BFG KO2 - A Great Tire

[stickshifter]

For those who are wondering about the BFG KO2, check out this review (below). Everything he says matches my experience with these tires. I don't know what load range he is running - I run Load Range E. In addition to having a heavier load rating than Load Range C, the E-rated tires have thicker / stronger sidewalls, which provide greater puncture resistance - and in rocky terrain this is great; its also nice in the desert and in other places where there are thorns. Of course, the E-rated tires are heavier than the C-rated tires, which is the only downside (in my opinion). I don't mind the stiffer ride, and I actually appreciate the firmness of the sidewall in the corners. If you drive winding canyons regularly, you might also enjoy the stiff sidewall. I am running 275/70/R17 on my Tacoma with a 1.5 inch suspension lift (below), and we run 265/70/R17 on my wife's 4Runner.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4dTv_jJyLs

 

[Davman]

I must admit, and I am ready for the haters, I am concerned about the K02's.

I have had K02's in the past on a Nissan Patrol, and whilst never being quite happy with them on the road, they were a good off road All Terrain in my experience.

Recently though, I have had two mates who put these on various trucks within the last two years.  Both of them hated them so much after about 10,000 kilometres they got rid of them.  If you go to online tyre review sites, you would also find that "recently" K02's seem to have lost the plot, with may other people having similar experiences.

About 1 year ago, I was at the crossroads of choice of tyre, and went to a very busy tyre shop at the base of the Yarra Valley, where you see 4WD's in and out of that shop every 5 minutes. They were at the time Huge BFG devotees, with a large supply of K02's in stock.  At the time after talking to him, I personally chose  the Falken Wildpeaks AT3W's, which he said seemed to be a good tyre.

Today I went in and got my rotation done, and given that I will be getting a Grenadier with the KO2's, I expressed my concerns and discussed the latest with him. He mentioned that over the last year, with the amount of issues they have had with the K02's, he no longer in good faith recommends them.  In fact he said every BFG rep that he has spoken to, deny any issues with the tyres  and are putting their heads in the sand. His perspective is that something has changed in the last few years.

He personally has a set of K02's on his Landcruiser 200 series, but after 20,000kays he is going to remove them in the next few weeks - and put on the Falkens himself.

So, for me, I think I will be ordering the Grenadier with Lockers/BFG's, taking the tyres off straight away - and selling them on Ebay.  If anyone wants a spare set, then look me up. 

 

[stickshifter]

[QUOTE username=Davman userid=8961117 postid=1332808863]I must admit, and I am ready for the haters, I am concerned about the K02's.

I have had K02's in the past on a Nissan Patrol, and whilst never being quite happy with them on the road, they were a good off road All Terrain in my experience.

Recently though, I have had two mates who put these on various trucks within the last two years.  Both of them hated them so much after about 10,000 kilometres they got rid of them.  If you go to online tyre review sites, you would also find that "recently" K02's seem to have lost the plot, with may other people having similar experiences.

About 1 year ago, I was at the crossroads of choice of tyre, and went to a very busy tyre shop at the base of the Yarra Valley, where you see 4WD's in and out of that shop every 5 minutes. They were at the time Huge BFG devotees, with a large supply of K02's in stock.  At the time after talking to him, I personally chose  the Falken Wildpeaks AT3W's, which he said seemed to be a good tyre.

Today I went in and got my rotation done, and given that I will be getting a Grenadier with the KO2's, I expressed my concerns and discussed the latest with him. He mentioned that over the last year, with the amount of issues they have had with the K02's, he no longer in good faith recommends them.  In fact he said every BFG rep that he has spoken to, deny any issues with the tyres  and are putting their heads in the sand. His perspective is that something has changed in the last few years.

He personally has a set of K02's on his Landcruiser 200 series, but after 20,000kays he is going to remove them in the next few weeks - and put on the Falkens himself.

So, for me, I think I will be ordering the Grenadier with Lockers/BFG's, taking the tyres off straight away - and selling them on Ebay.  If anyone wants a spare set, then look me up. 



[/QUOTE]

I'm not a hater at all, and I'm interested in your experience with the KO2. What specifically are people complaining about? You wrote that you were "never quite happy with them on the road". Can you be more specific? What issues has your tire shop had with the KO2?

 

[Davman]

My personal experience with KO2's were terrible wet on road performance, aquaplaning, road noise etc.  I didn't think my experience was too bad, as it is an Off Road focused All Terrain.  I couldn't comment too much on longevity as I didnt have the car that long.

However, the currentl complaints seem to amplify the same problems as they have always had, but now the longevity seems to not be there either. As mentioned a tyre bloke on his own car is only getting 20,000 kilometers and the tyres are already 80% gone - I think this makes one ask a few questions.  Obviously his car wasn't the only one having the same problems, otherwise I am sure that he would of got his own tires replaced by BFG as a goodwill gesture.  He said that BFG are making up all kinds of excuses, none of which sit comfortably with him.

Also, the road handling in the dry has dropped "off the cliff" in his experience, which marries up with the comments the blokes I know have made.

I know these tyres are more to the offroad side of AT's, however even with offroaders 95% of people will spend 95% of the time on the road, I think the BFG's have lost the edge they once had.

I did a lot of reading on TyreReview.com.au, it seems that too many people have similar experiences.

 

[stickshifter]

Hey Davman,

There are two different versions of the KO2 rubber.

(1) The standard rubber which is 3 Peak Mountain Snowflake rated (3pmsf). The 3pmsf rating is given to an all-season tire that has passed an industry-standard acceleration test on medium-pack snow. Passing the test earns the logo. The test does not cover braking or cornering, although those qualities tend to shadow the acceleration abilities of a tire to some degree (Source: Haggerty Media, March 11, 2021). 

(2) The "Different Tread" or DT version, which is a harder, longer-lasting rubber, but is not 3pmsf. Its actually the same tread design, but a harder rubber compound (so the term 'Different Tread' is a bit of a misnomer).

I have never owned a KO2 with the DT rubber. Which version did you own? I am curious if the louder road noise and the hydroplaning on wet pavement (which you described) is associated with the DT version of the tire. However, the DT version is supposed to have longer tread life, so if you are seeing both louder road noise and shorter tread life then something isn't adding up.

In summary: not all KO2 tires are created equal. Not only are there load ratings of C, D and E (even within the same size tire), but in some sizes there is both a standard version (3pmsf) and a DT version (harder rubber / longer-lasting). Key point: the user reviews of all of these tires are mixed together as if everyone is using the same tire. The only thing the different versions have in common is the tread design.

My experience: The original KO tire was crap. In the early 1990s, I ran them on my 1975 Toyota Landcruiser FJ-40, and absolutely hated them. I didn't think that they did anything well. This experience kept me away from BFG for years. I've only been running KO2s since 2017, but they have been the perfect tire for my use: 70% tarmac, 25% dirt road, 5% rocky trails. I've owned better off-road AT tires (like the Cooper ST MAXX I ran on my Jeep JKU), but never a better all-around AT tire. In May 2022, I put a new set of KO2s on my truck, replacing the previous KO2s. Both sets were 3pmsf. These new tires are just as quiet as the older ones, when they were new. I do think they get a little louder as they wear. But overall, I have been very pleased with how quiet this tire actually is (both sets I have run on this truck). These are the quietest AT tires that also provide excellent off-road performance. I've also not experienced any hydroplaning with these tires; I have no idea if that is good luck, or if that is because I have been using the 3pmsf version, and you used the DT version (would love to hear which you owned). I'll be the first to admit that a simple visual inspection of the tread design does not indicate that the tire would clear water well - but there could very well be engineering in the tread that I don't recognize. I'm not a tire expert - just a guy who has been driving off-road vehicles for 35 years, and who loves a good tire!

 

[G-Man]

I owned a Jeep Wrangler JL Rubicon that came fitted with BFG Mud Terrains as stock and thought I was going to die young every time it rained. They were a terrible option to fit on a stock vehicle IMHO. I swapped them for K02's after 3000 miles and the difference was night was night and day, I had no issues with them in the wet.

 

[ECrider]

I have KO2's on my Disco4 and I think they are a decent tyre, sure don't expect fantastic grip round slippy roundabouts when it's rained after a prolonged dry stint (unusual here in the UK granted!) but off road they are very capable until you hit deep mud where they then turn into slicks. 

I will fit the KM3's for the season mid Sept-beg Feb or perhaps later if there's any need, otherwise will swap them back to KO2's for the rest of the year. Hoping can pick up a 2nd set of 17" steel wheels from Ineos at not too much expense.

Ps, if anyone is thinking about getting security wheel nuts then think again. If they are anything like those on my D4 they are not fit for purpose and I don't think anyone nicks wheels anymore? Replaced mine with 316 SS. Having said that hopefully Ineos would've spec'd something more suitable.

 

[abakker]

I have had 2 sets of the KO2s on my Tundra - 285/65r18 and 275/70r18, used for overlanding/towing/work and not for technical stuff. They were good in the snow, and noisy, but not particularly long-lived. They were also squirrelly when you didn't match the tire pressure exactly to the load. in Load range E on an empty tundra, I was constantly surfing around 35-40 PSI, but loaded I would end up in the 50-55psi range. 

I'm now on 295/70r18 Cooper AT3s, and I would probably get a set of these tires for the Grenadier. They are quieter and better, and still seem to do just as well off road. (tested for ~500 miles in death valley) 

 

[stickshifter]

[QUOTE username=abakker userid=9040069 postid=1333073510]I have had 2 sets of the KO2s on my Tundra - 285/65r18 and 275/70r18, used for overlanding/towing/work and not for technical stuff. They were good in the snow, and noisy, but not particularly long-lived. They were also squirrelly when you didn't match the tire pressure exactly to the load. in Load range E on an empty tundra, I was constantly surfing around 35-40 PSI, but loaded I would end up in the 50-55psi range. 

I'm now on 295/70r18 Cooper AT3s, and I would probably get a set of these tires for the Grenadier. They are quieter and better, and still seem to do just as well off road. (tested for ~500 miles in death valley) [/QUOTE]
It sounds like you were not super-happy with your KO2s. Just wondering why you got a second set? All the best.

 

[abakker]

I actually destroyed 2 of the 285/65 set of tires in Ubehebe city in death valley. ran over some mining equipment. I patched them and got out to a tire shop in Beatty NV, and they had the 275/70s because that is the common size in all 3/4 ton trucks these days. Don't get me wrong, they are fine, but they are fairly unpleasant on-road after about 15-20k miles. 

 

[Nocrays]

I’ve had BFG ATs on my Defender since new in 2001. I get approx 100,000 per set currently on my third set at 260,000km. they have been a great tyre with only a single puncture (staked by steel bar).
The Defender is my daily drive as well as doing some serious off-road and desert driving.
Perhaps they are suited to this style of vehicle? I’m very happy about the tyre selection.

 

[stickshifter]

I actually destroyed 2 of the 285/65 set of tires in Ubehebe city in death valley. ran over some mining equipment. I patched them and got out to a tire shop in Beatty NV, and they had the 275/70s because that is the common size in all 3/4 ton trucks these days. Don't get me wrong, they are fine, but they are fairly unpleasant on-road after about 15-20k miles.

It sounds like any tires would have been damaged by the mining equipment - right? So I wouldn't hold that against the KO2, but your experience with the tires after 15 or 20K is a bit of a bummer. I had a great experience with Cooper tires (ran the ST MAXX on my Jeep Wrangler), and the Cooper AT3 has a good reputation. I'm sure they will run great on the Grenadier!

 

[emax]

I’ve had BFG ATs on my Defender since new in 2001. I get approx 100,000 per set currently on my third set at 260,000km. they have been a great tyre with only a single puncture (staked by steel bar).
The Defender is my daily drive as well as doing some serious off-road and desert driving.
Perhaps they are suited to this style of vehicle? I’m very happy about the tyre selection.

Thank you foryour judgement.

As I have ticked the "rough" package, I will get the BFGKO2 weather I want them or not. But in fact I can't tell, as I haven't had a 4x4 since the mid 90ies.

However, what I would greatly appreciate would be some information on what environment you are using the KO2's in. It's quite different to have them in 40°C in Australia or in northern England where children learn what 'sun' is in school.

 

[globalgregors]

have them in 40°C in Australia

Australian Army runs BFG ATs on it’s fleet of G-Wagens, if that’s the sort of endorsement you’re after.

 

[emax]

I don't know if the Australian Army always has the best material, or like the German army only the material that is available... ;-)

But what I meant: reviews without this information don't really tell me much.

 

[Nocrays]

Thank you foryour judgement.

As I have ticked the "rough" package, I will get the BFGKo2 weather I want them or not. But in fact I can't tell, as I haven't had a 4x4 since the mid 90ies.

However, what I would greatly appreciate would be some information on what environment you are using the KO2's in. It's quite different to have them in 40°C in Australia or in northern England where children learn what 'sun' is in school.

Been used on west and east coast of Australia. A lot of wet clay and rock in the east and they work ok but muddies would have been the ticket but the ATs were fine.

and plenty of rough desert work in the west. Lots of off the track desert work where staking is a very high risk.

Also done a ton of sand and beach driving. And survived limestone outcrops etc.

She has definitely not been a shopping cart or school bus.

 

[Nocrays]

I don't know if the Australian Army always has the best material, or like the German army only the material that is available... ;-)

But what I meant: reviews without this information don't really tell me much.

Jawohl!!!

What he is saying is the Army in Australia do a heap of serious bush bashing (serious remote four wheel driving ). They are normally pretty hard on thier gear so if they are using a tyre there is a good chance they have done thier home work.

As per my other post, four wheel driving in Australia is pretty tough on tyres.

Are there still unsealed roads in Germany??

 

[cheswick]

I don't know if the Australian Army always has the best material, or like the German army only the material that is available... ;-)

But what I meant: reviews without this information don't really tell me much.

Agree. ARH Tiger being the most recent example of shithouse procurement.

 

[globalgregors]

done thier home work.

Indeed, the KO2s are the tyre they went with AFTER the first choice proved insufficiently durable. Aussie mindset at this point is typically “bugger this for a mugs game, let’’s just spend on the <insert product of higher quality and cost>”.

I also note that Army G-Wagons are equipped with a tow cable, alloy rims, one spare (and no winch), so staking a bunch of tyres on a task would wear thin pretty quick. All these measures to maximise payload presumably, which is 1200kg for the station wagon).

To complete the spec, 150L worth of fuel across two tanks. So all a bit of a step up on the standard IG.

Usual practice for serious remote travel/exploration geologists/NGOs etc in Oz is two spares regardless of the tyre.
Hence I expect we’ll want to adapt the Grenadier somewhat for professional outback use.

 

[Nocrays]

Agree. ARH Tiger being the most recent example of shithouse procurement.

Haha. Don’t get me started on the RANs SeaSprite debacle.