Critical malfunction Petrol N1

[Kamalasound]

Unfortunately I have to report that our Grenadier N1 5 seat utility is experiencing a critical malfunction and has now been at the shop for the past 2 weeks.
Upon constant mild acceleration, possibly in every gear, around 2.000/2.5000 rpm the car seemed to stumble or have hiccups.
This does not happen once applying more energetic acceleration.
Initially we thought it might have been a dirty batch of petrol but once trucked back to the shop this resulted in an unknown problem that isnt being picked up by the computer software availlable to the service centres.
The car has the problem and it is evident upon test driving but the mechanics have no idea how to solve the problem.
Currently waiting for an engineer from Hambach to show up and try and trouble shoot but as of today no sign of anyone showing up.
As much as the dealer and the sales representatives for Ineos are trying to do their best unfortunately the Maintenance & Service centre at headquarters is basically not taking care of the issue as they should have.
Very disappointed with the current outcome of the situation.

 

[ECrider]

Unfortunately I have to report that our Grenadier N1 5 seat utility is experiencing a critical malfunction and has now been at the shop for the past 2 weeks.
Upon constant mild acceleration, possibly in every gear, around 2.000/2.5000 rpm the car seemed to stumble or have hiccups.
This does not happen once applying more energetic acceleration.
Initially we thought it might have been a dirty batch of petrol but once trucked back to the shop this resulted in an unknown problem that isnt being picked up by the computer software availlable to the service centres.
The car has the problem and it is evident upon test driving but the mechanics have no idea how to solve the problem.
Currently waiting for an engineer from Hambach to show up and try and trouble shoot but as of today no sign of anyone showing up.
As much as the dealer and the sales representatives for Ineos are trying to do their best unfortunately the Maintenance & Service centre at headquarters is basically not taking care of the issue as they should have.
Very disappointed with the current outcome of the situation.

very sorry to hear that. best of luck.

I had something similar with a Honda and after changing various parts (throttle body/ecu's....etc) it turned out to be one of the wiring looms. Most frustrating.

 

[DaveB]

Unfortunately I have to report that our Grenadier N1 5 seat utility is experiencing a critical malfunction and has now been at the shop for the past 2 weeks.
Upon constant mild acceleration, possibly in every gear, around 2.000/2.5000 rpm the car seemed to stumble or have hiccups.
This does not happen once applying more energetic acceleration.
Initially we thought it might have been a dirty batch of petrol but once trucked back to the shop this resulted in an unknown problem that isnt being picked up by the computer software availlable to the service centres.
The car has the problem and it is evident upon test driving but the mechanics have no idea how to solve the problem.
Currently waiting for an engineer from Hambach to show up and try and trouble shoot but as of today no sign of anyone showing up.
As much as the dealer and the sales representatives for Ineos are trying to do their best unfortunately the Maintenance & Service centre at headquarters is basically not taking care of the issue as they should have.
Very disappointed with the current outcome of the situation.

I had a similar problem a few years ago on a Suzuki Grand Vitara with a 2.5 Litre V6 petrol engine.
Finally found a small piece of plastic in the fuel filter that was floating around and blocking the flow.

 

[Gaston the Grenadier]

Sheesh….. where do you start?

Current mileage?

Has it been doing this from the outset?

Did the problem manifest itself gradually or suddenly?

What fuel return were you getting? ie was it poor, average or unusually good?

Have you pressure washed under the bonnet or near any critical wiring?

Has your vehicle had the software update?
If not, perhaps that might be a good start, as it might be a bug in the ECU fuel map.

All obvious questions, but the more detail you post, the more possibilities can be discounted.

Have Ineos provided you with a vehicle to keep you going, as I notice you mentioned yours is a commercial model?

Please keep us posted on any news, hopefully good news.

Good luck.

 

[Kamalasound]

Sheesh….. where do you start?

Current mileage?

1,500km aprox

Has it been doing this from the outset?

We realised almost immediately but was rare then started getting more and more noticeable to the point we had to stop the car.

Did the problem manifest itself gradually or suddenly?

What fuel return were you getting? ie was it poor, average or unusually good?

Poor

Have you pressure washed under the bonnet or near any critical wiring?

Nope

Has your vehicle had the software update?

Nope but is now with the service centre and they are not finding the problem as the control software doesnt show that there are any while driving the car it is noticeable.

If not, perhaps that might be a good start, as it might be a bug in the ECU fuel map.

Could be the case as well as some sensor that is broken and will need to be checked one by one

All obvious questions, but the more detail you post, the more possibilities can be discounted.

Initially thought it was the fuel but then after cleaning and so on it still had this issue so they have no Clie of what is happening

Have Ineos provided you with a vehicle to keep you going, as I notice you mentioned yours is a commercial model?

hahahaha not happening, we do have a number of cars but yet again it is frustrating

Please keep us posted on any news, hopefully good news

Will do so was waiting to post because the local service centre was going above and beyond but Hambach apparently is in shambles and no one is responding to the service centre. Apparently it is the first time that something similar happens.....nota a good start

.

Good luck.

Thanks I'll need it

 

[DenisM]

It's not an "Ineos" issue per se, it's a BMW B58 engine reliability issue:
there's a lot of info on the net...e.g. check out https://vehiclefreak.com/bmw-b58-engine-reliability-and-5-common-problems/

9 Serious BMW B58 Engine Problems (6-cylinder, 40i)

The BMW B58 engine is a BMW lover's go-to engine, but is it because of its reliability? Here are all the common BMW B58 engine problems.

lifeonfour.co

The symptoms you're describing may well be related to valve timing... hence the VANOS reference.
Intermittent VANOS solenoid failure may not necessarily show up on their fancy diagnostic devices... could be worth a look...

 

[trobex]

It's not an "Ineos" issue per se, it's a BMW B58 engine reliability issue:
there's a lot of info on the net...e.g. check out https://vehiclefreak.com/bmw-b58-engine-reliability-and-5-common-problems/

9 Serious BMW B58 Engine Problems (6-cylinder, 40i)

The BMW B58 engine is a BMW lover's go-to engine, but is it because of its reliability? Here are all the common BMW B58 engine problems.

lifeonfour.co

The symptoms you're describing may well be related to valve timing... hence the VANOS reference.
Intermittent VANOS solenoid failure may not necessarily show up on their fancy diagnostic devices... could be worth a look...

Maybe the BMW petrol was not the best choice for the Gren!!!

 

[DenisM]

Maybe the BMW petrol was not the best choice for the Gren!!!

The B58 engine is a great choice.. just ask Toyota Supra owners who fit aftermarket "bolt on" turbo kits for reliable 600+ bhp with minimal engine remapping.
The B58 and B57 engines share a common "architecture" and quite a few interchangeable bits and pieces.
The VANOS system is common to both. A dodgy solenoid can wreak "tear your hair out frustration" ... both in petrol and diesel versions.
The rough running and gradual deterioration as described by @Kamalasound was similar to deteriorating VANOS symptoms in the L322 (now some 20 yrs old) Range Rover equipped with the 4L BMW V8. In the 3L straight 6 B58 a solenoid change is a moderately challenging but doable DIY replacement exercise for someone with basic mechanical know-how.
EDIT As an afterthought. my first check would be to ensure that the wiring harness and connectors to both VANOS solenoids are correctly seated and there's not intermittent contact occurring.

 

[Tazzieman]

EDIT As an afterthought. my first check would be to ensure that the wiring harness and connectors to both VANOS solenoids are correctly seated and there's not intermittent contact occurring.

I can always imagine in the heat of production the occasional connector is not properly seated.
I've done it myself!

 

[DaveB]

I can always imagine in the heat of production the occasional connector is not properly seated.
I've done it myself!

I have never made that mistake.

 

[ECrider]

I have never made that mistake.

practice makes perfect

 

[DaveB]

practice makes perfect

So does never doing any work on a BMW engine.
Zero mistakes.

 

[Tazzieman]

I have never made that mistake.

But you have a well lit warm garage not a dark gravel driveway on a cold night

 

[ECrider]

I won't mention dirt track

 

[Tazzieman]

I won't mention dirt track

Whilst balancing on your stomach on the fender , because the vehicle has a 2" lift and you're not at least 6ft5" tall.
We've all been there...haven't we?

 

[Kamalasound]

Thanks for the precious suggestions I have reverted the comments back to the service centre suggesting for a BMW engineer to be called rather than someone at Hambach.

 

[DaveB]

Whilst balancing on your stomach on the fender , because the vehicle has a 2" lift and you're not at least 6ft5" tall.
We've all been there...haven't we?

No
I am a sophisticated adult not a seesaw (Teetertotter for US viewers)

 

[Tazzieman]

No
I am a sophisticated adult not a seesaw (Teetertotter for US viewers)

I'm a planker from way back. Use it or lose it applies to many things!

 

[trobex]

This can only be fixed by the dealer/IA - retain that warranty and all!

 

[Kamalasound]

As an updated I finally got back the car after 1 month at the shop.
Shout out to the Ineos After Sales Country Manager for having stepped up and taken the matter under his control.
A BMW engineer was sent from Germany to Italy and with a couple of days work managed to identify the issue that was not related to the Vanos system but to the electronic commands sent to the throttle body.
Still an engine problem that none of the diagnostics of Ineos could actually pick up as apparently it is a very modest diagnostic system.
As much as the local service centres can put effort in trying to solve minor problems, it seems to me as though the true knowhow is with the BMW service teams hence keep one as close friends if you want to avoid be sure of not having maintenance issues.