.

I want IG to succeed - they have a huge emotional hook into me for what this vehicle represents. Reviewers like Jeremy (some 10M followers) are going to take the glow off the G very fast unless Ineos says something or anything at this point about what their efforts are to address and prevent future delivery issues. I hope Jeremy's review and the breadth he has encourages Ineos to make this right...

Ideally they should suspend all deliveries due software issues, missing accessories etc otherwise they are merely pushing production issues downward to a dealer network that is just starting to come together. I think people will accept yet another delay rather than have a vehicle delivered to them they cannot trust driving in remote areas. If they get in front of that now it helps drive brand loyalty. To keep delivering vehicles with issues and flaws will only damage the brand and potentially force many on this board to reluctantly go another direction.

2wheelfish · Jul 17, 2023

But there’s still a 7-inch lip between those “flat” seats and the load space floor behind it. I think what he was getting at was having the entire back at one flat level. My Disco 3 has this and will be something hard to part with if I opt for the Gren.

grenadierguy · Jul 17, 2023

Tom109 said:
I loved TG with JC, RH & JM, and also loved the British Junkyard Wars. American versions were really bad.

Junkyard Wars! Had forgotten about that.

holdmybeer · Jul 17, 2023

Anyone got a non-paywalled link to the Clarkson review? (archive.org doesn't help this time)

Cheshire cat · Jul 17, 2023

holdmybeer said:
Anyone got a non-paywalled link to the Clarkson review? (archive.org doesn't help this time)

Refer to post 42 on this thread

YellowLab · Jul 17, 2023

holdmybeer said:
Anyone got a non-paywalled link to the Clarkson review? (archive.org doesn't help this time)

You can see it a couple pages back on this thread

holdmybeer · Jul 17, 2023

Cheshire cat said:
Refer to post 42 on this thread

Thanks! Ha, read it. I expected truth wrapped in wit. Was not disappointed!

Loc Nar · Jul 18, 2023

YellowLab said:
Getting back to the topic - the article from Jeremy is not a surprise as these are all issues yet to be addressed by IG. My two cents (about all its worth) if IG does not address these issues in production it will turn into the shortest life span of an auto maker.

I want IG to succeed - they have a huge emotional hook into me for what this vehicle represents. Reviewers like Jeremy (some 10M followers) are going to take the glow off the G very fast unless Ineos says something or anything at this point about what their efforts are to address and prevent future delivery issues. I hope Jeremy's review and the breadth he has encourages Ineos to make this right...

Ideally they should suspend all deliveries due software issues, missing accessories etc otherwise they are merely pushing production issues downward to a dealer network that is just starting to come together. I think people will accept yet another delay rather than have a vehicle delivered to them they cannot trust driving in remote areas. If they get in front of that now it helps drive brand loyalty. To keep delivering vehicles with issues and flaws will only damage the brand and potentially force many on this board to reluctantly go another direction.

Right on, YellowLab. It's wonderful to share all the progress with the prototypes, but it's downright Hubris to put one in the hands of a professional reviewer - not that the result would have mattered much if Jeremy received a first run production model. When he went to turn right out of his driveway, he might not even have been able to continue the turn back into it! I would be totally fine if Ineos told us in North America - hold on, we've got to work on some things - you can expect your delivery in Spring 2024 - measure twice, cut once - we want you to be confident and ready to drive straight off the lot onto a trail. I have zero confidence in being able to do that right now, which is the antithesis of the marketing campaign. Makes me start checking out used Land Cruisers on AutoTrader and calculating how far I could go all in with mods for $85,000.

YellowLab · Jul 18, 2023

Loc Nar said:
Right on, YellowLab. It's wonderful to share all the progress with the prototypes, but it's downright Hubris to put one in the hands of a professional reviewer - not that the result would have mattered much if Jeremy received a first run production model. When he went to turn right out of his driveway, he might not even have been able to continue the turn back into it! I would be totally fine if Ineos told us in North America - hold on, we've got to work on some things - you can expect your delivery in Spring 2024 - measure twice, cut once - we want you to be confident and ready to drive straight off the lot onto a trail. I have zero confidence in being able to do that right now, which is the antithesis of the marketing campaign. Makes me start checking out used Land Cruisers on AutoTrader and calculating how far I could go all in with mods for $85,000.

Yep - and also look at the Lexus and Land Cruiser variants in 2024. LC is coming back to the states

Loc Nar · Jul 18, 2023

YellowLab said:
Yep - and also look at the Lexus and Land Cruiser variants in 2024. LC is coming back to the states

Not Penny's boat! Kidding - not really a Land Cruiser!

evomind · Jul 18, 2023

Trialmaster said:
He did hit the producer, after being told all the hotel could give him was a salad after being out all day in very cold, wet Yorkshire weather filming something rather stupid for Top Gear.

Personally, I like him, he tends to say what he thinks, which I think is a positive in this strange woke world we are all in today.

I have worked long hard days myself, and not in the entertainment business and certainly not for his paycheck.
I have never hit anybody because I didnt get the meal I was expecting.
Im not a peace freak, I have hit people before but it was always over something bigger than disappointment over a meal.

I do like some of his reviews, and yes, he will point out good and bad, but I always take what he says with a grain of salt, like when he is gushing over all things British or when his review is too much of a comedy skit.

Edit....With his salary he cant have a steak delivered to him on his dime? Or even insist the show pays for it?
He starts throwing punches?
With his fairy tale life what in the world can get him that worked up?

Tazzieman · Jul 18, 2023

evomind said:
With his fairy tale life what in the world can get him that worked up?

Impulsive violence disorder. It's widespread.

DCPU · Jul 18, 2023

LC0013 said:
Got a cash flow statement you can share....

Best I can do:

HAMBACH PLANT IS ‘GRENADIER READY’ AS INEOS AUTOMOTIVE COMPLETES TRANSITION TO FULLY OPERATIONAL OEM

EMBARGOED UNTIL 00:01 GMT ON 16 FEBRUARY 2022HAMBACH PLANT IS ‘GRENADIER READY’ AS INEOS AUTOMOTIVE COMPLETES TRANSITION TO FULLY OPERATIONAL OEM The first production try-out Grenadiers are rolling off the line at INEOS Automotive’s state-of-the-art Hambach plant in preparation for launch series...

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Incoming: The Review To Define All Reviews - Jeremy Clarkson

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HAMBACH PLANT IS ‘GRENADIER READY’ AS INEOS AUTOMOTIVE COMPLETES TRANSITION TO FULLY OPERATIONAL OEM

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