First oil change

Tom109 said:

What about the initial factory oil fill and break-in formulation? Any truth to this?

I have a difficult time not changing the oil after the initial 500-1000 miles. I will say that my 2003 VW Tdi Wagon was strongly recommended to run the factory oil the full 10k initial service cycle, which I begrudgingly did. That motor is still running a peak compression 258k miles later.

So, old habits vs. follow the new guidelines..?

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Read this and come to your own conclusions.
It makes sense not to thrash a new modern engine; "break in oils" , not for me.
Unless it was an old school engine.

I changed the first time after 8500 km. From now it will be changed every 15000 km or once a year. This works more than fine for me and all the companies cars. I wouldn't change as long as I would not do many short drives.

I'm a fan of a first oil change even if it might me not necessary. Why? Because by checking the oil there is a possibility to see if something is wrong after the initial assembly. That should not be, but it is possible. Whenever possible I use that to exchange the oil plug with a magnetic one.

AWo

Hello Tazzieman, hello Tom, to enhance my writing from above:
The most famous magazine about cars in the German speaking area is Auto motor and Sports. They took used motor oil after 50k km to the lab, may be 30 years ago, the result was: Lubrification was undisturbed after 50k km, there was no real need to change this oil! A second test may be 10 years ago had the same result! Of course the oil didn`t look like brand new, especially not from the diesel engine.

I think I have to stress, that I always take the best synthetic oils( Liqui Moly, Castrol, etc.) with the right specification from the carmaker. I think it`s clear, that you always have to change the oil filter!!! I take only the best oil filters(i.e. Mahle etc.). Because there are nearly no metal shavings in modern engines, the filter will last very long. I always buy the oil and the filter by the internet. At the dealer you pay in Germany 4-5 times more for the same stuff!
Why said Ford for the Transit 2,2l diesel engine: oil change every 50k km, or every 2- years. In the newer 2,0l diesel engines, they reduced it to 30k km. By the way, I don`t care for 2 years. I change the oil after 30 or 50k km and had never problems with it( with my sports car I changed the oil after 10 years and50k km without any problem, it looked still pretty new).

I can not understand, why you should change the oil in the 3,0l BMW engine after 15k km. My 2,2l diesel engine in my Ford transit Nugget with 2.5-3.0 tons has to work harder with it`s 360 Nm torque compared to the 3,0, biturbo diesel engine with 550 Nm torque of the Grenadier!

If you you are not a senseless driver, I can recommend all Grenadier drivers to do the oil change after 30k km, if your Grenadier has to work often very hard(towing, rock crawling, repeatedly long stretches in deep sand with high revs etc.) may be after 15-20k km. I will do it with my Grenadier after 30- 50k km, because I am a very careful driver.
With my new LR Defender, the real one, I did the first oil change after 30k km and 60k km in Africa myself on a campsite and on car park. I will do the next change before we go on our next trip to Africa with 90k km on the odometer. In 2x 9 month in southern Africa with ca. 70k km, the Defender had to work often hard in deep sand, high temperatures and steep rocky trails. The car/Engine had no problems! Even in Australia I would do the same. Because you don`t get the right oil in North/Central America or in Africa, I take the right oil with me from Germany.

So many people have unfounded anxieties all over the world and with these anxieties many people/dealers/companies make a lot of money!
I don`t have much money,that´s why I try to save money. I can´t afford mistakes: a new engine cost an awful lot of money.

Greetings from Germany, Hans!

Tazzieman said:

Heavily used Grenadiers can of course benefit from shorter oil change intervals along with other service items.

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I agree, my very heavily used Grenadier - N1 commercial vehicle - will be following the manufacturers recommendations of shorter intervals.

AMD66 said:

I agree, my very heavily used Grenadier - N1 commercial vehicle - will be following the manufacturers recommendations of shorter intervals.

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Yeah - I think most (all?) manufacturers recommend shortening the interval if you regularly off-road, tow heavy, race, do cold starts, and some even specify frequent stop-and-go traffic as a reason to change the oil more frequently.

Thoughts on this from Car & Driver:

Thoughts on this from Car & Driver:
https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a26590646/how-often-to-change-oil/

Thought it was fairly balanced and again highlighted the effect of what your vehicle is used for, where it operates….as an important factor to be considered.

It would be interesting to see full oil analysis trends including TBN and TAN for these extended oil change intervals. It's difficult to tell the true condition of used oil by just looking at it.
In some engine applications the trend has gone towards oil condition monitoring and change intervals set on the quantity of fuel burnt. The biggest issues these days is piston, ring design and emission system increasing the soot load and fuel dilution of oils. Other factors that have changed with modern oils is the reduction or elimination of some additives to reduce emissions and increase emission system component life. The extra soot and carbon in suspension from extended oil change intervals is know to increase top end and timing chain wear. Most modern engines and transmissions are using less oil quantities and components are operating at higher temperatures from higher power and torque of new engines increasing demands on oil additives to control oxidation.
Most oil change intervals are established from a cross section of operation types using a wide variety end user and environmental operating conditions to give an average life of oil before major degradation. Extended fluid change intervals should be considered case by case to suit environmental and use conditions.

Grapa said:

How many miles to do the first oil change? The manual says at 12.000…. It seems a little to far for me. Usually, my other cars (land cruiser 200, G wagen) had a break in period and oil change at 1.000 miles. Thanks

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Ironically I had mine changed yesterday. 5800 miles and 11 months on from it arriving at the dealer. They changed oil, all filters and the transfer case oil.. £450 all in. The dealer also did a load of Ineos campaigns but they didn’t tell me what. I made sure I got the Ineos stamp in the service book.

mine also has a progressive bearing failure in the steering column which has parts on back order. I noticed a cracking sound when slow speed manoeuvring.. not a safety issue apparently..

AMD66 said:

I’m changing mine next weeK, I will have just over 4000 miles on it.
The next change will be at 12,000 or 1st Service. I will then drop the oil every 6,000 miles.

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I did my first change at ~8000km, along with oil filter and air filter(!). A clogged air filter can increase engine oil temperature considerably, as I experienced with my (in the first years Volkswagen serviced...) Passat BiTDI. >10K lower oil temp with the new air filter under same operating conditions.
Since IMHO the air filter in the Grenadier is quite small (compared to the Passat 240 BiTDI), the ~20EUR for a new air filter once in a while are a very good invest.

TD5-90 said:

I did my first change at ~8000km, along with oil filter and air filter(!). A clogged air filter can increase engine oil temperature considerably, as I experienced with my (in the first years Volkswagen serviced...) Passat BiTDI. >10K lower oil temp with the new air filter under same operating conditions.
Since IMHO the air filter in the Grenadier is quite small (compared to the Passat 240 BiTDI), the ~20EUR for a new air filter once in a while are a very good invest.

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It is a bit strange that the air filter requires a tool to change. Most air filter housings are snap-open, to make it easier to open up the box when out on the trail, so you can give the filter a couple of quick wacks, and knock out excess dust & dirt. Not a big deal of course, just an odd design choice.

stickshifter said:

It is a bit strange that the air filter requires a tool to change. Most air filter housings are snap-open, to make it easier to open up the box when out on the trail, so you can give the filter a couple of quick wacks, and knock out excess dust & dirt. Not a big deal of course, just an odd design choice.

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Maybe due to the limited space around the filter box. Or simply resembling the design used in BMW passenger cars which are supposed to need less air filter care than a 4x4...

TD5-90 said:

Maybe due to the limited space around the filter box. Or simply resembling the design used in BMW passenger cars which are supposed to need less air filter care than a 4x4...

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Yeah, both these are possible explanations. Just a little inconvenient. Somehow, every trip to Moab and you end up with half the desert in your air box!

Defenderlover said:

Hello Tazzieman, hello Tom, to enhance my writing from above:

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Hans - this is all great information and I appreciate your experience. Your post naturally begs the next question, what oil filter are IG owners using? Are you going IA, BMW, or OEM supplier?

My two cents, I have owned numerous cars over the past 45 years and have never had any internal oil related failures. I started using full synthetic in the early 1990s to help a diesel cold start while living in MN and never went back. I go by the manufacturers recommendations. I don’t want to waste money by doing it too often but with all modern engines I would not extend it either. Additives break down and with direct injection build up issues that are a problem I prefer to avoid. I will probably allow dealer to do it while under warranty (I will do any additional myself).

Biggest problem I am finding is oil that meets the unknown INEOS spec, so going by BMW seems LL17fe+ is the latest and that is not well represented in the States. So far only Vavoline EUROPEAN references it saying it is recommended for. Of course BMW oil or online European imports as well.

Ragman said:

My two cents, I have owned numerous cars over the past 45 years and have never had any internal oil related failures. I started using full synthetic in the early 1990s to help a diesel cold start while living in MN and never went back. I go by the manufacturers recommendations. I don’t want to waste money by doing it too often but with all modern engines I would not extend it either. Additives break down and with direct injection build up issues that are a problem I prefer to avoid. I will probably allow dealer to do it while under warranty (I will do any additional myself).

Biggest problem I am finding is oil that meets the unknown INEOS spec, so going by BMW seems LL17fe+ is the latest and that is not well represented in the States. So far only Vavoline EUROPEAN references it saying it is recommended for. Of course BMW oil or online European imports as well.

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Do they have Mobil 1 in the US. I am going to use Mobil 1 ESP LV 0W-30 as a top up oil in my diesel Gren.

I did mine at 1300km. My Diesel mechanic brother in law was very insistent that I ignore the company schedule and do a 1000km change.

Ever Pragmatic said:

Ironically I had mine changed yesterday. 5800 miles and 11 months on from it arriving at the dealer. They changed oil, all filters and the transfer case oil.. £450 all in. The dealer also did a load of Ineos campaigns but they didn’t tell me what. I made sure I got the Ineos stamp in the service book.

mine also has a progressive bearing failure in the steering column which has parts on back order. I noticed a cracking sound when slow speed manoeuvring.. not a safety issue apparently..

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Although I changed my oil early, I am due shortly for my first scheduled service. The dealer quoted me about $1700 for the service and when I asked why so much, he explained that the first service includes diff and transfer case oil changes as well as the engine oil, and fuel and oil and cabin filters etc, apparently it’s about 3 hours work plus fluids and parts. Dor some odd reason it doesn’t include air filter, but I will get mine changed anyway as I have done quite a bit of dusty driving

This was interesting by a lubrication specialist (at least he explains why he has certain views): View: https://youtu.be/_6nWCQ_70J0

Eric said:

Do they have Mobil 1 in the US. I am going to use Mobil 1 ESP LV 0W-30 as a top up oil in my diesel Gren.

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I don’t see Mobile 1 0-20 listing any BMW spec on their website sadly as a brand I have used for a very long time.