Hi guys all over the world! What a great 4x4, after the sad demise of the LR Defender!

[Defenderlover]

My son has just ordered the Grenadier Pick Up. He needs it for his work in the demolition of buildings. To me the Grenadier is a great concept. In the world of lots of Schicki Micki 4x4, wich can go very fast and have lots of unnecessary gadgets, the Grenadier is a 4x4 i would like to have!
My main obstacle is: I have the most beautiful 4x4 in excellent condition in my garage: LR Defender MY 2015.
I use it only for travelling where you need 4x4: 4 weeks in Iceland, 2x 9 months in southern Afrika and may be 5 months again in southern Afrika next year. Up to now 89000km.
To go on Safari with a Defender(Keswick Green, white roof) is unbeatable. Last time 12/20-8/21 we spent 5,5 months in Namibia 3,5 months in South Afrika, driving alone in the Kaokofeld difficult routes, we never got stuck. 9 beautiful months without all the tourists because of Corona!
I do the maintenance myself. I took the seats in the back out, put a mattress 140x190x12cm on board, underneath 6 small and 2 big euroboxes to stow away. For Afrika I put a sturdy roof tent from Maggiolina on the roof rack. In Iceland my wife and I were sleeping in the car. In Afrika my wife was sleeping in the roof tent and I was sleeping in the car. The fridge was standing on the mattress. To reach the stuff in front of the roof tent on the roof rack, I put riffle plates on the fenders and the bonnet. Many times I was cooking on the fender and afterwards we sat both eating on the fenders.
Many times at gas stations Black People were coming: what a beautiful car or what a strong car. An old white man was leaving his new Toyota Land Cruiser V8in Sabie/Northern Drakenberge: Is it your car? What a beautiful car. In former days I had 3 of them.
People love the Defender but they drive now Toyotas, because they don`t need so much maintenance.
May be, I will buy the Grenadier, because of the better quality. But not now! I am sorry to say: Never buy a brand new car, unless you want to be a test driver. Every new car needs 2-3 years to eliminate most of the unavoidable problems that comes always with a new car!
Here comes a question: Is the booth of the Grenadier from the hatch door to the front seats and from side to side long ,wide and high enough to put a mattress 190x140x12cm in it and sit on top of the mattress without hitting the roof with the head? I couldn`t find any drawings or measures in the brochures.

Many thanks in advance for your help! I wish you all much joy with the formidable Grenadier! Hans

PS: Up to now I never got stuck with my Defender. I have no winch, no riffle plates. My Defender has only the central differential lock and only 122 hp. Before you drive anywhere use your brains not your engine power!

 

[Gibby]

I hope this is helpful. After owning an IG, you may not want to go back.

 

[Krabby]

Also note that the N1 and M1 have different measurements with the seats up.

 

[Defenderlover]

I hope this is helpful. After owning an IG, you may not want to go back.

Thank you very much! The sheet of the load space is indeed very helpful. Why can`t you find the data, when you are configuring the IG? Honestly said, I have much more space in my Defender. When I`m sitting on the mattress, I still have 5 cm from my head to the roof. In the foot well of the rear seats I have two big/high boxes for storage. Under my mattress, there is space for 6 18 cm high euroboxes. The Defender is much more practical! The quality of the IG is much better! But for travelling you need more space in the car. The plastic wall panels, the underconstruction of the front seats are wasting much space. May be it can be changed in the future? And the 2l, 4-cylinder Diesel engine from BMW would be strong enough to save weight, fuel and money.
Don`t get me wrong: The IG is the best 4x4 at the moment, excellent quality, reliable for every day use( the problems with every new car will be solved soon)!
But for my purposes, traveling many months in remote areas, living/sleeping in/on the car, my Defender is much more suitable and affordable( it was less than 35000 Euro with extras in 2015) and driving such a vintage car is an unbeatable feeling!

I will follow the development of the IG with much sympathy!

I wish You much fun with your IGs Hans!

 

[Tazzieman]

But for my purposes, traveling many months in remote areas, living/sleeping in/on the car,

Do you enjoy a sleeping partner or are you a lone wolf?

 

[emax]

Thank you very much! The sheet of the load space is indeed very helpful. Why can`t you find the data, when you are configuring the IG? Honestly said, I have much more space in my Defender. When I`m sitting on the mattress, I still have 5 cm from my head to the roof. In the foot well of the rear seats I have two big/high boxes for storage. Under my mattress, there is space for 6 18 cm high euroboxes. The Defender is much more practical! The quality of the IG is much better! But for travelling you need more space in the car. The plastic wall panels, the underconstruction of the front seats are wasting much space. May be it can be changed in the future? And the 2l, 4-cylinder Diesel engine from BMW would be strong enough to save weight, fuel and money.
Don`t get me wrong: The IG is the best 4x4 at the moment, excellent quality, reliable for every day use( the problems with every new car will be solved soon)!
But for my purposes, traveling many months in remote areas, living/sleeping in/on the car, my Defender is much more suitable and affordable( it was less than 35000 Euro with extras in 2015) and driving such a vintage car is an unbeatable feeling!

I will follow the development of the IG with much sympathy!

I wish You much fun with your IGs Hans!

If have just measured the length of the cargo space from the rear door to the front seats.

The result depends very much on what you accept as realistic organization. If I measure (it is a 5-seater utility) from behind the driver seat to the rear door I get 177 cm. But I can move the driver seat forward a bit and can as well tilt the backrest somewhat forward. In that case, I get 190 cm.

However, @190 cm the best solution would be to remove the rear seats completely. In that case it should be possible to get to a flat area which is not as high as it would be with the seats still in the car. Otherwise the rear seats and backrests are in the way in that they raise the minimum level for a flat platform a lot.

I haven't checked the headroom if sitting in the cargo space. But as there is (for me, 1,70m) enough headroom if sitting on the rear seat there should as well be enough without the seats but instead having a mattress.

 

[Defenderlover]

Do you enjoy a sleeping partner or are you a lone wolf?

Hi Tazzieman, travelling many months alone would be boring. My wife and I are exploring the world with different cars: 2010/11 1 year mit our VW T3 turbodiesel with pop off roof in North- a. Central-Amerika,56000km, 2015 4 weeks in Iceland with our brand new LR Defender, 9000km, 2016/17 1 year with our Ford Transit Nugget with high roof in North- a. Central-Amerika, again 56000km, 2018/19 9 months with our Defender in Southern Afrika( South Afrika up to Kenia and back to South Afrika, 38000km, 2020/21 9 months again with our Defender in South Afrika and Namibia, 29000km and this year 4 months with our Ford Transit Nugget in Italy( West Coast, Sardinia a. Sicily),8000km.

In Iceland we were sleeping together in our Defender, the mattress is 190x140x12cm, in Afrika my wife slept alone in the rooftent, 140x200cm, I was sleeping downstairs in the Defender. It`s better that way, because I love to read in the evening, she likes to sleep! Together we go hiking, trail running 3 times a week. We want to see the beautiful Nature in all countries, where we are travelling. not the big cities. We know the National Parks in North Amerika better, than most people, who are living there.

Enjoy your life! We still have many beautiful parts in the world.
Greetings from Hans!

If have just measured the length of the cargo space from the rear door to the front seats.

The result depends very much on what you accept as realistic organization. If I measure (it is a 5-seater utility) from behind the driver seat to the rear door I get 177 cm. But I can move the driver seat forward a bit and can as well tilt the backrest somewhat forward. In that case, I get 190 cm.

However, @190 cm the best solution would be to remove the rear seats completely. In that case it should be possible to get to a flat area which is not as high as it would be with the seats still in the car. Otherwise the rear seats and backrests are in the way in that they raise the minimum level for a flat platform a lot.

I haven't checked the headroom if sitting in the cargo space. But as there is (for me, 1,70m) enough headroom if sitting on the rear seat there should as well be enough without the seats but instead having a mattress.

 

[Defenderlover]

If have just measured the length of the cargo space from the rear door to the front seats.

The result depends very much on what you accept as realistic organization. If I measure (it is a 5-seater utility) from behind the driver seat to the rear door I get 177 cm. But I can move the driver seat forward a bit and can as well tilt the backrest somewhat forward. In that case, I get 190 cm.

However, @190 cm the best solution would be to remove the rear seats completely. In that case it should be possible to get to a flat area which is not as high as it would be with the seats still in the car. Otherwise the rear seats and backrests are in the way in that they raise the minimum level for a flat platform a lot.

I haven't checked the headroom if sitting in the cargo space. But as there is (for me, 1,70m) enough headroom if sitting on the rear seat there should as well be enough without the seats but instead having a mattress.

Hi emax, thank you very much for your help! That`s what I need. The real length from the back door to the back of the front seats! You did a great job! But what about the real width, lets say 20 to 22 centimeters above the flat bottom? The length would be ideal for a mattress. I would like to put a mattress 190x140x10-12cm in it. It`s not important that the width is always 140. Some parts could be 130/135 or bigger than 140cm. If you take a soft mattress, it will fit. If you push the front seats back, let`s say 5-10 centimetres, that`s no problem.

I would like to do the same construction in the Grenadier like I did in my Defender: First I took all of the back seats out.Than I put a sturdy board of 20mm at a height of 20 cm in the space behind the front seats. On top of the board I put the mattress 190x140x12cm. Under the board would be enough space in the Grenadier for 4-6 euroboxes, 18cm high. Sitting on the mattress should be possible, without hitting the roof with your head. Could You give me the measure of the width about 20-25 cm and 30cm above the ground? This would be great.

Why don`t the guys from Ineos deliver all these important data??? Other car makers give you all the important data( Height from seat to ceiling, front a. back seats, length, width a. height of the cargo space a. so on!
Have a nice day! Hans

 

[bikesandguitars]

I have to ask for a definition of “schicki micki”, please? Thats a new one for me.

 

[Defenderlover]

I have to ask for a definition of “schicki micki”, please? Thats a new one for me.

Hello, I think in English you say nick knacks. Schicki Micki means all the unnecessary parts in and on a vehicle with much bling bling, just to try to impress other people. Style goes over function! In the Grenadier I would like to see the screws of the panels if I want to take them off, not to pull at an edge and hoping, it will not breake. but it doesn`t look so fancy! The shape of the BMW gear lever looks more like sex toy than a useable gear lever, but looks more fancy. All the shiny surfaces, the chrome, the overstyled seats from Recaro( normally they look more like real bucket seats, less weight, the backside not like in the Grenadier). The Grenadier was officially built as hard core, sturdy and very reliable 4x4 truck, work horse! Sadly I don`t see much of a workhorse in the Grenadier, out- and underside yes!
If I compare it to my beautiful old LR Defender SW 110, MY 15, I would like much more of it`s simplicity in the grenadier, but I know that`s wishful thinking! Most people love this bling bling. Ineos couldn`t sell enough cars without the unnecessary knick knacks!

I know, my thinking is out of this time. I love to drive my cars till I can`t repair them anymore. I don`t like this dammed fashion. I liked to wear the same practical uniform/dress in the army every day! I love to wear my Levis jeans 501 till I die( I bought 10 in an outlet in Florida, when we were travelling North-and Central America last time 1 year in 2016/17).

Greetings Hans!

 

[AWo]

Then we are two out of time...

AWo

 

[stickshifter]

Why don`t the guys from Ineos deliver all these important data??? Other car makers give you all the important data( Height from seat to ceiling, front a. back seats, length, width a. height of the cargo space a. so on!
Have a nice day! Hans

Hi Hans,
The internal measurements were published by Ineos in one of their brochures. I don't remember where, but I took a screenshot:

Like you - I'd like a longer wheelbase wagon with a flat floor and at least six feet of space behind the front seats. All the best!

 

[Defenderlover]

Hi Hans,
The internal measurements were published by Ineos in one of their brochures. I don't remember where, but I took a screenshot:

View attachment 7842332
Like you - I'd like a longer wheelbase wagon with a flat floor and at least six feet of space behind the front seats. All the best!

Hi Stickshifter, thank you for your replay and for the picture!
I was searching the forum, the internet, the brochures, but I couldn`t find the data.
These are very important data and have to be in the brochure of Ineos! You need the data before you start ordering the Grenadier!

One big problem of the Grenadier is: It is 2oo cm wide, 205 cm high and ca.485 cm long. Compared to my Defender, wich is 178cm wide, ca. 480 cm long and ca. 204cm high, the Grenadier is inside, especially in the back and the boot much smaller than the Defender!!!!
In my defender: I put a mattress 190x140x12cm in the back , under the mattress is space for 6 60x40x20 boxes and in the footwell of the rear passengers, there is enough room for 2 big 60x40x40 boxes! I can sit on the mattress without hitting the roof and I have a big upper body!

Most buyers, who want to use the Grenadier like the Defender as an overlander or for work, will be disappointed! The engineers of the Grenadier have wasted too much room for the side walls and the doors! This could have been done better. I know, some of the waste is for safety reasons.

 

[stickshifter]

Hi Stickshifter, thank you for your replay and for the picture!
....
Most buyers, who want to use the Grenadier like the Defender as an overlander or for work, will be disappointed! The engineers of the Grenadier have wasted too much room for the side walls and the doors! This could have been done better. I know, some of the waste is for safety reasons.

Yes, the extra bulk in the body - which takes away some internal cargo space - is for increased safety and strength, but it will also reduce noise, resulting in a quieter and - for many - more relaxing experience on long drives. The old Defenders did a better job maximizing internal space, but at the cost of both safety and noise & vibration. If you are happy with your current Defender, maybe you should wait to see if Ineos builds a long wheelbase wagon. They did talk about it once, but that talk seems to have disappeared...

 

[lightning]

Hi Tazzieman, travelling many months alone would be boring. My wife and I are exploring the world with different cars: 2010/11 1 year mit our VW T3 turbodiesel with pop off roof in North- a. Central-Amerika,56000km, 2015 4 weeks in Iceland with our brand new LR Defender, 9000km, 2016/17 1 year with our Ford Transit Nugget with high roof in North- a. Central-Amerika, again 56000km, 2018/19 9 months with our Defender in Southern Afrika( South Afrika up to Kenia and back to South Afrika, 38000km, 2020/21 9 months again with our Defender in South Afrika and Namibia, 29000km and this year 4 months with our Ford Transit Nugget in Italy( West Coast, Sardinia a. Sicily),8000km.

In Iceland we were sleeping together in our Defender, the mattress is 190x140x12cm, in Afrika my wife slept alone in the rooftent, 140x200cm, I was sleeping downstairs in the Defender. It`s better that way, because I love to read in the evening, she likes to sleep! Together we go hiking, trail running 3 times a week. We want to see the beautiful Nature in all countries, where we are travelling. not the big cities. We know the National Parks in North Amerika better, than most people, who are living there.

Enjoy your life! We still have many beautiful parts in the world.
Greetings from Hans!

Reading this makes me feel l am not living life to the full !!
You've inspired me to get out there more this year, although l won't match your adventures we've bought a small adventure type caravan/pod and already booked several trips

 

[Defenderlover]

Reading this makes me feel l am not living life to the full !!
You've inspired me to get out there more this year, although l won't match your adventures we've bought a small adventure type caravan/pod and already booked several trips

Hello Lightning, I think you are much younger than me. I am now 69 and I can feel every day my good time is running slowly out. We ship our Transit Nugget in June to Halifax to revisit in 5 months many of the beautiful spots in North America. Sadly not with our beautiful Defender with a roof tent, because our Nugget is much more comfortable and we want to stay mostly free, no campsites!
But it`s always a long fight with my 8,5 years younger wife to convince her to stop working. She is a social worker and loves her work. But when we are on tour, she loves it very much and takes thousands of photos, explores the history of the region and wrights her travel blog.

I am sure, we know the beautiful National Parks in North America better, than 98% of the North Americans.
But as I mentioned before, my good time/life is running out. And I have to see and explore many of the best spots again: West Coast Trail, Berg Lake Trail, may be Chilkout Trail, Red Wood NP, Yosemite NP, Mount Whitney, Death Valley, Zion NP, Arches NP, Moab jogging Slic Rock Trail, Grand Canyon North and South Rim, hiking and jogging down to the Colorado River, May be this time we go with a company with a raft 1 or 2 weeks on the Colorado River through Grand Canyon, region around Sedona, Tucson, White Sands, Carlsberg Caverns, Florida with key west, Shark Valley NP, etc.
For travelling in North America you don`t need much money.Mostly you can stay free, petrol is half price compared to Europe, etc. . And I am sure, in North Amerika are the most beautiful NP in the world. In the USA you have to pay only around 80 Euro for family ticket, one year!

Most people in the first world could do long time travelling, if they would plan their lives far in advance. That means you have to talk to your employer -may be a sabattical without payment- or you have to quit the job and look for an other, when you are back. Most people have way too many fears!
On Defenders you can read very often: Don`t dream your life, live your dreams! Life is to short to be boring!

If you really want to explore, enjoy big countries you need much time. If I see all these short time tourists: They are always in big hurry, want to see a big country like the USA in 2 weeks.
When the children are grown up, most parents could do long time travelling with enough planning in advance. I started travelling the world, when I was 56. But biggest problem is always Angst, mostly unfounded!

Greetings to the beautiful England/Great Britain Hans!

 

[lightning]

l am not that much younger than you. Less than 10 years.
lt's never too late to start adventures. My dream is to revisit the USA, we visited in 1979 on a road trip when l was a teenager and l want to see Yosemite and Grand Canyon again, plus the desert lands. Back then it was fairly quiet, we just rolled up everywhere and got a room, even at the above places, but now you need to book 12 months in advance.

When at the Grand Canyon l decided to get up early to see the sun rise. l walked through the woods from the lodge to find the path in the dark, missed it and basically fell off the edge. Mercifully it was a scree slope before the 1,000 meter drop and l managed to hang on and scramble back up. l never told my parents to this day.

The rental car was a Ford Fairmont. lt was auto of course. l told my dad l had driven one and could l park it at the Motel. Of course l had never driven one. l put it in reverse and stood on the gas, the car shot backwards and had it not been for the high curb the car would have ended up in the Motel lounge.
My dad hadn't paid the collision damage waiver so l am not sure how many dollars he'd have had to fork out.