Rumors of upcoming price hike

Deichrutscher · Jul 14, 2023

With the actually Price it doesn't get any easier to choose the Grenadier Quartermaster.

An Amarok or a Ford Ranger are lighter, faster (180 km/h, 190km/h for the "Adventura"-Modell) and can carry more.
The Amarok/Ford has a payload of >820kg, the Grenadier as a diesel only 740kg. The engine of the Amarok has 240hp/600Nm, that of the Grenadier 249hp/550Nm.

With the tailgate open, both (Ford and VW) can load two euro pallets in the cargo box (sideways). The Grenadier can only load one pallet (lengthwise) because the space between the wheelhouses is too small. The spare wheel doesn't take up any space on the truck bed (of course you can still put it there - if you're afraid of not being able to get to it off-road). But on road you can use the space for loading.

The turning circle on the Amarok is less than 13m, on the Quartermaster it was about 14m as far as I can remember (the website is currently down, so I can't check 14.07.23 14:50 CEST)

And another point: the Grenadier is more than 20,000€ more expensive with less equipment (On Amarok is included a heated windshield and a auxiliary heating). It is the price for a new Canopy Camper with all options on top!

All have choiced a very bad mounting point for the antenna :-(

Advantages of the Grenadier:
It looks better, should be made more robust (mechanic) and simply has more style.
The decision will be difficult, it is a lot of money !

Krabby · Jul 14, 2023

Deichrutscher said:
With the actually Price it doesn't get any easier to choose the Grenadier Quartermaster.

An Amarok or a Ford Ranger are lighter, faster (180 km/h, 190km/h for the "Adventura"-Modell) and can carry more.
The Amarok/Ford has a payload of >820kg, the Grenadier as a diesel only 740kg. The engine of the Amarok has 240hp/600Nm, that of the Grenadier 249hp/550Nm.

With the tailgate open, both (Ford and VW) can load two euro pallets in the cargo box (sideways). The Grenadier can only load one pallet (lengthwise) because the space between the wheelhouses is too small. The spare wheel doesn't take up any space on the truck bed (of course you can still put it there - if you're afraid of not being able to get to it off-road). But on road you can use the space for loading.

The turning circle on the Amarok is less than 13m, on the Quartermaster it was about 14m as far as I can remember (the website is currently down, so I can't check 14.07.23 14:50 CEST)

And another point: the Grenadier is more than 20,000€ more expensive with less equipment (On Amarok is included a heated windshield and a auxiliary heating). It is the price for a new Canopy Camper with all options on top!

All have choiced a very bad mounting point for the antenna :-(

Advantages of the Grenadier:
It looks better, should be made more robust (mechanic) and simply has more style.
The decision will be difficult, it is a lot of money !

Very well said and I think that proposition is even more difficult here in the US where our midsize market is deep and diverse.

klarie · Jul 14, 2023

Deichrutscher said:
With the actually Price it doesn't get any easier to choose the Grenadier Quartermaster.

An Amarok or a Ford Ranger are lighter, faster (180 km/h, 190km/h for the "Adventura"-Modell) and can carry more.
The Amarok/Ford has a payload of >820kg, the Grenadier as a diesel only 740kg. The engine of the Amarok has 240hp/600Nm, that of the Grenadier 249hp/550Nm.

With the tailgate open, both (Ford and VW) can load two euro pallets in the cargo box (sideways). The Grenadier can only load one pallet (lengthwise) because the space between the wheelhouses is too small. The spare wheel doesn't take up any space on the truck bed (of course you can still put it there - if you're afraid of not being able to get to it off-road). But on road you can use the space for loading.

The turning circle on the Amarok is less than 13m, on the Quartermaster it was about 14m as far as I can remember (the website is currently down, so I can't check 14.07.23 14:50 CEST)

And another point: the Grenadier is more than 20,000€ more expensive with less equipment (On Amarok is included a heated windshield and a auxiliary heating). It is the price for a new Canopy Camper with all options on top!

All have choiced a very bad mounting point for the antenna :-(

Advantages of the Grenadier:
It looks better, should be made more robust (mechanic) and simply has more style.
The decision will be difficult, it is a lot of money !

Once again. Both, Ford Ranger / or Mazda perhaps.. and the Amarok are quite often used vehicles in Germany for hunting.
However many of the owners I know about gut stuck on crops and mud - because of the insufficent offroad capability and the poor distribution of power. Needed a tractor to get recovered. Yep, there are quite a lot around of these.
To me it seems the boot of the double cab amarok is quite small only the single cab has sufficent space in the rear.
The same appears for Ford Ranger. .. The dual cabs are more lifestyle vehicle.. again another mall crawler - poser vehicle.
The guys doing the fibre wire stuff use indeed dual cab Ford ranger. but in their boot is just a bit of lightweight tools stored.

The defect list of the (diesel) engine is rather high. injectors, driving chain, turbo, - and the 4 motion stuff is not a proper transfer case but a multidisc clutch (in German Lamellenkupplung) Haldex Clutch. .. not even nearly as capable as a proper cog wheeled transfer case. - so not really proper off road / difflock system. No transfercase with H/L . So both rather lifestyle vehicles.

The load capability may be higher in a Ranger or Amarok - but certainly not a serious off-road vehicle. Full Stop.
The Quartermaster may have less load cap but I trust the technology

AdiThorny · Jul 14, 2023

FYI -
My config initial price: £66841
First price increase my config price: £75708 (increase of £8867)
July 2023 increase my config price: £81969 (additional increase of £6261).
Total increase of £15128.
Waiting for rock slider delivery to take posession.

anand · Jul 14, 2023

klarie said:
The Quartermaster may have less load cap but I trust the technology

I'm going to have to go with this....

For the US, the biggest competition will be the Gladiator Rubicon, which technically has a lower payload as well. With that being said though, unlike the rest of the world, the US off-road/aftermarket/overland world doesn't actually care about payload numbers, we overload everything and never look back

Davman · Jul 14, 2023

Deichrutscher said:
With the actually Price it doesn't get any easier to choose the Grenadier Quartermaster.

An Amarok or a Ford Ranger are lighter, faster (180 km/h, 190km/h for the "Adventura"-Modell) and can carry more.
The Amarok/Ford has a payload of >820kg, the Grenadier as a diesel only 740kg. The engine of the Amarok has 240hp/600Nm, that of the Grenadier 249hp/550Nm.

With the tailgate open, both (Ford and VW) can load two euro pallets in the cargo box (sideways). The Grenadier can only load one pallet (lengthwise) because the space between the wheelhouses is too small. The spare wheel doesn't take up any space on the truck bed (of course you can still put it there - if you're afraid of not being able to get to it off-road). But on road you can use the space for loading.

The turning circle on the Amarok is less than 13m, on the Quartermaster it was about 14m as far as I can remember (the website is currently down, so I can't check 14.07.23 14:50 CEST)

And another point: the Grenadier is more than 20,000€ more expensive with less equipment (On Amarok is included a heated windshield and a auxiliary heating). It is the price for a new Canopy Camper with all options on top!

All have choiced a very bad mounting point for the antenna :-(

Advantages of the Grenadier:
It looks better, should be made more robust (mechanic) and simply has more style.
The decision will be difficult, it is a lot of money !

I loved all three of my original Amaroks - they are a strong vehicle, Magna Steyr designed them too.
The new Ranger/Amarok is made of plastic and feels really cheap and nasty.
RIP Amarok.

DaveB · Jul 14, 2023

anand said:
I'm going to have to go with this....

For the US, the biggest competition will be the Gladiator Rubicon, which technically has a lower payload as well. With that being said though, unlike the rest of the world, the US off-road/aftermarket/overland world doesn't actually care about payload numbers, we overload everything and never look back

It's funny how different each of our markets are.
Nobody wants a Gladiator here in Australia
Overloading vehicles is fairly common here but so too are roadside checks.

Police Roadside Caravan Safety Inspections - GoRV

Caravan safety. If you don't take it seriously, ensuring your caravan isn't too heavy for your tow vehicle, you could get fined.

www.gorv.com.au

255/85 · Jul 14, 2023

Deichrutscher said:
Advantages of the Grenadier:
It looks better, should be made more robust (mechanic) and simply has more style.
The decision will be difficult, it is a lot of money !

This is what I've been telling myself.

I'll admit that aesthetics are important to me. Faced with something attractive it becomes very easy to rationalize the need to have it. But some of us don't have that kind of disposable income - to buy for appearances sake and toss away the trinket when we're no longer thrilled. I have to remind my partner of that every so often as she was the one who, upon seeing the very first image of a Grenadier I showed her, said "I'd buy that!".

Unfortunately the "should be more robust" part of @Deichrutscher's equation does not justify the asking price. That's an unknown. It might be but so far we are all going off of Ineos's claim and assertions. Sure, the Grenadier looks the part but that's largely because of it's resemblance, intentional or consequential (as Ineos claims), to vehicles that have earned the moniker of "robust". We recognize the shape and the type of running gear underneath but, truth is, there are really so few of these vehicles on the road and have been put through so few miles at the hands of so few owners that we don't truly know what the problem areas are and if the the vehicle is worth taking on long term.

I hope I can be forgiven her for harping on simplicity and ease of repair. That's not what everyone wants here. I have no choice. I've had to downspec our build to make it less dear but I still have this nagging concern:

Has Ineos proven the asking price value of the Grenadier or should I, for roughly the same money, just buy a Ranger/Tacoma/Whateverlander, wear it out, and buy a second when the time comes? Decisions, decisions...

lightning · Jul 14, 2023

AdiThorny said:
FYI -
My config initial price: £66841
First price increase my config price: £75708 (increase of £8867)
July 2023 increase my config price: £81969 (additional increase of £6261).
Total increase of £15128.
Waiting for rock slider delivery to take posession.

Good grief.
Are lneos honouring your initial price when you placed the order?

Heater · Jul 15, 2023

I’ll be back in a couple of years when IG has it figured out. I canceled my preorder this morning. All the best to you all.

DDG · Jul 15, 2023

Heater said:
I’ll be back in a couple of years when IG has it figured out. I canceled my preorder this morning. All the best to you all.

This is the result of their poorly thought out price hike. At the very least it’s a premature price hike. Capturing the passionate early adopters is such a key to establishing a rabid user base. Good luck to you Heater! Every one of these lost sales is regrettable, I feel.

IG_in_AZ · Jul 15, 2023

ADVAW8S said:
I'll throw this on rumor pile, a Facebook poster from the USA Grenadier group stated he got a call from Ineos confirming his order so they can send it to production.

Not buying that one.

Steve.B · Jul 15, 2023

Deichrutscher said:
With the actually Price it doesn't get any easier to choose the Grenadier Quartermaster.

An Amarok or a Ford Ranger are lighter, faster (180 km/h, 190km/h for the "Adventura"-Modell) and can carry more.
The Amarok/Ford has a payload of >820kg, the Grenadier as a diesel only 740kg. The engine of the Amarok has 240hp/600Nm, that of the Grenadier 249hp/550Nm.

With the tailgate open, both (Ford and VW) can load two euro pallets in the cargo box (sideways). The Grenadier can only load one pallet (lengthwise) because the space between the wheelhouses is too small. The spare wheel doesn't take up any space on the truck bed (of course you can still put it there - if you're afraid of not being able to get to it off-road). But on road you can use the space for loading.

The turning circle on the Amarok is less than 13m, on the Quartermaster it was about 14m as far as I can remember (the website is currently down, so I can't check 14.07.23 14:50 CEST)

And another point: the Grenadier is more than 20,000€ more expensive with less equipment (On Amarok is included a heated windshield and a auxiliary heating). It is the price for a new Canopy Camper with all options on top!

All have choiced a very bad mounting point for the antenna :-(

Advantages of the Grenadier:
It looks better, should be made more robust (mechanic) and simply has more style.
The decision will be difficult, it is a lot of money !

The old 2H V6 Amarok is a fantastic vehicle, and the manual was dual range with a 51 to 1 first low. The new one, a Ford Ranger in drag, along with the Ford Ranger are cheap and flimsy in comparison, with that fragile Ford lion motor, plus the shocking transmission failure rate in the previous generation Ford Ranger should make anyone think twice.
Ford tries its best to copy ZF transmissions but seems to get it wrong.
I don't think the quartermaster has any competition from them as they are completely different vehicles, and anyone cross shopping with a Ford Ranger are looking at 2 completely different vehicles.

Sam · Jul 15, 2023

FWIW I think this is more properly a price correction, not a hike.

I’m not cynical … and think that Ineos haven’t properly understood/ finalised their cost base for the vehicle until now, that is all.

A sweetener for those who got in early,
but are now doing Ineos’ R&D

klarie · Jul 15, 2023

Davman said:
I loved all three of my original Amaroks - they are a strong vehicle, Magna Steyr designed them too.
The new Ranger/Amarok is made of plastic and feels really cheap and nasty.
RIP Amarok.

That seems to be the case with many brands.. the quality and features sometimes degrade over time.. once a vehicle is established and got a reputation they try and remarket the name and put in simpler cheaper ingredients.. customer think it’s still the same.
This brings me from Amarok to New Defender.. what kind of 4WD system is built in there.. I can’t read anything about a transfer case that has H/L lever.
Any idea .. any link where I can find the details. the brochures and configuring one online do not expose how the 4 WD system in a new Defender work
I fear this is more or less a Haldex or similar to the torque vectoring system in mine. Not bad but it’s not like a proper transfer case.

Deichrutscher · Jul 15, 2023

Steve.B said:
The old 2H V6 Amarok is a fantastic vehicle, and the manual was dual range with a 51 to 1 first low. The new one, a Ford Ranger in drag, along with the Ford Ranger are cheap and flimsy in comparison, with that fragile Ford lion motor, plus the shocking transmission failure rate in the previous generation Ford Ranger should make anyone think twice.
Ford tries its best to copy ZF transmissions but seems to get it wrong.
I don't think the quartermaster has any competition from them as they are completely different vehicles, and anyone cross shopping with a Ford Ranger are looking at 2 completely different vehicles.

The 2H 4Cyl. is good to, but my car is now 9 years old (and have about 150TKm) and i will change it in the next few years. So i am still looking for a new car (Quartermaster is the option).
The ZF transmission on my car (also an 8HP, but 8HP45) was broken, so i had to change it at km 130000), i have replaced it with a used one. We have disasambled the old one, but we did not find the reason. It could be that only the torque converter has a fault, but i had not a look into this (is welded all around).
A advantage od the 4Cyl: no Add Blue

lightning · Jul 15, 2023

In my opinion the Grenadier is now too expensive.
A start price of £65,000 puts it out of reach of "normal" people like me.

l still love the vehicle and would probably still consider one, if it was classed as
"Commercial" by HMRC in the U.K. which means l could put it through my company.
As it is, it would be a £70,000 van that l could only charge mileage at 45p per mile.

Wile E Coyote · Jul 15, 2023

So does anyone know at what point they stop making the 23yr model and start making the 24yr model? If we are still awaiting a contract and our build month is still moving away from us, is there a chance Ineos might start building the new model and that is what we end up with?

bigleonski · Jul 15, 2023

Wile E Coyote said:
So does anyone know at what point they stop making the 23yr model and start making the 24yr model? If we are still awaiting a contract and our build month is still moving away from us, is there a chance Ineos might start building the new model and that is what we end up with?

What I’d love to know is what other changes might have been made other than sound, inverter driving aids to the 23 model. Ie. If you put them side by side and ignore the above, do they look or have they been built differently?

lightning · Jul 15, 2023

There's no doubt that the MY24 will have improvements so l would consider it an advantage to get one of those.

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